Naw ... not even her!
Fine Female Acquaintance: You know its just so hard to find a good man.
SBM: *heavy sigh* Why do you say that?
FA: It’s just hard to find a guy who just isn’t intimidated by me.
SBM: You out here hitting reggins (backwards) in the throat?
FA: *blank stare* No …
SBM: You out here backhanding these simps and sending them to sleep on the cough?
FA: Uhhhh … No …
SBM: Then do enlighten me as to how you are intimidating all these “I’ll kill you if you step on my white on whites” type of reggins running these streets?
FA: I’m successful
SBM: Interesting. How do you know they are intimidated?
FA: They aren’t trying to wife me.
SBM: *laughing inside* Maybe they aren’t scared … maybe … just maybe … its something else
Yes people … I am hear to break the fallacy that all men are intimidated by strong or successful women.
For the vast majority of non-simping a$$ successful black men … this is just bullsh*t.
Now, let us enter the mind of your average male. We strive daily to give you a peak, but today go ahead and dust your shoes off as we go on a stroll through the male mind and see what its up do. Ignore all the graphic chexual content on the walls, floors, blasting over the intercom, on the TVs, etc. That only comes up every 8-10 minutes.
Woman: “I am really focused on my career and becoming a managing partner at my firm.”
Male Thought: “This chic aint trying to cook for me if we get married.”
Woman: “I bought this 3 bedroom single family house on my own because I had the money too. When I meet the right man, we’ll have a nice home to start in.”
Male Thought: “How has she planned what her husband is doing and where he is moving before meeting him?”
Woman: “I am willing to let a man take control … when I deem he is ready. And if he slips up and makes a decision I see bad, I will let him know. But I want to be lead by a man.”
Male Thought: “This b* outta her mind. How is that giving him control when you can veto him and you have to ‘deem’ him ready? Sound like a manager at a job, not a loving wife.”
Woman: “I am perfectly capable of paying for everything I want on my own … I just want my man to want to take care of me.”
Male Thought: “She sure seems hellbent on proving to me and every other man she can do things on her own. I feel like an accessory instead of a needed part of her life.”
Basically … we aren’t scared (cue Bone Crusher). We are not afraid of you. We … men … do not see this strong woman as something to be feared or that will threaten our manhood … we just think you will f*ing slum as a loving wife, girlfriend, or life partner.
Yeah … I said it.
A lot of the characteristics and personalities that make you “strong and independent” are also signs that you will not be able to lend us the support that we need. We need a cheerleader … not a coach. No man wants to have his decisions and actions critiqued by his manager and boss, to have his loving wife explain why she is taking back control. As soon as we realize this and end any relationship hopes, we are labeled as intimidated.
There is a balance that can be reached, but I see so many women fail at. I can often ask no more than 4 questions and figure out they are not giving up the control they claim they are. They are attempting to wear their work pants into the bedroom … and we don’t like that.
This does not apply to all men. Them reggins with no job, money, or house of there own may very well be intimidated.
But really … strong women aren’t looking for them, so don’t even think about that.
I know many of the women won’t agree. I know many of you who self identify as “strong” will continue to cry “these men out here just can’t handle me”. I pray for you. Take a second and think about this? Don’t I raise some good points? Has any remotely successful actually said “you intimidate me”, or was it just your girlfriends?
Men, am i right? Is it just me? Am I alone in not being shook by a woman with a 6 figure salary?
SBM aka Only God intimidates me aka “Take of my pants and let go of those reigns”
P.S.: I’m not saying women don’t scare men. It is possible she can be so perfect, that we get scared that we might actually have to settle down and stop running the streets … but that ain’t intimidation … recognize.
What does this mean? That a woman shouldn't have career ambitions, but instead should go to cookery school so she is wife material? Or in conversation, we should downplay our career in favour of 'I'm planning to have 10 children'?
Does it also mean she shouldn't make wise investments?
In my opinion, most men will judge a woman not for what she says, but what they believe she means by saying it. I have a fantastic career, but at the same time, cook for my boo, but men just like you SBM, assume that a woman with a career doesn't cook!
I am planning to buy a house soon, and no, it won't be our home when we get married, but as soon as I mention that I'm planning to take a mortgage, men like you SBM, read 'she doesn't need me'.
Thing is, you can't go shouting at every Tom Dick and Harry how you cook for your future man, and what I say is a man's got to be man enough to get over his misconceptions and stereotypes as far as the independent woman is concerned, and get to know the real woman.
Kels: “What does this mean? That a woman shouldn’t have career ambitions, but instead should go to cookery school so she is wife material? Or in conversation, we should downplay our career in favour of ‘I’m planning to have 10 children’?”
It’s an unfortunate catch-22 for women, but in the eyes of successful men, you love your career more than them. It’s not about the money, especially to a man that has money. If a man is looking for a woman to settle down with, and you are working 60-hour work weeks, where’s the time for him? Where’s the time for the future children? Even if he was impressed by your career and salary, suddenly the ability to buy your own Fendi bags doesn’t mean so much to him.
So does he now ask you to cut back at work? How well would that go over? That woman who teaches Pilates and Body Attack at Gold’s Gym suddenly looks like a more compatible partner. I said this before: if you want a functioning team, only one person can play quarterback.
Hugh … you said it better than me.
No one is saying you shouldn't have aspirations, but a 100 hour work week for the wife equates to a unsatisfied husband and neglected children. It's not impossible to have both … but time is finite. Have to give someone/something one less hour to give it to someone/something else.
"It’s an unfortunate catch-22 for women, but in the eyes of successful men, you love your career more than them."
It's a huge catch-22, because 9.5 times outta 10, the woman is overly-ambitious with the assumption that she may just be doing things on her own anyway. Then when lands a man, she doesn't want to necessarily give up on what she has worked so hard for just so she can rock the "perfect wife apron", so to speak.
I agree completely with you too Hugh and I am a 'successful/ambitious young woman.' My mother was too, but she realized the importance of taking care of her family as well so she did make some sacrifices to be able to take care of us kids and our pops and raise in my opinion positively contributing citizens to society. Now that we're all grown, she's back to her career and she has been blessed with more opportunities than she ever imagined. I appreciate so much her ability and choice to slow down her stride as far as her career went while we were young and needed her. I understand it so much more now that I'm in a position that I could meet Mr. Right any day now. It's from her example that I am working from and as far as i'm concerned–momma got it right.
This is why you are a jackass.
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/wander-woman/…
NUFF SAID.
Kell,
The number of women who seek emotional compatibility is a whisper in a howling wind, compared to the women who seek a man who can lead ( read that as having financial means) in time the ideology outline in the link that you provided will be norm ( say 50 years from now) but right now this blog is spot on!
I have dated that independent woman as my dude said many OFTEN SUCK AS A GIRLFRIEND! So why the hell would I marry one knowing going in things will more than likely get worse, not better!
Why is it okay for a man to be a workaholic, but a woman has to make it a secret that she pays her own bills? I think it's sad that a *balanced* relationship is such a threat to having a relationship at all with men. I mean really, what is a "good" girlfriend? Why is it okay for a man to be a workaholic and married, but a woman has to chose between liking her job and having a relationship??
What is really ignorant about this attitude is that if fails to acknowledge that black women have ALWAYS had to work in this country. Men forcing them to pretend they don't is just insane, given the way history has run. I mean, seriously, name a decade when black women didn't *have* to work outside the home…I'll wait. Why not just appreciate that that is part of the fabric of who we are? And that yes, at many points, it has CARRIED the community.
Aren't y'all just imitating white relationships with this junk??? It is just absurd and selfish to expect the same coddling from a black woman that would come out of white culture, where even many *poor* white women would have had nothing better to do than fix you dinner because they were kept at home all day, while black women were out in the back watching their kids and washing their clothes (when they weren't in the field next to black men, picking cotton…and having babies IN THE FIELD and going right back to work on the next row). Try to remember that us getting ahead more frequently nowadays is to YOUR ADVANTAGE. Put your ego aside and try to pretend we're on the same team. I mean, C'MON SON!
Why do you find it acceptable to wait 50 years? There are plenty of people who think this way now! I think, just like those old black folks who believed Obama "couldn't get elected", men who perpetuate this sort of nonsense are the ones who are holding things back. Stop putting women in the catch-22 and start looking for a catch for YOU. (And speaking of Obama, it sounds like nobody who agrees with this post would have even tried to date Michelle! That alone confirms how dumb this ish is.)
Honestly, I don't think anyone is much of a man if a woman has to "lower" herself by diminshing her own light just to get next to him. That's sad. I say, MAN UP.
Ohhhh! I like these kinds of blogs! I like them because sometimes I can easily see me in some aspect of them.. I also like them because I just like to see what different people think about these topics… and I like to play the 'what if' game… SO- I want to reference one particular portion of this blog…
WHAT IF:
Woman: “I am really focused on my career and becoming a managing partner at my firm.”
Male Thought: “This chic aint trying to cook for me if we get married.”
~~~ What if she is just that bad of a chic where she REALLY CAN manage the career and the cooking? WHAT IF she trusts that the man is supportive of her career drive and trusts that he would SHARE in the responsibilities of the house hold work… (cooking and cleaning)…NOT take over, not do it alone…but SHARE…it would be a shared relationship..why not SHARE the relationship in all facets… we share bringing money in, we share household stuff… we share- PERIOD… **shrugging** WHAT IF she likes big ass FANCY stuff that she realizes that he can't really afford to get for her with out struggling financially? Why not encourage her to go on and make that money… it would benifit the both of you, right? How? By not taking away from the money needed for bills and living, and still havign that fun money that she can get those Louis Vuitton and get you the blah blah blah that you'd like also?
Woman: “I bought this 3 bedroom single family house on my own because I had the money too. When I meet the right man, we’ll have a nice home to start in.”
Male Thought: “How has she planned what her husband is doing and where he is moving before meeting him?”
~~~WHAT if she is flexible on the meeting the husband and moving into that house…WHAT IF she'd be perfectly okay with going to where that man has things established. WHAT IF the man she meets and falls in love with…and marries is living with a roommate because he is trying to save up for the house…WHY NOT let that man come to THAT house that she already has…to START OUT IN and he continues to save up or what not to get them that other house?
Woman: “I am willing to let a man take control … when I deem he is ready. And if he slips up and makes a decision I see bad, I will let him know. But I want to be lead by a man.”
Male Thought: “This b* outta her mind. How is that giving him control when you can veto him and you have to ‘deem’ him ready? Sound like a manager at a job, not a loving wife.”
~~~What if she loves the guy…sees the potential in him and wants to stick around to try to encourage him to be the man that she thinks she sees? Would it be wise to let him 'lead' if he's not ready? Granted, I think he'd need to prove he was 'ready to lead' before I was deeply involved… but… LOL that's just me. What if he does start trippin… she can't let him know? what ever happened to being honest and truthful with each other… if she doesn't like what he's doing is she just supposed to sit idly by and watch him self destruct or destroy the relationship with foolishness… or should she speak up and say, 'babe…we need to talk… X, Y, Z is going on and I just dont' think it's right…blah blah blah."
Woman: “I am perfectly capable of paying for everything I want on my own … I just want my man to want to take care of me.”
Male Thought: “She sure seems hellbent on proving to me and every other man she can do things on her own. I feel like an accessory instead of a needed part of her life.”
~~~what if you ARE needed, just not neccessarily in the financial relm? What IF you are needed for that OTHER part of life that sometimes people forget because MONEY clouds the fact that companionship, love, and romance are too a very important part of a relationship. There are a lot of us who can afford to get the material things we want on our own… I dont' think we (well, a lot of us) boast about it, or throw it in the guy's face… Personally, I just would like to know that I wouldn't CONSTANTLY have to dig in my pocket to ALWAYS take care of both of us..(UNLESS something was going on outside of your control- sick, injured, between jobs for brief moment…etc… BUT lazy or that other mess… nope- not paying for you) WHAT if by saying that… all she is saying is that, 'I don't need you for you money… I don't care if you don't make what I make.. it's okay..just love me… that's all..just love me, hold me… want me…'?
Basically … we aren’t scared (cue Bone Crusher). We are not afraid of you. We … men … do not see this strong woman as something to be feared or that will threaten our manhood … we just think you will f*ing slum as a loving wife, girlfriend, or life partner.
~~~ and this… well I disagree LOL. (I do agree that not all guys are intimidated by 'successful women', but by the same token…I do think that there are some guys out there who ARE a bit nervous around successful women… ) Just because a woman can do for her self doesn't mean that she will be a horrible girlfriend, or wife, or life partner. IT COULD just mean that she's good on her own, but wants to be BETTER with that other part of 'relationship stuff'… like the love…
WHAT if this 'successful woman' thing is simply a way to say… all I need is YOU… that's all.. just YOU..not your job, not your car, not your house..just YOU!
Welcome and nice post!
*Yes, I just designated myself the welcome committee*
LOL. I officially sanction your welcome committee.
That's a lot of what ifs. And almost all of them require me "as the interviewer for my future wife" to go against a lot of anecdotal evidence and pre-programmed thoughts in order to ignore these statements that scream "I want to be co-husband".
Harvard could assume someone with a 1.5 GPA and poor record would make a great addition to their school (and they really might) … but history shows that they probably won't.
biggups.
Shots fired! LOL Liove it! I aint mad at you playboy!
I think this is on point. In any relationship you have to know how to be a leader and a follower too We all talk bout gender roles. Well men like that support only a woman can offer at times too
*points pistol in the air*
Buk buk buk buk
All I am hearing (reading) here is that there are a hell of a lot of people making assumptions out there. Some women are assuming that men are intimidated by their success, and most men are assuming that because a woman is holding down her own, she wouldn't make a good wifey. We all know what they say about assumptions.
I agree! We've gotta stop assuming things about the opposite sex. That's the issue.
way to go girl…. I like how you see through the B.S.
SaneN fo Congress '10
While I am no real fan of assumptions, there is simply no way to live without them.
And these aren't 100% assumptions, they are deductions with imperfect information.
Can't speak for everyone, but when I meet someone who is really keen on letting me know that "she has her own", I can't help but think "does she really need me?" I will attempt to determine as hard as possible the truth and if I am justified in my thinking, but since I can't read her mind I must make a decision (an assumption of sorts) and act accordingly.
Fact is … we can't just walk around assuming the best. That is still an assumption.
That may be true, but in the end, it is still an assumption until you make a real effort to find out what the truth is. The way I see it, you have to give a person a chance to find out what that truth is. Once you actually get to know a person (even if it's just as friends at first), you at the very least have a little more foundation for your assumptions and/or you can just come out and ask questions that will help you determine if they are going to make a good wife.
Thank you CHeeKZy, but I'm a little busy being the welcome committee
But how much time and effort should I spend to look past what I see from the outside.
Yes, ideally every man should take the time to see if this woman has the capacity to handle a 60 hour work week and keep her SO happy. But in the real world its just not possible.
Again … not saying it's right for us to do it … not saying its wrong … but saying this is what happens … a lot!
The same amount of time you would give to any potential partner. Just take the time to get to know the person like any other person you would date. If at some point, you know that your previous assumptions are probably right, keep it moving. I don't see why that's so hard.
I agree with the comment from earlier. If a woman is financially dependent that is a great thing. That is not to be intimidated or for a man to back off because he doesnt feel needed. Like one stated earlier, there are much more levels a relationship has to carry over that are not even related to money. I also agree that women that are career oriented can also be great wives and mothers at the same time. I am very career and goal oriented, but at the same time– I love cooking, cleaning, and taking care of those I love. (although I am a sbw) But none the less, note to those women who believe they are so intimidating–don't show your paycheck to the guy your interested in, and if you think he would be scared of your bank account and big pants, then just show the laid back you– not the you going in for an interview.. if it doesnt work- NEXT
*high five*
I mean, come on, if a woman is that dayum ambitious, why can't she multitask? If she was able to multitask her job with her outside life in order to get where she is at work, what makes you think this superwoman can't also juggle a dayum man?
Not saying it's not possible … just trying to explain how a lot of us are thinking.
Just like a lot of women aren't willing to take the time to look past a man's current situation in order to take the time to assess if he has the potential to be great … we got time constraints too.
Not saying its right or wrong … but I am saying it is.
Cheekie: "I mean, come on, if a woman is that dayum ambitious, why can’t she multitask? If she was able to multitask her job with her outside life in order to get where she is at work, what makes you think this superwoman can’t also juggle a dayum man?"
Because time is finite. Just because she can multitask so she can fit in her domestic and professional obligations to satisfy her doesn't mean it satisfies her husband or potential children.
"Because time is finite. Just because she can multitask so she can fit in her domestic and professional obligations to satisfy her doesn’t mean it satisfies her husband or potential children."
Okay, good point, but if she can't find the time, where does "provider" (his ideal role) husband find time? I'd think she'd be able to find the time the same place the husband (who wants more time with her) would. I mean, this is of course assuming they don't have conflicting schedules and/or they both work the same routine "(-5" job.
@Cheekie
Isn't this part of the issue? The wife trying to do things like the husband?
How the male counterpart handles the personal life vs work tradeoff is a very different beast. If a woman approaches allocating her life and time the same way that men are expected to … you're setting yourself up for a co-husband position.
@SBM – "Isn’t this part of the issue? The wife trying to do things like the husband?"
Well, I was just talking about financially. Which is what some women say intimidates men. Their job. These days, it's not "like the husband" to have a good job. It's "like a grown-up". Folks gotta have two-income households these days, as you know I'm sure. My thing is, if she's super successful, why does that erase her ability to be home for her hubby if HIS job doesn't erase his ability to be home with her? I mean, he is the one supposedly wanting her to be home more often to do wifely duties.
uhm, anybody heard of hiring a maid to do cleaning or to help ot or something especially if you have the money, why not?i'm just sayin
Welcome, glad to have ya! (This is turning out to be an exhausting committee. Can we have a less interesting post tomorrow? LOL)
I personally don't feel I'd need a maid, unless I have a huge house, there is just no need for all that. If I am literally working so much that I don't have time to spend with my family and clean and/or cook, then there is a bigger problem anyways. Especially if my SO were sharing in these duties at least a little bit and at the very least helping to minimize the mess.
Plus, I'm cheap. Why pay someone to do something that I am more than capable of doing, something that we as a couple would be more than capable of accomplishing together?
Co-sign on the house help!
I don't believe men are intimidated as much as they just misunderstand/buy into the negative hype about independent women. Not all of us are the neck rolling "I don't need no man" mantra chanting chicks that we're often portrayed to be…Understand that a lot of times the reasons we have HAD to become the strong independent woman is because a seemingly good man let us down and the responsibility of the family or our own personal care now rests squarely on our shoulders. So what is wrong with us making sure that we are stable while we are waiting for that right one and being more careful in determining the worthiness of the next one.
@ Woman: “I am really focused on my career and becoming a managing partner at my firm.”
Male Thought: “This chic aint trying to cook for me if we get married.”
This is not an either or – we (women) can do BOTH, it's just a matter of finding the one who wants to do it. There are just as many girls who work 8-4 in the call center at the local phone company who won't wanna cook for you either.
@ Woman: “I am willing to let a man take control … when I deem he is ready. And if he slips up and makes a decision I see bad, I will let him know. But I want to be lead by a man.”
Male Thought: “This b* outta her mind. How is that giving him control when you can veto him and you have to ‘deem’ him ready? Sound like a manager at a job, not a loving wife.”
Her words are not unreasonable, but I do see both sides as valid – think about it, the same way she has to prove herself worthy of being a wife, he must prove himself worthy of being a husband who can lead effectively – it would be stupid to follow any man before you know for sure if he is worthy. Also if he is truly making bad decisions (I'm not just talking one minor bad decision either) how far astray is a woman supposed to go/follow/be dragged by a man before she stops following and gets back on path
@ Woman: “I am perfectly capable of paying for everything I want on my own … I just want my man to want to take care of me.”
Male Thought: “She sure seems hellbent on proving to me and every other man she can do things on her own. I feel like an accessory instead of a needed part of her life.”
I agree these things shouldn't be thrown in anyone's face but is it really that important for her to "need" you? What do we mean by "need"? Is it an ego thing, are we talking "if you leave my life will fall apart" need or are we just talking about someone who "wants" you to be a part of her life? I personally don't want anyone (besides my children) to "need" me – that's just burdensome – but maybe men feel differently about being needed…?
Heeyyy …that's pretty much what I said… umm hmm… so I wasn't crazy!
Nope, you ain' crazy!
Great Minds.
This post was hard to write because I didn't want to go on for days explaining all the exceptions to the rule and the fact that some of these women are still perfectly capable of being both strong and independent and loving and caring.
But … I gotta speak to the reality of it all. When interviewing someone for the wifey position, these things stick out in the interview and are negative points on the resume.
I understand that someone with little experience and admits to a drug habit in an interview, but has a lot of drive might make a great CEO, but I doubt I'll be the one to hire him based on that.
Me make assumptions off the information we are presented.
In terms of career, here's how convos happen in my experience…
Him: So what do you do?
Me: I'm a scientist
Him: Cool, where do you work?
Me: Harvard
Him: Oh. Dang. Well I'm *just* a [fill int he blank]. It was nice talking to you. You go girl!
Sure, intimidation might be the wrong word. It's more like shame (about not being in a similar place when he thinks he ought to be) and resentment (seeing a woman holding a position that most folks think a man should have). I've found that half-lying and saying that I'm a high school Biology teacher usually allows the convo to continue.
See … I'm not sure the guys your talking to fall into this "good" or "successful" category. As I mentioned, if he is still living in his Mama's basement, then he may legitimately be intimidated, but I doubt some BU grad student, even if he is studying Sociology, is about to be afraid of that.
If you start saying "I work 90 hours a week and travel 3 days out the week" … then he might have the legitimate concern that I spoke of.
Welcome?!?
Jam Donaldson handled this a while ago on her site(conversateisnotaword). Basically her point was that if not for the reasons above, the "intimidation" argument is basically a defense mechanism for other issues completely unrelated to work and career life.
cosign this.
probably will speak on this more in the morning, but
a lot of guys want to provide, and protect…if our only purpose is companionship…why not just chill with your female friends/guy friends?
Thank you for your co-sign.
It was dully appreciated.
Thank You Thank You…you could not have said it better. Ladies all he is saying is you can excel in your career and still be a lady at home…real men will understand the balance and respect it. You have to let a man be a man there is no other way to cut it. Equal responsibilities at home however you have to be willing to give up that control factor that got you to the top at work. I know a husband wife couple that has been together for 27yrs and she does not do any of the houshold duties ie cook wash clothes he does and they are both full time professionals. However she is always letting her husband know and feel like the man superior protective and supportive. So ladies no he is not asking you to get out the boardroom and in the kitchen he is simply saying I am your man not your subordiante. That's all folks
100% co-sign.
Women like this expect men to be turned on by the fact that they are successful or own a house or want to run things. But I just don't think those are selling points in a man's eyes. That's not to say that a woman should downplay her accomplishments or strive for nothing more than to be wifed, but there has to be a balance and most a lot of women don't know how to achieve that.
As I was reading the comments, I was afraid that no woman felt me on this.
And thanks for pointing out that I am not telling women to dumb themselves down or stunt their career. There is just a healthy amount out there treating their man like an entry-level employee rather than their rock.
Wait, did I miss one? Welcome!?!
I think the only issue I took with the post is not that SBM is saying anything about a woman knowing how to be a woman, but more that men are reading into statements made and taking what they want out of it. Other than that, I 100% agree.
while I whole heartly cosign this…
I don't know if I got that from the original post. Maybe I read it wrong or something. But when I read the original post (and I will read it again to see if I misread or took somethign wrong way)… but when I read it, I got this message: Men don't really care to appreciate a successful woman because he doesnt' think he can be THE MAN with her. Men don't want to take time to learn what's behind the successful woman because he bases her whole persona on a 'I'm intelligent and gainfully employed' statement.
My parents have been married for 33 years. Both parents have always worked day in day out. There were some days that my mom would have my sister and I at piano practice, dance rehearsal, choir, bball, softball practice and what not… when we got home Daddy would have dinner made (GRANTED it was grits and bacon and eggs LOL) but it was dinner because moma was tired. Some days daddy would be late coming from work and moma would of course have dinner made. Some days moma would at least start mowing the lawn… some days daddy was sweeping and mopping… it all works out… The fact that my dad cooked dinner didn't take away from his 'manhood'. The fac that daddy washed dishes, did laundry, swept, mopped didnt' take away from his manhood either. My mom mowing the lawn, washing the car didn't put my dad in a position to feel less of a man… My parent's SHARED FAMILY responsibilities where it was needed. Maybe that's why I see 'head of household' a bit differently than what I THINK I'm gathering some of you guys see it. I TOTALLY agree that Man and Woman aren't equal- 100%! BUT when it comes to the whole head of household or 'man of the house', I just think it's more than, 'woman you cook, man I work.. woman you have babies… man I take out trash'.
I wonder, can some man please enlighten me on what kind of woman would peak your interest. It seems to me that sometimes you guys may be TOO hard to please (LOL). We can't be successful or ya'll won't want us because you don't think you can be 'the man'. We can't be jobless because then we're 'gold diggers'. We can't be mothers because now we're 'washed up hoes' (okay- LOL maybe that was a stretch, but I HAVE heard that before..). We can't merely be factory workers or what not, because we won't 'fit in with your high society co-workers/friends'. What is that you men want?
Interesting…..
I will return.
Agreed – I haven't had my coffee yet.
@Karmella Never Ever dumb it down just wait for the one who can accentuate…
Without having read nary other comment, I blame Essence. Somewhere in the late 80's or early 90's they started pushing this whole intimidation thing down Black women's throats. Many of us swallowed, hard. But the real truth involves exactly what you said above. And yes, it pains me to agree. LOL But I've said the same things to some of my friends. What makes you successful at work is making you unsuccessful in relationships. They don't listen.
What essence should have been reminding women is that men aren't looking for providers. That is, real normal men are not. So a woman who has a fancy car and big house means nothing to a real adult man. The magazine should have been telling women that sometimes the man just doesn't want them just like they don't want all men. Or hell, sometimes you just look like a swamp donkey and the man can't see himself having chex with you.
BTW, I've found that the brand of advice you just dispensed goes largely ignored. Why? Because they know everything. They're lawyers, doctors, Indian Chiefs, and business owners–right? They have to already know everything. Furthermore, being those things is so much a part of the definition of who and what they are, the notion of making adjustments strikes at the core of what they believe they are–a catch.
. I've read the comments for this blog post and you're right Ms. Smart, the advice given on this subject (and others) so far has gone largely ignored.
So I'll reiterate it: Ladies, men are NOT looking for providers, PERIOD! I've found too that they're not looking for someone to make decisions for them either.
I also think the women's empowerment movement has gone way left. A lot of women think taking control and emasculating men balances the gender inequality scales. What makes that so silly is this mentality is used often on men who aren't sexist. That just doesn't make sense.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with making a man feel needed and it can be done without downplaying our accomplishments. Its time to leave our management and decision making skills at work. It won't make us dumb, abused or unaccomplished.
Okay I have been lurking on here for over six months and have yet to say anything. But I had to speak. I totally agree with Lady Jax. Alot of the independent "i can do it my dayum self" speech is used on men who are well aware of that fact. I am really learning what it is to be a help meet in a relationship. I want a man who can be the head of our relationship and family. A wife is supposed to be a helpmate to her husband and her husband is supposed to lead her and their family unit. Helpmate does NOT mean dumbing yourself down or not pursuing your goals. I can still be everything I want while being a supportive partner and woman to my husband.
I have really had to retrain myself on what it means to let him handle it. The guy I am currently dating has really opened my eyes. He told me that he knows that I can do it myself, but I need to work on being a better follower. I was shocked. I had never realized that I wasn't allowing him to be a man. He used to have to tell me "stop", "no", "let me get it" all the time. I think part of that is from my strong woman upbringing and part of that is from dating TOO many sorry a$# ninjas who aren't strong men. Yes I will let the man lead, but ladies we have to be responsible for allowing the right one to do so.
A tear rolled down my eye just now.
I'm not going to lie, I thought your support was one that I figured I wouldn't get.
Thank you for feeling the core of it and seeing one of the core things that men look for, and one of the main things that turns us off.
Any man who can provide wants to in some capacity. They don't want to be told that one of the key things in life they can do is unneeded.
I'm gonna go tell Essence to "stop it".
Pass me a tissue…that was aight.
HOT DAMN I liked that! Co-sign. Mehn, i'm loving this blog today and the reader comments-props
Well, I have had guys tell me – after getting to know me – that they were initially intimidated by me, simply because I was pursuing a PhD. I laugh when they tell me that! Some men need to stop generalizing. I think a lot of guys have a stereotypical view of an "overly educated woman".
These guys are always surprised that I love to cook and bake, and that I'm quite domestic. The funny part is, there are women out there who aren't "educated" but they don't have the slightest clue of what it takes to be a woman.
The point I'm trying to make is that both genders need to stop generalizing the other.
Ciao!
This right here!
Both genders need to stop generalizing, civil wars in Africa need to end, and murders should be no more.
I completely agree and some guys do take it too far with the deducing. Just because you are pursuing a PhD doesn't mean you fall into the stereotype, but just as living at your Mom's doesn't mean you will never "make it".
As long as we live in a world of imperfect information, sadly … it's gonna be like this for a while.
Well said.
I think that so many black women have been shown by our single mothers and our surroundings that we've got to go out and do it for ourselves. What that turns into is not being willing to yield to a man because you've done so much on your own. Not to say that women should become a peon to a man in a relationship but there should be some submission (yes I know some of you shudder at that word) in a relationship and a lot of black women just ain't down for that.
I don't think that successful black men are intimidated by successful black women but I do think that they don't want to deal with that attitude of entitlement, unwillingness to bend, and need to be in control that many of these women display.
Church!
intimidation code word for i cant keep a man. Something happened between the 80's and now in which women think that the things that they like in a man men should like in them??????? Thats like a man saying " Say girl i cant provide protect change a tire or any of that but I can make a mean cupcake and you women are just intimidated by my culinary skills!. Do you see how crazy that sounds?
The next step is that women start comparing cl*t sizes and talking about "giving it to him good".
I completely agree that this fallacy is running rampant. Why would a woman think that their ability to do what I do is attractive?
Uuuum, I hate to admit it, but I've actually heard women comparing cl*t sizes. SMH
Also, I'm not 100% sure if you're a new poster, but welcome and sh*t.*
*This post seems to have garnered a lot of new commenters.
That is the most hilarious isht i've heard all day. It DOES sound hella stupid when u put it like that though. smh. But I will say that I think some men think its sexy when a female CAN at least check her own damn engine oil and top up, just as some females find it sexy when a man can whip up a mean meal. lol. Just saying, not taking away from your original comment which still trips me up.
My random thoughts….
- I think that these women tend to fall into one of 2 categories: those who believe men are intimidated by their success, and those who believe men are intimidated by their looks. And the rare bird who believes both.
– Most of the time this is just smoke we blow up our own behinds. But we know it.
- Sometimes it's true, though. A few of your brethren have gotten shook when making the transition from hoodrats/5-star chicks to grown women.
- On cooking: I see waaay more lawn services than Molly Maid's in my neighborhood, which leads me to think that men have no problem outsourcing. What's good for the goose….
- I disagree that men need a cheerleader not a coach. Men need a cheerleader AND a coach, along with a Counselor, a Chex Therapist, a Chef, a Maid…..and trust, women need you to be a laundry list of characters as well.
I agree.
I'm just gonna go thru and read the comments today. I feel like I've responded on this before..and I am exhausted on the topic….
I don't think any man really needs a Coach.
I can agree on a counselor, a career adviser, or just someone to provide guidance … but not a coach.
A coach "knows best" always, isn't questioned, and leads through intimidation, assumed leadership, and other things.
You see Varsity Blues … I don't want that as a wife!!!
A good coach also knows the strength of his players and maximizes it. And because of this…he SHOULD know what is best…but he doesn't know what is best ALWAYS…which is where the assistant coaches come into play.
Behind every good man/woman there is a good woman/man. You have to have someone in your corner to bounce ideas off of that truly has your best interests at heart.
…I would like to comment on the photo. I am intimidated by her! yowza!
LMFAO. Me too! Like…why wouldn't a person-male or female be scu'rd of a chick looking like that….are we sure she is a HER? lol
It has been my experience that men that have their ish together are not intimidated by women that do as well.
I agree with Anna…women that find it difficult to maintain relationships tend to use that as an excuse…a type of coping mechanism for their inadequacies in the love arena.
People will tell you what your flaws are…and if you are an involuntary serial dater by default, more than likely you've heard them several times yet fail to accept responsibility as well as fail to take corrective measures. In these instances, "Men are just intimidated by my success" really translates to: "Men are turned off by my mightier-than-thou-disposition"
And I was really afraid today that I wouldn't be understood at all.
Silly me …
lol…yes silly you SBM.
Ms. Smart: ” What essence should have been reminding women is that men aren’t looking for providers. That is, real normal men are not. So a woman who has a fancy car and big house means nothing to a real adult man. The magazine should have been telling women that sometimes the man just doesn’t want them just like they don’t want all men. Or hell, sometimes you just look like a swamp donkey and the man can’t see himself having chex with you.”
I was going to write a response, then read this, which summarizes my thoughts rather succinctly. Men aren't looking for co-husbands.
It's the same as me not looking for a wife. I don't need a man who can do what I feel are 'women things'. I believe in gender roles. The blurry lines between the roles is one of the reasons people have such a hard time. Women want to be co-husbands but want to be treated like pretty ladies. The two rarely happen in concert. I'm kind of old school in that I believe my job is to make my husband's life easier. Women react to that negatively without hearing the rest of it. Men react to that by assuming my making his life easier means he has to do nothing for me. But by doing things to make his life easier, I don't lessen my value. Instead, I free up his time so that he can do more to make MY life easier.
Y'all like how I brought it right back to me and meeting my needs? Ms. Smart: Queen of the Back-to-Me Moment!!
Ms. Smart: "Y’all like how I brought it right back to me and meeting my needs? Ms. Smart: Queen of the Back-to-Me Moment!!
But in bringing it right back to you, you satisfy him as well. And vice versa. As Jay-Z said to Foxy, "that's the way it's supposed to be!"
"But by doing things to make his life easier, I don’t lessen my value. Instead, I free up his time so that he can do more to make MY life easier."
@Ms Smart
"I believe my job is to make my husband’s life easier"
I thought I was the only one who felt this way! I have always felt like home needs to be peaceful. My man has to deal with traffic, work, co-workers, etc all day long so I want our time and our home to be peaceful. As much as possible….Too bad my last bf did not understand this. He was so used to "crazy" chicks as he put it, that he couldnt understand how calm I was.
Are we twins? I've had men react the same exact way.
Now this woman understands how it's suppose to go, you take care the man so and he will walk over coal to make sure you're well taken care of, it's like a never ending circle.
"I’m kind of old school in that I believe my job is to make my husband’s life easier. Women react to that negatively without hearing the rest of it. Men react to that by assuming my making his life easier means he has to do nothing for me. But by doing things to make his life easier, I don’t lessen my value. Instead, I free up his time so that he can do more to make MY life easier. "
You have earned your name with me Ms. Smart
I agree with SBM. Men, at least the dudes I run with, aren't intimidated by successful [Black] women. We actually search for them. Believe it or not, you may just not be the one we're looking for. I know ladies look to justify why a man doesn't want them in a given moment, but this "intimidation" reasoning is basura.
In addition, intelligence and success are turn-ons. Don't doubt that. But the bougieness or snooty attitude that sometimes comes with it will get you cut quicker than a midget trying out for the Lakers.
SBM, I think what you write is correct and accurately reflect what a dude is thinking. Women have incorrectly called all of what you write intimidation. However, what you have not addressed is why those statements cause reactions "to good black men". You mean to tell me if I ask a women what her career goals are and she tells me them, she is disqualified because she wants to be successful? You mean to tell me if a woman makes a sound investment and wouldnt mind allowing her future husband to move in w/ her, she's crazy? I bang with the post on the surface but when you look deeper, I just cant rock w/ it. The post is all semantics. I really have no problem with the first three examples that you mentioned and I actually have a problem w/ dudes who have a problem with those three. (I wouldnt have a problem with #4 if there was an "able" in there).
My brethren are funny in disregard. We worry about basic jawns taking our money but dont want the broad "who got her own". We want the chick who is smart enough to run the firm but mediocre enough to live up to her potential. We want the chick who knows how to let a man be a man but who is willing to pay for the 1st date. I hate to say it but it seems like there are more men with absolutely unrealistic standards.
…Peyso, I rock with you on this!
Peyso (glad you put the name back, btw), this is why I love when you jump into the conversation.
LOL @ Basic Jawns
Peyso FTW again!
O. M. G.
Peyso I am SO feeling you today.
What you're saying here was exactly my point on the chivalry post a while back. Men can't have it both ways. Women can't have it both ways.
As in all things there must be balance.
If BOTH sexes spent more time trying to figure out how we can work together to create healthy families (communities really) and LESS time worried about ego – we'd take strides in the right direction.
All I can say is, as much hard work and dedication I give to my career, I cannot WAIT to give that to a life partner. However, until that person materializes, I have to life the best life I can.
did any of you see the article in the NYTimes that explained how and why same-sex relationships work better in this area?
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/10/health/10well.h…
Peyso, I APPROVE THIS MESSAGE.
Men, please stop having conflicting opinions. It's not cute.
Peyso, I agree. You can't have it both ways. There has to be a compromise somewhere.
It does sadden me to think that he assumes that as a woman dedicated to my job that I can't be a good wife for him. I'm all for letting my man be the man- if I have to act as a boss b!tch at work to keep climbing the ladder when I come home I'm tired of that crap. meh.
I don't think I've intimidated men with my success- mostly because right now it's limited but men do find where I went to school to be a little off putting and saying things like "oh you must be smart" or "you think you're better huh?" Sigh.
In my example its not as simple as "I take my career important" that is offsetting, but keywords like "partner" or "CEO" make many us of with similar goals wince.
I know you saw "Why did I get Married?" Because she wanted to make partner and didn't want no kids that b* got her tubes tied in secret. I mean … That is the best example of what I mean.
You are seriously using the world of Tyler Perry to prove this point. In his world, Rudy Huxtable is a wifeable prostitute, I think it's safe to say he takes it to some extremes.
omg ya'll are going to KILL me today! The world of Tyler Perry ahaha. Actually my fb stat the other day read something like this:
"wishes that she was a character in a Tyler Perry movie so that in 2 hours all of her problems are distant memories and would have a new sexy honest man!"
SO outta left field but I just had to touch on the ridiculous world of TP. haha. Still got my support tho!
I'm not even trying to discount his point. I just don't think TP movies are the best basis for a supporting argument. The same movie featured Spawn making his wife drive to their destination after she was kicked off the plane for being to big and he wanted to roll with *some random chick I can't even remember*. Those movies just take extremes to the extreme.
"new sexy honest man!”
See, this right here is another TP extreme. These men are like unicorns in real life, thrown in the word faithful and it's more like a half dragon/half unicorn. *shots fired*
Just playing men, don't get ya panties in a bunch.
TP isn't the best take to garner examples from, but damn if he didn't take a real problem and use an "extreme" to exemplify it.
Also, it wasn't "Spawn" who made his wife drive … he was the one with the crazy hood wife.
I am not a fan of using TP to dictate my life, but you gotta admit that she did make the perfect example for what I was trying to explain in terms of a certain type of woman.
You're right, it wasn't Spawn. I guess rewatching Black Dynamite this weekend had those abs the actor stuck in my head.
Why isn't my strikeout working.
Secondly, I dont know where all these neck rolling, decision making, loud mouth women are. I live in NYC, the capital of the women getting money movement.
I have NEVER had to deal with those kind of women. Actually the only women I see w/ those characterisitics are the ghetto birds on the block. A woman recognizes real masculinity. You dont belive me? In an assertive, semi deep, masculine voice tell a woman to "Stop". Watch 95% of them do.
"In an assertive, semi deep, masculine voice tell a woman to “Stop”. Watch 95% of them do"
Happened to me a few days ago. My usual smart mouth responses went scraaaight out the window…I was shocked that I got so quiet and listened, it was hot.
It is hot, hehe….just don't make a habit of it.
"In an assertive, semi deep, masculine voice tell a woman to “Stop”. Watch 95% of them do."
Love it.
It is usually the ghetto birds I see doing this. Also, that was even kinda hot over the interwebs.
The pimp slap works wonders for me.
Got it from my boy Sean Connery:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FgMLROTqJ0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlTCu0wDczc
Whose mans is this? Like really
Right Peyso???!!!
The "madea" in me is inching closer to the surface with him, but I don't want to get bounced the hell out of here…so I'm just going to close my eyes…sit "Indian style"….and hummmmmm
Seven, try this one
"3 2 1, 1 2 3. What the heck is bothering me?"
-Carl Winslow, circa nineteen ninety-something
I still do the Carl Winslow chant to this day!
I wish I would one day write a post about why its OK to backhand a female. I think someone would finally track me down and kick down the door to my humble ATL abode.
For the record SBM, depending on how deep you got in that post, I just may agree. Consider this my official vote for that piece being written.
Thank you Sane…thank you very much! I'm counting! lol
In an assertive, semi deep, masculine voice tell a woman to “Stop”. Watch 95% of them do. <—- Sexy as hell. Can't even lie.
Works Every Time!
Peyso, I co-sign that statement too. I just had to tell a dude, if you're looking for a woman like the one you just described, then you need to go get you one of those ghetto chicks, because I'm not the one. I don't like all that drama. I write about it, but don't like to live it.
Here's the thing, there are alot of black men who are intimadated by black women. I've seen a black man meet a black women and realize within the first 5 minutes of conversation, that, he's not as accomplished as her. I've seen the look in his eyes, as all confidence leaves. And I've also seen that girl, try and make it work with that less accomplished guy. What that ends up creating is a lopsided relationship where the more "accomplished" person dominates all areas of the relationship, from where they live, to where the go to dinner on a given night, to the color of the freaking living room.
The problem is most of our men don't know how to be men and most of our women don't know how to be women. For men, most of us were raised by women so we make up our own definition of "manhood" as we go along. We have absolutely no examples of what a grown man looks like in a relationship. We didn't see our fathers come home lead the household, make tough decisions, counsel his wife. We know nothing about that. For the best of us, our ideologies around manhood were born out of Illmatic, Ready to Die and Reasonable Doubt. So – we have no idea how to lead a woman, a relationship, a family. It has nothing to do with being accomplished or successful, and everything to do with being a man. But being a man usually means you'll be self-sufficient financially, which usually means you'll be accompished educationally and professionally. These men are the best of the best.
These men usually marry the cream of the crop as far as black women are concerned. These women are usually beautiful, accomplished, know how to cook, don't mind cleaning, know how to be submissive and independent at the same time, and they are, of course, great in bed. And 9 times out of 10, black women, who end up married, come from 2 parent homes. Think about all your female friends that are married – how many of them are from single parent homes? This is not a coincidence. They learn how to be good wives from their mom. They learn how to be both supportive and challenging, caring and aggressive. How to balance being a good career woman, and a good wife/mother.
The rest of the women, who may be accomplished but, are not drop dead gorgeous, or, are gorgeous but not accomplished, or are gorgeous, accomplished, but are terrible in bed, or are gorgeous, accomplished, great in bed but can't cook – the rest of those women end up fighting for the left over men. These men, like them, will be great in some areas, but will fall short in others. Some of those guys might be kinda lame and therefore little intimated if there is an accomplishment disparity between the two of you. He's not the cream of the crop – so, it kinda is what it is.
The majority of the relational problems between black men and black women point back to the disintegration of the black family after the heroin epidemic of the 60/70's, the crack epidemic of the 80's and the Aids epidemic of the 90's. Our generation (people born in the early to mid 80's) is the re-boot. We're basically starting from scratch – we all need to understand and accept this as we go about our lives.
Hmmm, interesting idea on married women from a two parent household and vice versus.
"We’re basically starting from scratch – we all need to understand and accept this as we go about our lives."
We definitely are. I keep asking myself why aren't men [black men in particular] evolving or rolling with the punches. It just seems as if we as a collective are resistant to change.
Like I said in my post. I do believe my generation is getting better with this idea of working successful women creating a household.
Well, damn! I guess I just got knocked down to a lower tier because of my absentee father, huh?
..I guess, I did too..shrugs.
I am too. I was raised in a 0 parent home. I had no idea what it means to be a man, had no idea what it means to be a husband or any of that. But – I was aware that I was damaged. That's the key. You have to be aware that you might not be perfect. And you have to make conscious efforts to overcome whatever lasting effects your upbringing had on you. At least, that's what I had to do. While my grandmother and aunt did a phenomenal job, there were certain things they couldn't teach. I had to learn them on my own to be a successful husband. I think it's the same for women who grow up with mothers who aren't wives.
TMIMITW, I completely get what you are saying and I've had to really work at minimizing the damage my upbringing has caused. I'm happy to say I've been pretty successful in that arena and am more than capable of being a great wife (even my ex-husband will tell you that). The problem is that according to this article here most good men will read into my successes in other areas and ASSUME that I wouldn't. They'll assume that I wouldn't be able to cook (or make him a sandwich), clean, support, let him take the lead, etc. just because I know how to handle my own when I am not boo'd up.
Well I think the post is using a little bit of hyperbole to emphasize the point. If you're expressing your accomplishments in a humble and gracious way, and that intimidates the man you're talking to – then he's a lame. That doesn't mean you have to leave him alone, because, for some women, he may be their most promising option (because of the disparities between black men and women) but, you do need to take note of his lameness.
What you said RIGHT HERE…smh…got damn if this aint the TRUTH.
You said it so beautifully by the way.
The disintegration of the black family is an epidemic. And single parent households are not good…children need a mother and father in the same home.
TheMostInterestingMan, we disgree on some things, but on your comment on this post, you make some very valid points and I agree with most of them. Nothing is just cut and dry.
Spot on
First off is that photo a cover of a fitness video…or not?? *shudders*
You know what I agree with the post and the comments. There are a lot of assumptions being made on both ends. I've had it happen to me…a fresh grad without a real career, so really what is there to be intimidated about and how do you assume I won't be into a guy like you when I keep answering your damn phone calls?!?
I think this generation is getting better though. I have plenty male friends who welcome a career woman and someone who can take care of themselves all by their selves and truly just want a companion. Either my guy friends are lazy male gold diggers or they are evolved lol.
That's Lenda Murray, eight-time Ms. Olympia. Now that she is retired and isn't as rock-hard and chiseled, she does actually look feminine. Somewhat.
Oh ok, thanks. She looks pretty though, face wise even if she's very muscular, which isn't always the case with female bodybuilders.
I was just wondering what kind of movie that was ….
I really need to figure out a name….but I'm feelin this post. I'm not intimidated by a woman w/ her isht together…infact, that's what I'm looking for. Kickin it wit the ladies who are good women but aren't really talkin about anything of real interest to me is cool for the time being, but at the end of the day if I feel like I'm putting them on to everything and they aren't able to do the same or help me in some way to further better myself it's not gonna work. The sista's with career's and ambition help force me to step my game up and wanna be better. But as SBM put it, they don't know how to cheerlead, they wanna coach and tell you what to do. Ladies, the power of suggestion is very effective………trick me into thinkin it was my idea and we are all good
I don't know when the power of suggestion lost its appeal.
It used to be that women tricked a man into what they wanted, and everyone was happy.
Now we get "told" what to do a lot more and it just get everybody heated.
Hence my most recent dating fizzle…
Hmmm…I can kinda understand a few of these. But I do think the concerns about cooking and purchasing a home can be clarified by a few follow-up questions instead of taking what she says at face value. I mean, I'm really focused on my career right now, too. But, that mostly because I'm single. If I had a husband, my family would be my focus. Until then, what else am I gonna do? Lol
This:
"Woman: “I am willing to let a man take control … when I deem he is ready. And if he slips up and makes a decision I see bad, I will let him know. But I want to be lead by a man.”
Male Thought: “This b* outta her mind. How is that giving him control when you can veto him and you have to ‘deem’ him ready? Sound like a manager at a job, not a loving wife.”
is pure silliness. You want me to blindly follow a man before I 'deem' him followable? Um…no. I gotta sit back and evaluate this man to see if he makes suitable decisions before I let those decisions impact my life. If the decisions he makes aren't those I would make myself, I'm just committing both of us to a lifetime of battles. If people did this more often, they'd be more likely to end up with a person who is "equally-yoked." Be with someone who lives their life similarly to you – this will ensure more harmony in your relationship.
Other than that, I can see whwere you're coming from on some of these…
I love the conversation and the initial post. "Intimidating" is much too strong a word. It's a save face word: "He was intimidated."
All I can say is the post was really real. It may not be PC or popular to the ears and mind…but it's straight-forward. And a lot of great comments.
Men need to be men, and understand a woman wants a MAN…Flipside…Women need to be women, and understand a man wants a WOMAN…
Stop describing yourself in terms of UFC fighters – "Strong, Intimidating, Independent". What happened to "sugar & spice"?
Shannon Cason: "Stop describing yourself in terms of UFC fighters – “Strong, Intimidating, Independent”. What happened to “sugar & spice”?"
Quote of the day. I might make this into my e-mail signature.
I think I'm gonna make this line the official SBM banner or something.
Start putting it on every post!
Welcome, glad you've already got the picture up!
Also, like someone else said upstream here, most of these women are using their independence as a defence mechanism. I will admit that every once in a while I find the words "I don't need a man" coming out of my mouth. This is usually when the 500th person (usually a man) that week asks me how I could possibly be single or tells me that I'm being too picky, etc.
On Friday night, I had one of my semi-regular customers asks me why I was headed home late on a Friday to go do homework and how my man probably wouldn't like that. I had to remind him how I was single and it wasn't an issue. The man really answered with "Still? How is that even possible?", like there must be something wrong with me. I don't know why this left me feeling all salty and wounded, but it did and the next thing out of my mouth was how I'm too busy to try and be in a relationship. I'd be willing to bet my first born child* that 85% of these independent women are doing the same.
More than likely if a man showed her that they were real, someone they could be vulnerable with, and could be depended on, all of that facade would just slip away.
*Ok, second child. I bet I'll like my first born a lot more than my second.
Some men use the "I'm too busy" line too….. :0P
You still get the sideways look.
You know you can't compare the two situations. A 32 yr. old single man is not looked at the same way as a 32 yr. single woman. Heck, he's not even looked at the same way as a 25 yr. old woman.
Heck, my own perpetually single 32 year old brother who has been in one semi-serious relationship harasses me about finding a man. If he's tossed a few back, he'll even blatantly come out and ask me what's wrong with me that I'm single.
@Sane Actually, I can. If we stepped in the Delorean and went back a few decades [both still single] I'm quite sure I'd get the majority of sideways looks and gossip for not being married or having "birthed no babies" at this age.
And BTW, I'm several yrs older than you so I really get asked this alot. Luckily my job does keep me that busy… :0)
It may be the same on some individual levels, but if it were the same across the board, these articles would be about you guys and not us.
Message from the United Womens Federation (UWF):
Sane gone need a salary for all this Welcome Wagon work. Stat. Especially if you want her to pass out cookies and fruit punch to first time visitors.
#eastcoastvacayticketmoney
#SBMsaidyourfirstticketisonhim
LOL. Please don't get him started on the plane ticket again.
My thoughts:
-I definitely agree with the last part. When a woman reminds you repeatedly that she doesn't need you, or she didn't specifically ask you to do the things you do for her (like it becomes less important) even the best man will think "well if she doesn't need me, I'm ghost."
No one, man or woman is going to stick around in a situation if they're being constantly being told (in so many words) that they're expendable.
-Sidenote: I'm all for women being independent but I missed the part where that became a badge of honor. I'm fully aware that a lot of you came in single parent households but so did a lot of men nowadays (myself included). So, for everybody waving that "Ms. Independent" flag, I respectfully request that you have a seat.
I mean, I've been working since I was 12 and out on my own paying my own bills since I was 18 (I'm 26 now).
….And Ne-Yo ain't made a song for me yet.
I think this sums it up for me…
"Something in your blouse got me feeling so aroused, what you about? On that independent sh*t, trade it all for a husband and some kids, you ever wonder what it all really means, you ever wonder if you'll find your dreams".
SOMEBODY SAY CHURCH!
It's just self justification of why that successful B*tch is not getting married, yeah we'll run right through ya like a red light but I ain't stopping.
Somebody, OPRAH, ESSENCE, EBONY whoever sold them the wrong script, and now they mad cause it's not working on guys… lol
Intimidated nah we JUST DON'T WANT TO PUT UP WITH YA BULL#*#*!
So will continue to be successful by yaself no man with any balls will put up with that nonsense, on top of risking half our assets, you not working, child support and no sex…CMON GINA what's in it for us?
NOTHING NOTHING we take all the risk and you get all the rewards.
Not a good Return on investment!
Modern American women wants all the benefits of "equality" without any of the responsibilities that come with equality.
American women want special privileges from the traditional system (men paying, being "gentlemen" by using special deferential manners and language to women, being the main breadwinner, etc) but not the
old-fashioned obligations (being modest and ladylike, being a housewife, etc).
They want the positives of equality (rights, equal access to work and education, etc) without the responsibilities (paying your own way financially a full 50% for life, taking risks with no safety net, and taking your lumps without complaint like men do…not expecting to be protected or sheltered from harsh reality, etc).
You can’t take only the good from both systems…you have to take the bad with the good in any balance you strike.
When American women try to have their cake and eat it in this way, the bad doesn’t disappear…it gets paid by men, and this is why the current culture is one of exploitation by selfish hypocritical American women.
The current American culture discourages women being looked at critically, instead projecting all blame unjustly onto men; and so the inequity is rationalized away.
On a sidenote … if you haven't checked out the "F* Chivalry" post … its all about that "I want to be independent, but I still want my car door opened" type of self hurting attitude.
http://www.singleblackmale.org/2010/03/22/eff-chi…
Whoa now, whoa now homey. Speak for yourself, you are clearly misinformed.
I don't want to speak on all "Modern American Women", but speaking on African-American women, we owe them much more than h*rd-d*ck and bubble gum. Since the middle passage, they have been the foundation upon which our culture has been built and since the end of the Civil Rights Movement (the point in our history where the black family began to disentigrate), they have admirably bore the weight of raising and teaching our black kids and pushing our culture forward while we – black men, have been on drugs, incarcerated, or dying young at abnormally high rates. We cannot, in one breath, exhalt them for the will and endurance they've shown in leading our families through these last 4 decades, and in the next breath fault them for the sense of independence, self-sufficiency, and "IDon'tNeedNoMan" attitude that has caused. We would be lost without our women.
Black American women don't want special privileges, if anything, it's us – black men – who want the special privileges. We spent the 70's shooting and selling heroin, the 80's smoking and selling crack, the 90's incarcerated and dying of AIDS, and now, in the 2000's, since we're getting our act together and a Race-Gender, we wanna come back home and run sh*t. Like they haven't been running it for the past 40 years? #ComeOnSon.
One of the other frequent posters on here often talks about the healing that needs to occur between black men and women. He's spot on. We need to heal the wounds of these past 40 years. Black men need to acknowledge that we've been absent during these times, and we need to thank our women for what they've done. Black women need to say "It's ok, we only did what we had to do – WELCOME HOME".
Tone down some of the hate homey. We can disagree with our sisters all we want, but words like "successful b*tch" do more harm that good.
Took the words out of my mouth
Such a sensitive guy lol
Thank you for addressing that…I knew I wouldn't be as eloquent in my approach…at ALL…so I watched…and waited. Thank you.
Interesting,
You know you just saved him from getting lit up like a Christmas tree.
humph.
Lets not revist the B-Word
"Moms already givin me the o_0"
I doubt it!
TMIMITW, this post is on point.
Nick, a few of your posts on here just radiate a little bit of hatred and/disrespect towards women. I'm betting that isn't necessarily the case, but I thought I'd give a little constructive criticism in case you weren't intending them to come across that way.
Hey thanks but no thanks I really could care less how it comes across.
I've met plenty of "successful" women, who guys were trying to wife up and parading around with, that were my tra*ps, doing things they won't do with their boyfriend, finance (I stop with the married ones
because they don't want to damage that image he has of her.
I love black women (all women for that matter) but I also don't fall for horse & pony show BS they talk.
And any male co-signing on that BS was probably raised or married to one of those feminist, trying to get brownie points.
Women are water they fit the image you give em!
Seriously, what woman pissed in your Wheaties?
You wouldn't happen to be engaged to a woman currently going by the name Chocolate Drop, would you?
SaneN85 I'm think I'm digging you
Nobody pissed in my Wheaties just call it like I see it.
"You wouldn’t happen to be engaged to a woman currently going by the name Chocolate Drop, would you"
Nah no engagement not me, I'm allergic to marriage and kids
Been proposed too a few times though.
Also no women named Chocolate Drops but a few diamonds, sapphires, chocolates have crossed my path lol.
Awww, going the flattery route huh? Well played, Sir. Well played.
I see ya smiling …
WOW you may just be the most interesting man in the world. Your thoughtful analysis has been one of the best I've seen when discussing the whole "independent black woman" BS. My real critique of all the articles, abc shows, upcoming books is that they don't show the whole picture, they don't give the social context and just apportion blame normally on the black women. I feel like i'm being assaulted ever frickin week with the state of the black woman..sheesh.
@PYT, I feel you, I'm getting a little over the whole "state of black women" conversations. Yall aint perfect, but yall are definitely the best we have. I also hate the fact that we, as a Race/Gender (black/man) are quick to quantify everything that's wrong with our sisters without acknowledging the fact that we're the cause of a lot of it. At the same time, I think black women need to acknowledge and accept the fact that, how things have been – for the past 40 years, is not how they're supposed to be – it's been a product of our people's circumstance. Now that that is beginning to change, yall gotta change too. It's kinda like the Prodigal Son story in the OT – but a little different.
TMIMITW: "but speaking on African-American women, we owe them much more than h*rd-d*ck and bubble gum."
Not according to Jay-Z and Fabolous! j/k
Its really terrible that ppl dont know that this is a Big L line that they both stole
Cosign Pevso – 7 minute freestyle with Hov… classic.
Peyso: "Its really terrible that ppl dont know that this is a Big L line that they both stole"
I was never really into Big L, although the songs I heard from him at the time were decent.
"Its really terrible that ppl dont know that this is a Big L line that they both stole."
So what if they did like J said to nas:
"So yeah I sampled your voice, you was using it wrong"
Maybe Fab & J saw Big L whoeva was using it wrong
If you could call a B*tch you would and if you can't you probably should.
SMH.
"A wise man told me don't argue with fools…"
Sane I'm still counting….Lord knows I'm still counting
Thank you for this comment, MostInterestingMan. Every one of your comments has been spot on. I was highly offended and disturbed by Nick's comments.
They addressed this very topic in a recent Nightline special with Hill Harper, Jimi Izrael, Steve Harvey, Jacque Reid and the big chick from the View as panelists.
And *suprisingly* Steve gave the best answer on this. He said, maybe it's not that "some" men are intimidated by a BW's success but maybe that he's ashamed that he hasn't made it up to that level yet and feels he can't engage that woman on equal ground.
And while my educational background, job status and owning a car and my own home are great "material qualities" that i bring to the table. They do nothing to address the subtantive qualities I possess: i.e. am i a good person, will i treat you right, will i be there when you need me the most.
I think a lot of BW get things twisted by giving you the laundry list of their accomplishments thinking this actually means something to men in the long run…
Peyso, thanks for pointing out the mixed messages being put out there. This is why my New Year's resolution was to stop listening or caring about what men thing I should or shouldn't do in a relationship.
I feel like I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't, so all I can do is be awesomely me and eventually someone will walk into the bakery, look in the case, decide on the Cherry pie, taste it, and fall in love with it.
If "doing you" regardless of results or others opinions is working out in the dating realm, then I really have nothing to offer you.
I speak about self improvement from someone who did and does it. To keep any woman I can claim as my SO happy, things about myself had to change. Hell, to even get said women to take me serious things had to change.
Life sucks, Dating sucks, Work sucks. You can let it beat you down, or do what you need to make make it work for you!
I'm not saying I'm just I'm unwilling to change or grow. I have but there comes a point where you have to tune out all the "advice" and opinions.
I've come to a place where I love me and I'm done twisting myself into knots trying to be what men "say" they want.
I addressed this over on Three Ways just after New Years and shared this anecdote:
The day after Christmas my sister’s best friend came over… She gushed over my holiday wreath and then gawked at me with disbelief when she found out I MADE it, with live greenery no less. She then rolled her eyes when I presented her with the homemade snowflake-shaped sugar cookies I made (from scratch) and packaged nicely for any unexpected holiday guests.
After my sister let her taste the jerk wings I’d made the day before (so we’d have food in the house over the weekend) she just stopped and yelled:
“where the HELL did you learn how to do all of this stuff?!?!?”
My hatin’ ass sister skips over, throws me a side-eye and goes:
“she ain’t got a man either so, doing all of that domestic shit don’t help.”
And there I sat in defeat… I’m in my 20s, no kids, educated, I have lovely weave-free hair that stays done, I have great DC boobs,
a wicked head game,a clean home, I bake, I cook, I even make my own friggin holiday wreaths but I’m just as single as these twonever having a job, damn near 40, blunt smokin’, baby mommas#tragic
I've made more sandwiches than Subway– for my handful of potential suitors– and all I have to show for it is three situationships with men who while they loved the cookies and the snacks didn't want a relationship. It wasn't that they weren't ready for a relationship, not because they were intimidated, they just didn't want to be in a serious relationship with me.
I've done a lot of self-improvement over the years and grown into myself. I've come to a place where I love me. I think I rock and anyone who doesn’t can well… kick rocks. There was a time when I rolled the way I did because I wanted me to be interested in my, but now I’m all the things I am not because that’s what I think men like but because that’s who I am.
You can make a homemade wreath, cookies from scratch, and great DC boobs.
I'm bout to make it my personal goal to get you someone. Don't listen to your hating a$$ sisters. While it might not be an immediate thing, I'm gonna go ahead and say you will definitely find someone.
BTW … stop letting your sister in your house.
Damn … still thinking about the homemade wreath.
Had to share a photo… my wreath was FIYAH!!! http://tweetphoto.com/20050650 lol!
Ms. Chery, I just wanna shout you out on your honest. I feel your pain and the pain of all the other awesome sisters out there that single – not by choice. It's one thing when a woman is not attractive, not accomplished, not intelligent or not (insert dealbreaker) – then you don't feel bad they're single. But, if you are as awesome as you sound, and still single, that really sucks.
You have a winning attitude though. The best thing a single person can do is just work on themself. When you're not looking or even thinking about it'll happen. In the words of Ray-J's grandmoms – "you cain't go find love… love has got to find you…"
@TMIMITW – Ray J's gramma speaks the truth
now if only she'd tell Brandy the real deal on bad lace fronts. It's been my experience that looking for love will you have you in all the wrong places.@SBM – Dude I'm convinced I'll be single forever if I don't get out the DC "urea". I met a guy a few weeks ago and he was cool until I found about the two kids (15 & 9), the time he spent in jail, his unknown injury that got him discharged from the military (I'm convinced it might be a mental condition) and then went on to tell me how he sees dead people. Really?!?! You wanted to share that you see and talk to ghosts… OFTEN on the second phone convo? I couldn't even talk myself into a free dinner. Kids, I could maybe deal with… kids and dead people = TOO MUCH BAGGAGE!
::Sigh::
oh and I'm ROFL @ "stop letting your sister in your house"…. if I had $5 for every person who has given this advice. If only locking the door would work… she's got a key (not my fault, she used to live there). My dad gave me permission to change the locks on my apt door but I'm sure she'd just break in.
Maybe it’s places named after Washington, because I feel the same way about here.
CHURCH!!
Male Thought: “She sure seems hellbent on proving to me and every other man she can do things on her own. I feel like an accessory instead of a needed part of her life.”
Basically … we aren’t scared (cue Bone Crusher). We are not afraid of you. We … men … do not see this strong woman as something to be feared or that will threaten our manhood … we just think you will f*ing slum as a loving wife, girlfriend, or life partner.
I think those two quotes sum up my feeling on the whole topic. I've never heard a man say he wants to be independent. A good man knows he needs a good woman beside him and won't make it a point to show her and everybody else that he doesn't need her. If a man doesn't feel like he's needed in a situation he may find another situation where he is
Hmmmm…
From the above conversation, what I'm seeing is that MALES have a lot of LOT assumptive thoughts about what Women will be like in relationships without ever giving said woman a chance…
Judge much?
I don't assume that every man who isn't interested in my is intimidated and personally I'd appreciate it if men would not assume that just because I'm independent I don't know how to be a good girlfriend/wife/partner.
I am a strong, Black woman, but not this stereotype STRONGBLACKWOMAN that I hear so many men complain about. I am very independent and I have HAD to do a lot for myself. Yes, I'm self-sufficient but that doesn't mean that I WANT to HAVE to be that way all the time.
Woman: “I am really focused on my career and becoming a managing partner at my firm.”
What's Really Going On: “When I'm doin' what I'm doin, I do it like I'm doin' it for TV… I'm single and I don't have kids so I might as well go get it at work while I'm young and single so I can have time to enjoy life later… It's just me so I need to provide myself with the lifestyle I want. If I make managing partner I can buy that statement bag guilt-free and take that vacation I've been wanting to take…”
I don't get where this assumption that if a woman goes hard in her professional life it will be to the detriment of her relationship. Wouldn't it make more sense to assume that if she goes hard for her job, she'll do the same for her man and for her family?!
Woman: “I bought this 3 bedroom single family house on my own because I had the money too. When I meet the right man, we’ll have a nice home to start in.”
Male Thought: “How has she planned what her husband is doing and where he is moving before meeting him?”
Hold on… WORD?!?! Didn't all the men band together to cosign that light skinnded heifer's YouTube rant about "what are you bringing to the table?" So I bring a house ::slaps trump card on forehead:: and now I'm overstepping and planning your life for you?! GTFOHWTS!! Buying a house, if you have the money, is a much better look financially than paying rent. I haven't bought a house but I stand to inherit one and I always assumed that when I get married it's a good look to have that as an option. If my future husband doesn't want to live here or wants us to get "a place of our own" that's cool… I can rent or sell my house… no biggie.
Woman: “I am willing to let a man take control … when I deem he is ready. And if he slips up and makes a decision I see bad, I will let him know. But I want to be lead by a man.”
What's Really Going On:Man I am tired of always having to be in charge. It would be nice to let someone else take the lead… but I'm not trying to be led off a cliff… or see my man walk off one either.
Again, why must you assume the worst? Do you blindly follow anyone? If so, that's stupid! You gotta know your guide before you sign on for the tour. The leader's job is to lead the way, your job as follower is to watch their back. If I see trouble coming I'm gonna say something. I didn't say I'm taking over, I'm just speaking up and sharing my concerns.
Woman: “I am perfectly capable of paying for everything I want on my own … I just want my man to want to take care of me.”
Ever think just maybe she's doing everything she can to take pressure off of you and trying to let you know that while she enjoys leaning on you, wants to lean on you, you don't have to feel like if you're not 100% on top of everything things will fall apart.
Men… STOP BEING SO CYNICAL!!! Sheesh!
One thing I HATE HATE HATE is that men can't be "judgmental" but women can be it all day and everyday.
The list of things that women use to make assumptions/deductions about a man could fill a book. The type of car he drives, where he lives, the type of shoes he wears, who made his watch, and how fast he got promoted in his last job. All these things are used as a quick mean to discern the "good" ones from the "bad".
Yet … when we do it with some of the simplest things, somehow its different? WTF! WTF for real.
Sure I could take 8 dates that are funded with my money and take my time to investigate every single assumption made from blatant statements like this to confirm my thoughts, but f* that. Too little time and I rather be right 75% of the time with a minimal investment than right 100% of the time with a huge one.
But then again … I have a business state of mind. No company does good by ignoring basic evidence and launching every single product suggested on an international scale.
I don't know about other women, but I don't judge a man based on any of the things you listed. In fact, material things are the last thing I consider when it comes to men. Also, it's been mentioned quite a few times that both genders are making assumptions about the opposite sex and that ish needs to stop.
Plus, any real woman wouldn't make you pay for 8 dates all on your own.
"Plus, any real woman wouldn’t make you pay for 8 dates all on your own."
Shheeeeeettttt.
Lol, naw … I agree. But even 8 dates just seems like too much time and effort. I'm in now in support of making snap judgments and ending it there … but more than a month seems like too much.
I also think that if you aren't feeling her after a month, it's okay to move on. However, there is just a difference between snap judgments (based on the statements in the OP) and actually having something to back that up. Men are always say that women are reading way more into what's being said than necessary, and this post is showing that men are doing the same.
Also, if you are inclined to make snap judgments, that's okay. All I can say is that you may very well be missing out on a damn good thing.
8 Dates H*ll Naw, SBM I got it down to about 30 min.
Usually the "successful broads" all start off the same.
I'm Assistant Assistant secretary at (big company) working on my degree in Bull S*ht (Liberal Arts, English Etc) and I usually don't go to clubs but my girls dragged me out (while pulling her M.A.C lip gloss out her LV cherry collection purse with $5 in it, but I have been to all the black events in the last 10 years but I'm not like those uneducated hoochies, I'm a classy lady.
15 Minutes elapsed
And I work out (translations- I have gym membership but only been 4 times in January or when a event is coming)
I saving $25 a week to buy my own house & a range rover and write a book & start my business (usually daycare or event planning)
30 Minutes Elapsed
By the end of that tired speech I'm on my 3rd GIN & TONIC (I never buy drinks) looking at all her classy cleavage she is showing off, and hit em with tha " are you done, now tell me something good like "do you like girls"
?
@Nick I hope that mention of the LV Cherry Monogram bag was not a #shot… I HATE that bag, it's so gauche!
now that Louie Nomade Alma in black… ::shiver::I dont think the problem is that men cant be judgemental. I think the problem is that men impose their judgements on women in a way that is demeaning and often times plain wrong. Also, men complain about being judged and turn around and do the same thing.
"The list of things that women use to make assumptions/deductions about a man could fill a book. The type of car he drives, where he lives, the type of shoes he wears, who made his watch, and how fast he got promoted in his last job. All these things are used as a quick mean to discern the “good” ones from the “bad”."
Two wrongs dont make a right.
The whole system is f*d up … but if her whole premise is that we are being too judgmental, then I must tell this kettle to stop calling me black.
Peyso you must have a million brownie points for all the co-signing you do.
Are you really a guy ? Or female posting as a guy?
I'm just asking ?
@ Nick – #shots huh? Funny guy. I guess you get a kick out of it. So because I'm willing to agree with some of the women on here I must be a girl? Because I have respect for the female bloggers and the women in my life, I'm a girl. Forget, all the cosigning I do of the dudes when they here. Forget how I usually back up what the dudes say with sound logic. You're the one who comments only when the post can be misconstrued as bashing of black women. I guess you're a man because "you keep it real". I think it says something when most men on this site also ask "whose mans is this?". You've yet to say one positive thing about a black woman on this site and any upstanding black man would have an issue with that. Why would I need internet brownie points with people who I will most likely never meet? Fam, you dont make much sense.
Lastly, I personally dont like the underhanded shot at my masculinity because I'm willing to agree with a woman. I was hoping that you would be able to better express your opposing views but you cant. I dont do the e-thuggery so i'll leave it at that
HATER WARNING!
Ms. Cherry "Didn’t all the men band together to cosign that light skinnded heifer’s YouTube rant about “what are you bringing to the table?”"
HATER WARNING!
Why Shanel gotta be a heifer ? lol That's a woman that get's it,no wonder she's married (lucky guy).
Hmmm coincidence ? I think not.
Brothers Enjoy / Sisters Learn –
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOgSsIXToJ0
I just goggled her name and saw how many WOMEN hating on her… SMH
I agree with most of what she said. She's a heifer by association… association with the League of Unextraordinary Men that championed her as a hero
My biggest issue with the video was that most of the men that not only co-signed it, but forwarded, posted it on facebook, retweeted and google buzzed it women I know were men that aren't bringing anything to the table and the same non-committal, loser type guys she says you'll attract if you don't have your life together. It was just a huge all around #fail!
The first time I saw it was when a married male friend of mine posted it on FB and asked for comments and I thought she gave sound advice for the most part… but then like a month later all of these no-goods that my friends are in situtationships with started sending it around… that got my eyes to rolling.
i agree with this post. no matter what a woman's level of success is i would never be intimidated or scared. for what? no matter how many degrees she has. no matter how big her house is. no matter how much she makes or what type of car she drives, she will never be able to take my manhood from me. no amount of success will allow her to take my role as a man. honestly if she wants that position then she isn't the woman for me and the argument is moot.
this is what i don't get:
Woman: “I bought this 3 bedroom single family house on my own because I had the money too. When I meet the right man, we’ll have a nice home to start in.”
Male Thought: “How has she planned what her husband is doing and where he is moving before meeting him?”
first of all i would never move into a woman's house. if you already own a home when we get engaged/married, guess what? you're selling it. we can buy a home TOGETHER.
a lot of women already have their idea of their ideal husband, marriage, life, etc before they reach the age of 20. they never take time to think that a man might have his own ideas of their marriage as well. trying to mold a man into your pre-conceived ideas probably won't end very well. or at the very least it might cause friction in a relationship.
Hey Tunde…why wouldn't you move in with a woman who already has a house? Is it because you would feel like the home is less yours…because you didn't help purchase it? If the situation were reversed and a woman moved in with the man who already had a home…I don't think the woman would care as much..she would make that house her home. It happens all the time……
yes that's exactly what i'm saying. i'm still very old fashioned when it comes to certain things. i have my pride and i would not move into a woman's home. my stepfather did that when my mother got remarried in 2001. that's not a good look to me. might work for some. just not for me.
What does it matter? If you guys ever end up divorced, you're the one booted out the house either way, right? LOL.
The MadScientist is right.
Maybe its pride, maybe its selfishness, maybe its the Y chromosome that is attached to every single cell in my body and makes me wanna fight and f* too much … but I can't get with it.
This is one thing that I haven't heard a lot of people talk about, but if you buy a huge a$$ house (not a condo or townhouse) it just rub me the right way. Feels like I'm getting placed into a pre-created vision as opposed to helping steer a new united path in life.
@ Sane, not necessarily. If the house was purchased prior to the marriage..he would have no real claim. He could try and fight it but he would probably lose….now, if both names are on the mortgage/deed then you have more of an issue of who will get what…..
@ Tunde – You seem to be very old-fashioned (no shots fired at all). How unrealistic is it for you think that a woman would agree to sell her home..it seems like its a deal-breaker for you…is it? What if the woman said, listen babe, this is our home, just stay here..this house is payed for and (or) I have put alot of work into this home…..make whatever changes or renovations you want to feel more comfortable…..but I don't want to move.
QueenT, I was just joking. I get where the men are coming from on this.
" if you already own a home when we get engaged/married, guess what? you’re selling it. we can buy a home TOGETHER. "
Mad Scientiest and that's how it should be or if we both have a house; decide together if we want to keep either one.
I have a question for my fellow dudes, what can men do to fix this? As implied in SBM's responses, the problem isnt one way. Men play a role in this by eliminating women before they even get a chance. Yea, shorty could be working 100 hours a week but that could be because she doesnt have a man to come home to or maybe she actually just likes working that way. We always complain about shorty not really giving men a chance and we turn around and do the same thing. We need to realize that we all ahve to take ownership in fixing this "issue" because its a problem that is effecting us all. We shouldnt leave it to the black women to do patch work and try to fix the problem. That's how we got here in the first place.
Some males do feel intimidated. They arent men then. One thing I learned while pledging the illustrious frat that I'm a part of is that I will always be a man. Men need help sometime, men may cry but regardless of what life brings you, your a man first, last and always. That's why manhood is our first principle. More males need to learn this.
I often do volunteer work w/ young black males. Said young black males often sag their pants. I used to get on them for not pulling their pants up. My dad told me something that was suprisingly effective. He said stop telling them to pull their pants and give them a reason to. Is this a strategy that could solve the "perceived" problem with black women?
Lastly, I'm getting a bit tired of people telling me that's something wrong w/ my grandmom and my momma and my aunts and my girlfriends and my god daughter who will be born on Monday.
Most people dont really want equality, whether it be racial, gender, sexual orientation, etc. They settle for equality when they really want preferential treatment
"We always complain about shorty not really giving men a chance and we turn around and do the same thing. We need to realize that we all ahve to take ownership in fixing this “issue” because its a problem that is effecting us all. We shouldnt leave it to the black women to do patch work and try to fix the problem. That’s how we got here in the first place."
and…
"Lastly, I’m getting a bit tired of people telling me that’s something wrong w/ my grandmom and my momma and my aunts and my girlfriends and my god daughter who will be born on Monday."
THANK YOU!
peyso,
Ill say this – Men need to use a womans success as a motivator and not an obstacle. My past Gfs and "acquaintences" would be accomplished women. Anytime they told me of a new career objective met or another achievement they've attained, I'd genuinely be happy, then I'd assess my stature and strive to reach higher goals. Maybe I'm competitive, but to me, one of the best aspects of life is being better than your best and accomplishing goals.
We talk about basic b*tches, and bum chicks who bring nothing to the table, why complain if the table is already set when you get there? Make space for your items or cop a bigger table playboy!
Ladies keep doing your thing, the real dudes see you!
Thank You, Streetz. We see you, too:-)
Simply stated … we need to stop being turned off so quick.
Fact is … there are a healthy amount of women that can handle their own and know how to make us feel good.
But it's always that bottom 10%/20%/30% that f* it up for the rest. We let them influence our own actions too much.
Sadly, this is a double edged sword as the slum guys out there who are intimidated ruin it for the real men.
As with too many things I and other bloggers talk about … its easy to identify the problem but hard to solve it.
"As with too many things I and other bloggers talk about … its easy to identify the problem but hard to solve it."
True, but it opens up the dialogue and that's the good thing about your blog SBM…everybody might not always agree on all statements, but it gets people to thinking.
"Lastly, I’m getting a bit tired of people telling me that’s something wrong w/ my grandmom and my momma and my aunts and my girlfriends and my god daughter who will be born on Monday."
I'm so happy to hear a man acknowledge how much flack the women are getting these days.
as men i think that we need to stop worrying about the success of women. first of all we as "men" should want to do better in life not because we want to compete with women but because we simply want to better.
stop thinking a woman is out to get yours. stop taking offense if she makes more money than you. what is SHE supposed to do? take a pay cut because you make less than her? she would be a fool if she did that.
WE need to work ourselves. instead of striving to be men, WE need to learn what it is to truly be a gentelman. i feel like a lot of males don't really know this. like you said our first cardinal principle is Manhood.
"a gentleman is a person who is clean inside and outside..
who neither looks up to the rich nor down to the poor..
a gentleman is a person who can lose without squealing, and who can win without bragging..
a gentleman is a person who is considerate to women, children and old people, who is too brave to lie, too generous to cheat and too sensible too loaf.
a man is a person who takes his share of the world's goods and let other people take theirs.."
what should men do?
hm…
submit to women? tone down our pride, our masculinity?
should we start thinking/talking/communicating like women
since that gets in the way of women getting what they desire?
not trying to take shots, but that's what it sounds like…
other than that, communicate more? i mean, women don't like thinking that because they're doing what they're doing, that men are skurred…
and on the other side, men are tired of the whole "my way or the highway" act…
i don't know sir…i dont know. maybe we all should just get in where we fit in.
I think since we (women) are constantly being told what we should change, how we should work on ourselves, do this, and do that, men are more than capable of hearing the same sort of criticism. Most of the women posting here are proof that we are capable of self-reflection and flexibility, so I'm not sure what the problem is with men being a little more flexible.
Although, if it's not something you want to do, there are still women out there who will accept that and love you anyways. So yes, go ahead and get in where ya fit in.
well not to be mean or anything…and it's probably not 'you' per se…
but the question being asked by bloggers/mainstream media isn't why black men are single…it's why black women are
black men had their special treatment a few years back, but i don't want to make this a tit-for-tat thing.
Touche!
I don't really want to get into the "why" this whole single black women thing is even an issue, we'd be here all night. I will say that it is impossible to say that men are playing a part in that problem. To imply otherwise is kind of ignoring part of the problem. Women can't date and marry themselves.
I see everyone giving biggups to Cheeks, and that was my entire point. If women like Cheeks are capable of self-reflecting and making chances, then why can't men? Sheeeeeeitt, you managed to do it a few minutes after your original comment.
thinking about it a little bit more…
all we as young black men can do…is do the right thing, and recognise and check others in our cipher…
that means we have to be upfront with the ladies, and truthful. that means we have to stick to our standards…that means we have to start being..i dunno…'friends' with women, maybe to show that while there are assholes, not all of us are assholes, and it's possible to trust us, once in a while…
and reach back and actually be involved with the youngsters… and show 'em how to do this son…
yes, women in the past, have done what they could do to keep the 'family/community' together…for 40 some odd years…
i don't know how much of an apology i can make, when i'm not invovled in that particular cycle, but what i can do, is at least make the first step to break the cycle of mistrust, of lack of appreciation from one gender to another (which may make me look like a simp at times, i 'll admit)
@ Sane:
"I see everyone giving biggups to Cheeks, and that was my entire point. If women like Cheeks are capable of self-reflecting and making chances, then why can’t men? Sheeeeeeitt, you managed to do it a few minutes after your original comment"
i can't speak for all men, but if they are like me, then a lot of them have done self-reflection/epiphanies on their own…they just either aren't going to write an essay on it, or explain it for Oprah *DwightHowardShrug*
i mean, we're all humans, going through life and intersecting each other's paths at different points in our journey…some guys 'get it' quicker than others, just like some women, 'understand' what men desire…and they (men and women) make the appropriate changes
My favorite is the successful black women that brags how much she has on her on, but is constantly in YOUR pocket!
A black card is of no importance if it never sees the light of day …
Wow sifting through the comments, I can see that we have a hit here. Great post and great debate.
In my opinion, I have never seen a woman as intimidating, but I have seen examples of high expectations, and even unrealistic expectations. I don't like these women and I don't talk to them.
Women must be clear, trying to tell us of the benefits, and costs of dealing with you early and up front with no evidence of the value of what you have to offer will lead to guys being turned off. It's just that simple. I'm not intimidated, i'm wondering why. I will climb Mt. Everest for the right woman.
and honestly, i'm not intimidated by 'successful single black women'…i've known way too many from school to even be fazed…
so all y'all ladies doing your thing, bigups…special salute to Miss Cheeks (DC Boobs and wreath-making? i salute you like a General, lol)
I'm sorry, but half this sh*t sounds straight-up retarded.
The one I'm stuck on is the "I am willing to let a man take control … when I deem he is ready. And if he slips up and makes a decision I see bad, I will let him know. But I want to be lead by a man.”
Uhhh, someone clue me in to what is wrong with this statement. I am willing to let a man take control if he can. Why would I let just any old raggedy ninja take the reins in my life without proving he has control over his OWN situation first? And why shouldn't I say something if he's f*cking up? I fully expect my man to put me in check fi sh*t gets wild. In fact, I embrace it.
I can cook, I can clean, I love chex
more than my exes did, hence their ex statusbut I refuse to be barefoot and pregnant fixing sandwiches just to soothe your ego. Why can't we be a power couple?With this particular point … if you find someone who is 100% cool with this then more power to you.
Fact is if you don't think he can handle the reigns, you shouldn't be with him. Women should only be with a man they are comfortable giving control too.
Mangers and Coaches lead, critique, and steer another person's actions. For any man who is capable of doing this himself (the type of guy you should be messing with) he doesn't need you checking him 24/7. You can argue it all day, but 95% of men want to lead their household.
No one is saying to shut up and sit there, but when you decide on a man and commit to him … choose wisely and trust in him. Give him the reigns. If you disagree with the direction of the ship, there are a million ways to convince or persuade him to change direction without the hostile and blatant "you're f*ing up right now approach"!
"You can argue it all day, but 95% of men want to lead their household."
the number is probably higher than that.
I can agree with this.
I guess my viewpoint was this: I've been in relationships where I've felt like I HAD to give control in order to make sh*t work and it didn't feel organic and bred resentment and animosity. I feel like if it's the right person, it should be a more natural transition for me to just allow him to lead while
passive-aggressivelyinterjecting if I find it necessary.I'm sorry, I'm not a wallflower. I can be tactful, but I will never be quiet.
I think you expect that when Mr. Right comes along you will be so overwhelmed by his leadership ability and drive in life that you will happily hop in the backseat and enjoy the ride.
Personally, I don't believe it. I hear it all the time but I find a healthy amount of women who struggle A LOT with giving up control or switching from the board room to the bed room.
Not gonna tell you what to do, but if you actively realize this is something you do and will struggle with, it will be a lot easier to actively address it and make the necessary adjustments to give away some control.
And so I'm not putting all the emphasis on you, I had to do the same. Certain sh* I was just used to doing I had to learn to do different in order to keep the wifey happy. Sucked a lot … but what can I say … I was committed.
Again I have to ask….fixing sandwiches?
Honestly, I find the jokes hilarious, but in real-life? #negroplease
WTF?
Why can't I get a sandwich every once in awhile?
BTW … I give foot and back massages … so I feel justified as long as I'm not being excessive.
Excellent synopsis.
I've tried to tell women this plenty of times, but since I didn't talk nice it went over their heads. I'll let the band handle this one today…
Forward them the link and just blame me.
I have sacrificed myself … for the greater good. Hell … I do it every day.
And please believe I have had this convo in real life where I was within cutting distance too. My soapbox has an anti-stabbing force field.
SBM, do you think Grace Jones (aka Strangé) is intimidating or do you even consider him to be a woman?
I can't say I know much about the woman (had to google her name just to even put a face to it), but I can't speak on her attitude towards men and relationships.
This isn't in anyway tied to looks or muscles … its a state of mind thing.
LOL, yeah, I gotcha. Just jokes for an otherwise "sometimes" heated topic.
Unrelated question: Is that Angela Bassett?
If so, #DEAD.
Question: How many people have heard a real live female (not on a TV show) utter the words "Men are just intimidated by me"? This seems like some rumor mill phrase that started years ago by some quack relationship "expert" that was recycled so many times people actually started believing it. It would be interesting to hear real live stories on it.
I'm glad we're having this discussion because it appears that much of what has been written so far is relative to our personal experiences, upbringing and social circles. For instance, I've never heard any female say men were intimidated by them. I'm not naive to think this doesn't happen though. But I think females that do this have a. lack of introspection, and b. piss poor friends who don't know how to honestly inject reality to her life.
My family has roots in the south. The men fish, cook, clean, etc. So do the women since there was some farm work to be done. Many of my women in my family are very accomplished and self-sufficient. This threatens not one man in my family because at the end of the day, they're interested in how good she makes him feel. That's not coming from feeling needed but from feeling wanted. Once again, I know everyone doesn't have this same background.
I think along the way some people started putting the content of their wallets (and material souvenirs) ahead of the content of their character.
I always felt like that "Men are intimidated by me" conversation is a line from Girlfriends or Sex & the City someone quoted and it got completely out of hand.
To even assume you intimidate people by who you are and what you have is a sign that you're an egotistical prick and you should probably be alone.
It's just a sad scenario: women don't want to relinquish control of their own lives, especially if they have a good deal of professional success, so they end up having unsuccessful relationships with assertive men but not respecting submissive
b*tch azz ninjastypes.But men make women feel like sh*t if they're successful because they have a bug in their a$$ and wanna talk back and get sassy… even though they clown gold-diggers and out-of-pocket hos who are in it for the handbags and vacations.
Seriously, I knew I wasn't the only one that thought the source of this phrase was as elusive as the Yetti. I can't think of one person that would dare say that, probably because they knew they would get checked with the quickness!
Yeah, when it comes to some people's opinions I start singing "You Can't Win" from The Wiz. I'm not even the sassy type; I'm reserved once I get to know someone but I've had some guys deliberately pigeonhole me into whatever category feels comfortable to them at the time. The few guys that I've dated were open-minded enough to see me for who I was not some one dimensional character that think xyz.
I think men in general are afraid of "emotions" in general, so they come up with a list (or it is still conveniently taught to them by their parents- gotta looove Boomers) of assumptions & categories for women in dating, because it protects them from actually having to confront anything, especially their own vulnerability & fear of rejection.
These categories are outdated. They are based on a false concept of manhood: constant dominance and control/freedom. These are things which, if he's really honest about being an equal partner, are things that he would have to give up in ANY relationship, regardless of how much his partner makes or how many houses she has.
These categories also infantalize women compared to men. I say this because they negate the very concept concept of choice for women- a problem that that doesn't exist in the same way for men. Ex: "slut" v. "good" means a woman can't have sex because she chooses to, but because she fits one side of the moral divide or the other. A woman has to be either "in love," which makes her marriage worthy; or have"low self-esteem," which makes her not marriage worthy or in need of a rescue relationship or counseling. Get that? If a woman WANTS to have sex and it can't be explained by "love", she's crazy!! In contrast, we all expect that a man had sex because he chose to have sex. No one questions the validity of his choice to do so; no one makes assumptions about his emotional life, "self-esteem," or motives. No one tries to make him into a one-dimensional character in a morality tale either to be sought after as a prize or to be used and/or discarded.
The same faulty thinking is at the heart of this article and other men who run away from independent women but somehow aren't "intimdated" (maybe I'm slow, but I'm still not seeing how that's the case).
A woman who has a career and buys her own house, etc is only one kind of woman: A (presumably) SINGLE ONE WITH A (good) JOB. Anything else is just a convenient assumption on the FEARful man's part.
What's really at work here is that the man who runs away from a successful woman is afraid he'll be rejected. Rejection, to him, can range from not always being the center of his woman's universe (when HE'S available of course- the idea that his partner would have any of the same commitments he does and that they are just as important as his is somehow elusive to this guy) to a woman having her own money or needing her own time and space (usually the only exception is if this time is reserved for children or for making herself more presentable to her man). He thinks if he is not 'needed' then it's that much easier for a woman to get rid of him. His concept of a relationship and his manhood are riding on his partner being less of a person than he is. That's weak, if you ask me. I wouldn't want that man in a hundred miles of me, anyway.
I can PROMISE you that this post was born out of a conversation with a few females this past weekend.
On my momma, on my hood …
SBM, I'm not doubting what you're writing at all. You ain't gotta do this for the hood, Khaled. But I hesitated in writing for about two hours because someone really said this.
*Blank stare*
I have to co-sign this, at least in part…
I'm gonna start requesting statistics along with complaints. I was just saying to a friend the other day that I keep hearing men complain about getting married based on the fact that they don't want to have to pay spousal support when it all falls apart. Meantime… I don't know 1 woman (that includes my friends, family, co-workers, church family) who's getting spousal support/alimony nor do I know any men paying any. I only know dudes paying child support and most of them are IMHO getting off easy.
All this talk about relationships gone bad when most of my female friends can't even get to a first date. Like seriously do people even "date" anymore?
All your gonna end up getting is "53% of all statistics are made up on the spot".
I have heard many a woman say this and I've had my female friends try to sell me this line too. It's the salve that women spread generously over the burn of being single.
It may be true some of the time, but as SBM pointed out, those aren't the men I want anyway.
Veerrryy interesting. I'm glad I don't any of these females 'cuz I'd have jokes.for.days.
Wow.
@SaneN85
"What does it matter? If you guys ever end up divorced, you’re the one booted out the house either way, right? LOL."
it matters a whole lot. i was raised that a man should be the head of the household. the leader. not that he rules with an iron fist but he is the leader of the household. i don't see how that would work for me if i moved into a woman's home.
Tunde (still not giving it up), I was just playing. I completely get your thought process behind it and don't blame you for one second.
I get where he is coming from..but, I am not so sure I would be willing to sell my home so that my SO/husband would feel comfortable..this house is payed for! We can renovate, redecorate, but I would not want to move…it just seems like that is a deal breaker for Tunde.
Am I wrong? Ionno….
I get where you're coming from, I really do. However, if I was a man, it would more than just not feeling comfortable to me. It just wouldn't be our house, it would be yours and I would be living there WITH you.
@Sane..I guess, some men will care and others will see it as a non-issue. It just will depend on the man.
I don't see what the big deal is..when you get married. There is no more mines..its OURS. I mean, women move in with men all the time..already established in a home..and its not a problem. A woman will come in re-decorate, put her touches around the place and make it a home….
I get it but then again…I don't get it. ah, well.
what if said SO/husband had the means to buy a newer, bigger, better house. you wouldn't want to sell the house just because it's paid for? i don't get that.
@ Tunde…in answer to your question, if said SO/Husband had the means to buy a bigger and better house, etc….I would probably go along with it…I am not going to lose a potentially good man over a house..that will not be a deal breaker for me. I would be hesitant to sell it..but, if it would ultimately make my husband/SO happy and US better…then I would do it. I would just hope that it would not be an issue…..lol.
It's kinda hard to run a house if every time you try to rule your woman is saying "this is MY house if you don't like it get out"
Let's be honest, a woman would say this if ya split the costs 50/50
LOL you know you're right about that.
which is why i don't know why a man would willingly move into a woman's home.
that's where i was going with it. i've seen it happen with my own eyes. and a woman might say "i would never say that." but we all say things we don't mean.
honestly if a woman told me to get out her house, my pride would then kick right in. bags packed. deuces.
@peyso, max, and mad scientist..lol, i totally agree..i would never move into a woman's house..we would either move into mine or purchase a home using my income to qualify and she would be on the title…a few years ago i moved in with my girlfriend (ex now) for a few months when i lost my job to get back on my feet and it was hell on earth..very nitpicky, her way or no way with how she did things around the house, and gave the impression that i was inconveniencing her and that she was "wearing the pants" since i was in her house..funny thing is that a year before this happened, she stayed with me until she found a place and there were no issues lol..i saw what i got in return..after that experience i vowed to never move in with a woman..
Man: I want a woman that's successful but not TOO successful. I want a woman that has a life outside of me but not TOO much of a life. I want a woman that's independent but not TOO independent.
Woman shrink: You're out of your ever loving mind!
—————–
There's so happy medium between those things. We can't be successful for a lack of not having a man? That's a bunch of pooey. Still sounds like intimidation to me.You're just masking it as something else….
Welcome!!!!
I still don't intimidation is the right word, but there are some pretty high standards being set.
Thank you!! I've lurked for a while just don't comment that much.
I don't know though, it still seems like intimidation to me. To intimidate is to scare someone….You won't be the center of my universe because I have a life and that doesn't sit well with you. I read that as fear, maybe insecure. But it all falls under fear/intimidation to me.
It's tough out here.
One thing I will say, I feel for women. Doesn't come off … but I really feel bad that this "Single Black Woman" thing is suddenly a bigger media draw than the war in Iraq.
But I'm not commenting on the how much sense expectations make today … but I firmly believe that "intimidated" is not the right word.
I have to side with the men on this. As my dad and many of my male friends have told me "a man needs to feel needed". As I have gotten older I have found men need more validation than women. Trust me ladies I'm not saying we shouldnt be proud of the fact we are successful and independent. However, this should not be the only thing we talk about every time we talk to men. Clearly they see we are successful and independent but we have to show how they will add value to our lives. As Bill Cosby said "it's all in the presentation"
Good post. But there's this one inconsistency that bugs me about this…
SBM is addressing thoughts/impressions obtained in first getting a know a person. Most of the time, I here women using the "intimidate" word referring to a guys apparent mentality/actions or words during prolonged dating or a relationship. So many women have said, "Oh. while him and I was together he had issues with…" See? So I'm not getting how these two worlds connect especially if we're talking about "Good Black Men."
There's a reason why a Good Black Men won't be intimidated by a Successful Black Woman. Ya'll aren't going to believe this… A black women being successful doesn't mean she'll be a good black woman. We're trying to mesh a woman's layer of success with the likelihood of the 'goodness' of a black man WITHIN a relationship. One's resume doesn't hold any weight in terms of how they function in a relationship. Ummm… yeah… So you all are talking about these successful black women as if they're all "good" black women…
Peyso: ” I have a question for my fellow dudes, what can men do to fix this?”"
If anyone has a solution, start engraving their name on the Nobel Peace Prize right now.
“Yea, shorty could be working 100 hours a week but that could be because she doesnt have a man to come home to or maybe she actually just likes working that way.”
That just doesn’t sound like a woman most men want to marry. Although communication is always key. If when asked about her work situation, she be a winner if she’d reply with something like, “I love my job and I work a lot of hours now, but it is because I have no obligations to anyone else right now. I’d love to be able to work less if it meant spending more time with my family and friends”. The thing with many aggressive career-minded women is everything is merely a check in a box on their list. And while pursuing degree/advanced degree/job/promotion/partnership, I don’t want to be viewed as simply another check on their life’s to-do list. Especially when one of those previous things has primacy over being a wife and mother.
” We need to realize that we all ahve to take ownership in fixing this “issue” because its a problem that is effecting us all.”
The realest comment written today. Granted, women helped to create this mess because they changed the dating dynamic and now are unhappy with some of the unintended consequences. But their mistreatment by men was the reason they went about making those changes in the first place.
@Queen T
"@ Tunde – You seem to be very old-fashioned (no shots fired at all). How unrealistic is it for you think that a woman would agree to sell her home..it seems like its a deal-breaker for you…is it? What if the woman said, listen babe, this is our home, just stay here..this house is payed for and (or) I have put alot of work into this home…..make whatever changes or renovations you want to feel more comfortable…..but I don’t want to move"
yes i am old fashioned when it comes to certain things and yes this is a deal breaker for me. she doesn't have to sell her home if she doesn't want to. i can't force someone to do something that they don't want to. the only person i can control is me and i know what type of environment i want to live in and that's not it.
I respect that…carry on.
I feel the same way. I would never move into a man's house. He would have to sell that house and we could buy one together. Not that we should be molding our lives based on Tyler Perry movies, but I saw Diary of a Mad Black Woman and I know exactly what moving into your husband's house gets you – homeless.
Nah, that only happens if your SO is really into light skinned chicks w/kids…..
http://www.instantrimshot.com/
LOL it actually happened to one of my girlfriends…her man went to a bachelor party, thronxed a stripper, and got her pregnant. Kicked the girlfriend out lickety split and moved the stripper in. When the baby was born he kicked the stripper out (keeping the baby) and moved the girl back in.
@Max
WWWWOOOOOWWWW
That's how they carry it up there in Canada?
At the end of a relationship, odds are someone is going to be moving out and problems still arise when the home is purchased together 50/50 (see the Breakup). Hopefully the person that you chose to move in with/live with had enough maturity and moral fortitude for this not to be like in "Diary of a Mad Black Woman".
..Don't get me started on "Diary Of A Mad Black Woman"…..they were married for almost 15-20 yrs…she could've fought the eviction from the house…but she chose to give it all up…in the real world, there is no way that would've gone so easily for the brotha man…..but she did, kick is tail in the end…lol.
SBM, I'm telling you these Toronto dudes have no souls.
No offense, but it sounds like your girl isn't the brightest bulb if she moved back in to take care of the stripper's kid.
Obviously, none of ya'll have been to a strip club up in Canada. We used to make that pilgrimage across the border alot when I was a SUNY undergrad. Used to say we were going to watch the Canadian Ballet. LOL!
But #cosign with Sane, your girl definitely rode the short bus in her formative years….
I have been to Toronto and been to a strip club in Toronto … I don't see the big deal.
But then again … I live in Atlanta and have toured Strip Clubs across the US.
@SBM Never been to one in the South but if you like seeing toned, athletic women dance then the Great White North is for you. If you prefer stretch marks and a$$ cheeks that can clap on beat with whatever song happens to be playing then it's best to probably head down South.
No real preference [haven't stepped foot in a strip club in years] just pointing out the differences….
a response: http://bohemiansugarshack.blogspot.com/2010/04/bl…
comments/discussion more than welcome!
peace & blessings.
Slightly tangential to the topic but I need to know: Does anyone like to be wanted versus being needed? Or does feeling needed outweigh feeling wanted? Or, is it one in the same?
Damn near the same to me.
I would say want is moreso important. Need is nice, but I don't want anyone dependent on me either.
Ok, thanks for the response. For me, there's a strong lean towards wanting since I resent people clinging to me or being needy.
I'm not a fan of being needed. I don't want a man to be with me because he can't stand on his own, I want him to be here because it's where he wants to be.
I prefer to be wanted…that way its not a thing of obligation….I don't want anyone to stay with me because they think I need them..or vice versa. I will admit though, I like to FEEL needed…does that make any sense? LOL
I understand-to feel like you made some type of impact instead of doing something for someone and the person says "Wow, you really shouldn't have…no, seriously." BUT you did it of your own free will instead of emotional blackmail.
I'm with SBM and Max on this one. While I don't understand why you can't have both, I'd much rather be wanted. I'm NEEDED and depended on by everyone in my life, I want my SO to want me.
I feel you, you can definitely have both. I think it's interesting to see how people interpret "want" and "need" in their relationships with friends, lovers, etc.
It's not the same. You need certain things, love, affection, support, encouragement, s_x… etc… You're S/O provides them for you because they're your S/O. That doesn't mean someone else couldn't meet those same needs… you WANT the person you're with to provide them. That's why you're with them. I hope that makes sense…
Bingo-that makes perfect sense.
Everytime I read one of your posts, I keep hearing that old spanish dude from the commercial in my head. >:0[
@ Eddie Brock. LOL.
I say one in the same in the sense that I believe that we were designed for companionship, therefore man needs woman and vice versa.
for me personally, wanting is enough. but people look at "need" as if its a clingy horrible existence. just like people view the word "submission" with contempt when I don't there should be any.
just my thoughts.
Can we all just take a pause for the cause here so someone can explain to me what's up with all the sandwiches? Is this some kind of commonly-known euphemism for marriage that hasn't made it north of the border? I'm so confused by the sandwich talk.
Google it ya Canuck, make sure you use the US google not the ca lol.
I just playing damn!
FINALLY! I’m all caught up!
Carry on.
I am Madly In Love with Peyso right now
…and The Most Interesting Man in the World 
…and Streetztalk 
I really respect you guys for admitting that men contribute (not cause or are solely responsible for) to this problem and giving real insight as to why women sometimes behave in a way that turns men off. It's so much easier to see yourself and your own faults when you're not on the defensive and I think most people miss that point. And when we can admit what we've individually contributed to create an issue an honesthearted person on the opposite side will always respect you more
We always devolve into playing this blame game as BM & BW and it gets us no where…just standing on opposite sides of the issue with are arms folded being stubborn trying to prove our own point and make ourselves right
I don't know how you feel about posting links so I won't but I read a blog by The Hallway (actually found SBM on his blogroll) and he made a point in the post that hit particularly close to home with me
"Be Interdependent, Rather than Ms. Independent or a Dependant"
Changed my life
I haven't had a chance to read all comments but someone mentioned the difference it makes growing up in a two parent household…for the most part that is true, you follow the examples you see. I DID grow up in that environment but it had the opposite effect, it is what turned me off to marriage, being submissive, accepting a man's lead and his HOTH status.
My mother is as submissive and domestic and lead following as you can find in an imperfect woman. My dad overall was a good provider and a good man but was obsessed with his "Headship" to the point that he was a bully, if you agreed with him everything was fine. But the standard answer to every difference of opinion, difference in preference, difference to anything he said, thought believed or imagined was "But I'm the Head of this Household and you have to do what I say" and not only do what he said but you needed to FEEL differently than you did otherwise you were wrong…
Growing up "submission" was synonymous with "oppression" and it turned me into the "IDon'tNeedaManMonster" for awhile…but I recognize that I'm hypersensitive in that area and I work damn hard not to let my father's assanine ways of dealing with his family dictate how I treat a man that is good to me. As independent as any woman may be it is in our nature to submit, we want too, and when the circumstances are right it is effortless and dare I say Rewarding!
It's only when submission feels more like oppression that we start acting out.
I'm not married, never have been but in the longterm relationships that I've been in I've encountered fewer problems with the "submission issue" with the men who never had to utter a word about letting him be a man, or it being his role to lead, or stating he was the head – he was just a good man in his attitude and actions and I made me in turn do my good woman thing. The guys who have to remind you are usually the ones who are falling short of their responsibility somehow. It's like reminding your kids that they have to listen to you because you're the parent ::insert gameshow buzzer sound here:: once you're at that point your credibility is already shot to sh!t and the "because I said so" never works with kids or wives – they may do what you say but there is no respect there.
Welcome!!
The fact is that MOST homes are not perfect and most examples (or lack thereof) set by parents aren't perfect. It's just up to us as individuals to decide the path we WANT and make sure that we take it, whether that's the exact opposite of our parents' or exactly the same. Some of us have to work double-time to do damage control and make sure our parents' behavior doesn't effect us to any extreme.
Thanx!
Yes, definitely!
Double-time??? Sheeeeiiiiiit I feel like I'm workin triple time and a half to overcome this sh!t – I used to have a MEAN "what? make you a plate…f*ck around and starve to death if you want too" attitude goin on…LOL…but alas I have seen the error of my ways
"I am Madly In Love with Peyso right now
…and The Most Interesting Man in the World 
…and Streetztalk"
That's cause all the boot licking brownie points they racking up, but I bet my last dollar you wouldn't be in a relationship with those guys in person.
Haven't really read Streetztalk comments so no comment at this time.
This needs be a damn chat room or forum this comment thread is getting ridiculous lol.
"I bet my last dollar you wouldn’t be in a relationship with those guys in person"
Replace "those guys" with "me"
Done counting
Bitter men are just as ugly and undesireable as bitter women.
What those men expressed is real talk. When a woman encounters a man with similar beliefs and ability to admit and accept their role in the breakdown of relationships it makes a real woman stop focusing on what is wrong with the man and turn the attention back to herself where it needs to be – it fosters respect for that man.
..in other words Nick, you sound like an idiot.
Yo Streetz… if only this cat Nick knew… smh…
I dont even know why people are givin son airplay, lmaooo.
Everyones a critic sheesh!
Nick, is it bad for a man to have an agreeable opininon with a woman and not have it called brown nosin? If you frequent the site, you'd know every dude on here has their own opinion…idk
Anyway let my non-dateable ass go back to watchin WWE
@ streetz…literally laughing out loud at "non dateable ass"… haaaaaaaaaaa thanks for sending me to bed laughing!
for the record…I WOULD date any of you. tee hee hee
I would as well, even SBM and his chivalry-hating self? LOL
Nick…#hohaveseat….smh
No woman in her right mind wants to be treated like a child. So all this "I'm the man" posturing is what turns most quality women off. If a man's ego is so overblown that his woman not following his every word or having built a life without a man around is a turn off, I think it best that women like me remain single until we find an man who knows that his power, value, and worth is not tied to having his "woman" be anything less the who she is.
An adult man (not a boy in a grown man's body) knows to ask for our input before making decisions. Seeks out our counsel, suggestions, and critiques, because he has chooses to date/marry women whose insights take his game to the next level.
I am sure the men who responds to the statement
Woman: “I am perfectly capable of paying for everything I want on my own … I just want my man to want to take care of me.”
With
Male Thought: “She sure seems hellbent on proving to me and every other man she can do things on her own. I feel like an accessory instead of a needed part of her life.”
Could be an awesome person, but his is not husband material for a quality woman.Ladies these men are doing you a favor. You and he would be miserable in a relationship b/c he does not value all of you. He will be a good husband for a woman who needs to be saved and cannot figure out how to get her life in order. He will be limited in his accomplishments because he will not have a helpmeet for a wife but instead someone he has to spend his energy, money, and intellect on providing the basics for. His ego will hold him back b/c it will not allow him to be with a woman like you.
Ladies you want to be with a man who wants to marry his equal and not his subordinate. You want to be with an adult male who seeks out confident, capable, successful women. Men cringe at the word "intimidate" b/c it implies being scared and no man wants to admit being afraid of a woman. Stop entertaining this conversation.
SBM is right, if you changed yourself to be attractive to one of these guys you would be slumming as his wife/girlfriend b/c he seeks to limit her greatness to make himself look better. You want to be with a real man who understands that with a real woman by his side, he will reach untold of heights. (just look at our President)
"You want to be with a real man who understands that with a real woman by his side, he will reach untold of heights. (just look at our President)"
Bad example his wife plays the role to the tee she's not trying to vice president, she's playing the housewife role at home with kids taking care of her husband and household, she's his support with her Harvard degree.
She's not out there running for governor or trying to be the next Oprah or Martha Stewart.
@Nick Michelle Obama has done and does a lot of things, but trust she does not sit around the White House all day cooking, cleaning, and tending to Sasha and Malia!
I invite you to take a look back at the Barack and Michelle story. You will see that she was a high achieving strong independent black woman when he started his pursuit of her. The difference between Barack Obama and most of the men who have posted here and subscribe this notion that high achieving successful women would make bad wives/girlfriends is that he wasn't looking for a mommy replacement (someone to cook, clean, and take care of his basic needs). He was looking for a partner. Hey I could be wrong as I wasn't there when he decided to pursue her. Maybe he lucked out.
but
LMAO!
Did he really say: "Bad example his wife plays the role to the tee she’s not trying to vice president, she’s playing the housewife role at home with kids taking care of her husband and household, she’s his support with her Harvard degree."?
How does he not know their back story and that what you stated is a Perfect Example! He must be living in Bin Laden's guest cave to have missed that one…
…girl, he did say just that….lol. SMH.
I mean seriously, next to the Birth of Baby Jesus, it's the greatest story ever told, and he missed it! LMAO
Exactly.
He missed it just like he clearly missed the love of a woman in his life. He's bitter and disrespectful…so unattractive. Initially he angered me and I wanted to verbally annihilate him. Then I remembered…never give anyone power over your emotions.
LOL @ "verbally annihilate him"
Yeah, I'm new here so it took me catching up on all the comments to realize he's the village idiot (is it too soon for insults)
Anyway, so yeah he gets no more replies from me…
lol @ village idiot!
I'm relatively new as well…welcome aboard…sit back and enjoy the ride. It gets bumpy sometimes…but you'll never be short of a good daily chuckle or two.
btw…great name
On one hand, all of this seems unnecessary. On the other I am HIGHLY amused. Never a dull day on here!
BTW, nice new pics Seven and Max.
lol…thank ya m'am!
Interesting post and longtime lurker!
I am so GLAD that my current president took the time to get to know his wife instead of making the assumptions listed in this post. He, the interning law student, made no assumptions about his executive, high salary earning boss who would later become his wife! He continued to pursue her even after she turned him down because he obviously saw something beyond her education and high salary even while working as a poor community organizer on the Southside of Chicago. He could have used all of the juvenile and egocentric assumptions listed above but instead he took the time to get to know Michelle as a woman and decided that what she had achieved was not indicative of who she was as a person. Barack got it right and black men would do well to learn from his example!
Thanks for de-lurking.
Great post. I completely agree.
#confuzzled
Shouldn't this be rephrased due to the fact that "she" had the ultimate final say in whether or not their relationship would go any further than the first hello?
BTW, Michelle's brother was on the View last week and recounted how the entire family wasn't really feeling him at first and encouraged her to "do better'.
Why the confuzzlement?
The "approached" (that could be the man or the woman) always has the final say as to whether it goes beyond hello, no?
It all goes to show that none of us should be so caught up in our "traditional roles" or our egos and pride that we can't recognize and pursue something great when we see it…and short of being a stalker, not giving up if the other person doesn't necessarily see it right away.
That's what makes their story so inspiring. And kudos to her for following her heart and recognizing something special in him and not giving too much heed to what her family thought
Hahaha – my sarcastic ass would call them from the White House and be like "Is this better enough for you?"
Just wanna say..THANK YOW THANK YOW, THAANK YOW THANK YOW.
Juvenile and egotistical is exactly what it is. even my own lil bro for recognizes and he's not even 30. Grown is grown; stop looking for your momma!
Great Post!!! Love this site.
“In an assertive, semi deep, masculine voice tell a woman to “Stop”….lil moist…just sayin. I am also SBW and still single and that just turns me on!
I've also lurked for a hot minute. I figured since I stayed up so late catching up on all the comments, I might leave a post.
It takes true strength to follow flawed leader. But you'd be an idiot to believe you are flawless yourself. Shut up and choose wisely. I agree with the post and most of the comments. I will stalk SBM, TMIMITW, Peyso & a few others while pretending to be Headmistress & a few otha sistahs! Nite!
Some of these comments just reminded me …. That All B*tches ain't women!
My mom had a career and took care of her husband and children so I don't buy into this myth.
A single woman does not have to "wait" until she meets a man to enjoy life. Why does she have to wait on a man before she moves into a house? Most women know how to juggle, job, man and children. Very few don't. Now men, might have a problem juggling all three, but I don't know one professional woman who doesn't juggle all three.
When it boils down to it, it depends on the persons priorities. If your priorities is God first, family and then everything else, then what's the issue–there should be none.
this was a great post. too bad i missed it. dangit.
i'm honestly kind of tired of arguing the whole independent women debate. i mean, i am a writer, i LOVE being one. i will make time to write. but i also understand that if i have a Man, that i LOVE him and it is my role as girlfriend/fiancee/wife to make time for him as well.
i don't think men are intimidated by successful women at all. i think they are turned off by rigid and unapproachable women, no matter what their income.
@Nick Michelle Obama has done and does a lot of things, but trust she does not sit around the White House all day cooking, cleaning, and tending to Sasha and Malia!
Consider that : Her mother moved to the White House with them to help out with the kids. The White House is fully staffed with chefs, maids, assistants, so the First Lady is free to pursue her own endeavors. Prior to the campaign, she held a full-time executive position with the University of Chicago and WAS NOT a housewife. As First Lady she continues to do and extensive amount of community work including heading up the initiative to tackle childhood obesity!
I invite you to take a look back at the Barack and Michelle story from a different perspective. You will see that she was a high achieving strong independent black woman when he started his pursuit of her. Technically he was a "scrub" he had no money, no status and looked "funny." The difference between Barack Obama and most of the men who subscribe this notion that high achieving successful women would make bad wives/girlfriends is that he wasn't looking for a mommy replacement (someone to cook, clean, and take care of his basic needs). Something in him made look past his ego and go after a superstar, a life mate that he could build something great with. He got with with a woman who he didn't have to worry about taking care of financially so he could be free to be a "poor community organizer" on the Southside. He got with a woman who had enough sense not to judge him based on his bank account but on his character and heart. Michelle was smart enough to see that he was a good man and despite the potential pitfalls of dating a co-worker or the advice of her family/friends to "do better" (if that is true) took a chance and ended up with a winner!
There is a simple lessons to be learned here for both men and women:
Do not judge a man/woman by what you can see materially, judge him/her by the content of his/her character
Gentlemen stop making up stories about women because they have good jobs and great careers. Start getting to a know a woman authentically and you may be surprised at what you find.
Yes you can go the "easy" route and marry the Pilates instructor at the gym and may never have to hear her question your decisions or worry about her making more money than you. At the same time you will never be able to quit your job and pursue your passion knowing that your family will still be taken care of because you have a partner that can and will hold you down while you explore and step into your greatness. I agree there can only be one quarterback, but what if you started your own team with you as the offensive coach, she as the defensive/special teams coach, God as the head coach and then went out and starting drafting players! I'm talking about a an entirely new relationship model where everyone gets to shine according to their God-given gifts and abilities!
I stand by Barack and Michelle Obama as a new model for how to win in life. She is a strong independent black woman but he is not just a good successful black man. Barack Obama is an extraordinary man. Ladies you need to look for extraordinary men and leave the good ones for all the typical women out there!
yeahyeahYEAH
Noting specific patterns of behavior after two-three dates…practical. Putting together an elaborate life story of a potential wife based on one or two pieces of information…stupid.
Wow. This saddens me. This article is reminder of something that I struggle with from day to day, which is the feeling that I did all the wrong things in life. It is unfortunate that a man thinks these things when he finds a woman with a leading role in the job market or with her own assets such as a home and expendable cash, yaddah yadday, etc. Honestly, most of the women I know who have found ourselves under these labels of 'career-minded', 'ambitious', and 'independent', we totally ended up here by accident. I always wanted a husband. I always wanted a family. I was raised by a stay at home mother and a hard-working father. And they both taught me to use my brains to make a career for myself. My mother even motivated me to do so so that I wouldn't have to feel that I must be subjected to any man's mistreatment or abuse simply because he was a provider (my father, though he was a wonderful provider was a horribly abusive husband and my mother felt trapped). That was why I pursued 'indpendence' through a career. So I could be with a man because he treated me well and not JUST because I needed him. I felt THAT would be true love. I also always expected that when I found that man someday, he'd understand that I'd be willing to hand him over control of my estate, to follow him and enhance his life, but only if I could trust him. Meaning if he would not hurt or mislead me, had good enough credit, assets, and income it would be feasible for me to sign over the fruits of my hard labor for the sake of being his God-given helper. My parents told me a man would look at me, 'ambitious', 'independent' and all and see in me a woman that could turn his 15 cents into a dollar. A virtuous woman, as I am, who could enhance and prosper him. While I don't think men are intimidated by a successful woman, I do think now that they do find it takes more work on their part to take a woman away from a comfortable life she has prepared for and by herself. They will have to step their game up sometimes maybe just a little bit harder. I meet so many men that want me to be ready to entertain them at a whim and to cook dinner for them every night, (and a sister can burn now and I keep a fine home when I have time to) but they full well expect me to also keep working 50-70 hour work weeks so I can help them obtain the big fancy houses or nice cars that I already have on my own. If you feel this women won't cook for you, its probably because you can't afford her and it would not be in her best interest to, simply put. I'm not likely to leave my estate and my career behind for a man that cannot do as well for himself as I can for myself and who needs me to continue working like a dog outside the home while I simultaneously play Donna Reed for him. And why should I? Marriage is like business, a merger even, if the husband is to do the 'take over', he has to be able to afford the acquisition. Otherwise, it's not to any woman's benefit to stop working her hustle and support a man the way she should if he can't do as much for himself. A relationship will only do as well as the man can do by himself. God designed women to turn silver to gold, a GOOD woman. If I'm working with gold and you got bronze, we're gonna have some silver-valued outcomes in life. However if I'm a woman with the midas touch and I meet a man with gold of his own, I'm gonna make a brother platinum in a year. But it's just not worth it to me to leave my gold behind if you can't bring as much to the table. And I don't have time to cook for a man and raise his children, no, if I have to help him pay bills and acquire the things I already have acquired in life. I feel sometimes I would have been better off not pursuing education, careers, etc. And honestly, because my parents split when I was a teen and my mother couldn't afford, literally to feed me, I had to leave home and make a way for myself. I hoped to find a man along the way, but somehow I ended up here, more blessed and more successful in my career but less luck it seems in the love department. The men who adored me 15 years ago are still up to the same BS they were…well…15 years ago. And I have grown and excelled and I now seem to repulse them. I think back to then when I was naive, had nothing, and needed them for everything and sometimes I really wish I'd have just stayed there if this is how brother's REALLY feel about it. Or maybe it's time to date 'others' (if you know what I mean race-wise ladies). I don't know.
Apologise for my written English..
Just read your comment and you do not sound like you are ready for a relationship…
How you got to be successful is irrelevent, but it sounds as if you feel you have achieved some kinda "special" accomplishment in that you can afford your own things…
Its great you can afford your own things but so what…
Every relationship is give and take, you do not sound like you are willing to GIVE..
You mention you mention what you are not willing to give..
You are the F.A
Woman: “I am willing to let a man take control … when I deem he is ready. And if he slips up and makes a decision I see bad, I will let him know. But I want to be lead by a man.”
YOU: he’d understand that I’d be willing to hand him over control of my estate, to follow him and enhance his life, but only if I could trust him
ANyway so many similarities, you need to stop being hung up about your achievements and become a better person… You are not the only successful person.
No Andrew, all YOU hear is success and the material here. YOU are missing my point. How I came to be successful is not irrelevant it out. I point this out to show that it was NEVER my or any of my "successful" or "ambitious" black female counterparts' intentions to become successful. We simply did what we were told, and while waiting for our husbands and family's in life, we simply busied ourselves. It's nothing personal. This is in response to the original message and a resounding one I hear from many men who seem to think we set out with this ambitious mindset to be these 'independent snobs' or something. Not so. I feel almost like its hating on a woman for making good use of herself and her time. Perhaps you ARE intimidated or ultra sensitive hen you hear the words 'estate' and 'assets' for this is simply any physical or material indication of the fruits of one's labor, be it your lifestyle, your job, or whatever you have worked hard for in this place. If you rent a room or own a mansion, it is your 'estate'. A man's mentality at the end of the day …(ie if he's working with bronze as opposed to gold) determines his worth when it comes to a midas touch woman (ie a virtuous woman). You people see material because that's what YOURE caught up in here. I'm wise enough to know that a man has to have a mentality that is not hung up on his woman being 'ambitious' or 'career minded' at the end of the day for her to be able to benefit him, whatever he has. If he can't bring 'Gold' to my table materialistically or better yet spiritually, I'm sorry, I can't do anything for him. A man is wealthy by many measures and a man who is destined by God's measure to be 'wealthy' knows his virtous industrious woman when he sees her, ambition and all. And he appreciates her, even thanks her for being so instead of berating her and belittling her because he clearly has some chips on his own shoulder. As for 'Shakeisha' – Masculine? I have no issues with attraction dear. 'I' just haven't found one that I'm happy with. You get options like that when you expand your mind. Your words sound like those of an idle and fruitless woman. Perhaps these sort of men who don't like their women upwardly mobile are more your speed and caliber. But may God continue to Bless You and your growth anyhow.
You were offended by a comment that wasn't even directed at you…that should tell you something. If you read 'learn how to be a traditional woman' and you hear 'be a lazy person' than you're a spoiled brat who wouldn't be able to maintain a proper relationship.
It takes WORK to develop and maintain a household. Work of the hands. Work of the spirit. Work of the mind. If you'd slip on your plastic degree and fall off your pedastal you wouldn't be considered an arrogant, prissy girl by all the quality dudes that try and talk to you.
Additionally, back to the original message, a WISE man, when he goes through that replayed dialogue presented about through his head, he understands that when a woman, though a bit foolishly, touts her independence in such a fashion, she is merely saying to you " I want desperately to submit my life to a man that…YES…is worth!" (There is nothing wrong with that. As for myself, Andrew, I don't necessarily that he does what I want, I know no one is perfect, I just care that he's God-inspired at the end of the day) She says these things to let a man know that she is not willing to put up with the things I mentioned about my upbringing- the abuse, the control, or a man cheating and doing whatever he wishes at whim because she wants to remind him she simply does not NEED him to provide. She needs him, but just in very different way. She needs him to be the loving and Godly man who will at least try his best to protect her, not mistreat her and do his best to uplift her. Why is it not preferred that a woman NEED her man to LOVE her instead of supply for her while she 'cooks'. Then you'll get the men who complain about 'gold-diggers' who just want what they can provide for them. Men-folk need to make up their minds at the end of the day what they want. You like em 'Fancy, Huh?' but then you gotta problem when we yell 'Independent'. I mean, really?? At the end of the day, I challenge these men to put God first, Love your woman as Christ loves the church, and I promise you you will find the loving and submissive woman that will emerge from behind the wall of 'indepent ambition', a wall which has only been erected to provide a protective framework in which a woman can provide and live well for herself should she not be so fortunate to find the heart of a loving and God-fearing man.
Wow.
If you can cook from scratch, teach children, and survive without the luxuries of life you just might be the perfect woman. It's not about money or houses or any of that. It's about the wisdom you come into when all that stuff goes away. That's true success. That's real achievement. Be able to live without it and a man who tries to get you to see that = perfect for you.
When he comes into your life he will be of so much quality. Most people will be intimidated by you but anyone who is willing to approach you out right will be the best of the greatest. Try to reign it in and hear them out. Why are you trippin about what happened to you in the past? Be excited about how strong it made you and look forward to what you'll get in the future.
'I have no problems with attraction'…
You're right. You have a problem with lust. The drones of dudes spitting game to a woman with money = using you. A man telling you to get your stuff together even though you have all that stuff = love.
When you're a quality woman you don't have options. You have one choice. Shut up long enough for the ONE MAN who's willing to go out on a limb for you so he can take you seriously.
All I can say is DAMN!!!!! I might need some time to reflect on my actions, thoughts, and words.
All I have to say is, why wouldn’t a successful couple have help at home? Does the woman really need to cook? I mean – hire a cook. Get a nanny and someone to clean your house. No person can do it all but you can make time with hired help.
People can sucked into a black hole of conjecture if you don't put things in perspective for them.
Basically, stop being such a masculine woman and more men would be attracted to you. You can't just take over ALL the roles he's supposed to play in your life and call him intimidated. He feels unecessary. Be comfortable in a woman's role. You support him, manage his affairs, cook, clean, and have his kids. Accept it. If you already act like a man what do you need one for?
Wwwwooowww!!! All these months, and still good reading!!!
sbm, very very true..i live in the atlanta area and i have had this conversation with several women..they think that men are running from them since they are successful or "independent" as women like to call it but in actuality all of the "vetoing", critiqueing, holding on to "independence" is a turn off…