Home Dating & Relationships Relationships Where have all the good black men gone?

Where have all the good black men gone?

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Apparently all the good black men are MIA.  The topic of brothers and bunnies has been discussed and explored since the days of slaves defying massa to get him some pinkfoot.  “Why that fool Jebediah keep messin’ wit massa daughta?  Don’t he know massa gon kill him?”  Well thanks to the Emancipation Proclamation, brothers don’t have that problem any more.  I mean, the Klan could always get him, but honestly, if a black dude lives somewhere that he has to still worry about the Klan, he really shouldn’t even be living there much less contemplating marrying a white woman.  Point blank.

I have a standing policy whenever I’m in public and I see an Ebony n’ Ivory couple, I immediately stop what I’m doing and give them a round of applause.  Of course, there’s a slight undertone of sarcasm that comes with that applause, but at the end of the day, I applaud them for not caring what anyone thinks and doing them.  Cuz honestly, it’s not that big a deal for me.  But to hear a sister tell it, brothers are lining up in droves to worship at the feet of white women.  Now, I’ve never walked a day in a sister’s shoes so I don’t know how they perceive things, but what I do know is that perception is not often reality.

I could try to sit here and come up with a whole bunch of explanations as to why brothers seemingly prefer white women.  But quite frankly most of it would be BS and the rest of it unproven theories based on a pot head’s logic, so I won’t even bother.  I do however have an obligation as a cocksman to speak the truth, so here it goes.

See Also:  Revisited: Are Black Men Obsessed with Latinas?

Men like p*ssy.

White men like it, black men like it, Asian men like it, Latin men like to eat it, Indian men like it, midget men like it too. English men like it at 4pm.  Arab men like it so much they cover it from head to toe and promise each other 72 pieces of it upon sucessful completion of their jihad.  Gay men even momentarily like it during that awkward phase in high school/college.  Ever seen a guy with a girl and wondered “Why her?”  The answer is simple.  She has a vagina.  It could be black, white, short, tall, fat, or skinny; men like it all.  I could dress the answer up for you, but I’m not that guy.  You know what they say, you are what you smoke.  That makes me blunt. I wish the answer was more scientific but it’s not.  Simple biology. Brothers like women and don’t discriminate.  Of course every man has their preference, but most brothers find what makes them happy and keep it movin’.  And if it’s a white woman, so be it.  Sisters keep trying to over think the situation as to why this happens, but they’ve forgetten that men are very simple.

Of course, this is not an old discourse as it is the topic of conversation in every nail shop (at least the ones on the South side of town.)   But what I’d actually like to have the sisters help me figure out is what constitutes a good black man.  In one breath, women complain that black men don’t love them anymore.  In the following breath, they proceed to itemize all the reasons “N*ggas ain’t sh*t.”  Brothers that date outside their race are perceived as weak sellouts that can’t handle a “real woman” and the brothers that remain loyal to the sisters are either playas, cornballs, on the DL, married, don’t make enough money, still live with their mamas, “out of shape”, mama’s boys, complete jerks, someone’s baby daddy, or slightly on the uh….small side. (From what I’ve been told, I’m the complete jerk)  You take all those brothers out the mix, that leaves about  2,500 black men sprinkled across 50 states.  Slim pickings.

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The funny thing is, for every sister that makes this complaint, there is or was a good black man that worships the ground they walk on and would use your bathwater to make cereal.  But he usually gets overlooked for one of the reasons above.  And that’s cool, I’m not going to advocate lowering your standards or settling.  But it would be nice if this foolish theory was laid to rest.  Sisters, we still love you.  And most of the time when women are saying this crap, their either salty with a brothers at the time, or feeding into hearsay.  Who knows, maybe this perception is actually a reality for some sisters.  Maybe there are some sisters out there who repeatedly have Waiting to Exhale moments like it’s Groundhog’s Day.  I’d like to be sympathetic to you, but I’m sorry I can’t.  Grow up.  It’s  a rough and tumble world out there and quite frankly, if he’s not that into you, maybe the problem is uh………..you.

I’m no expert, so tell me what it is folks.  Are the brothers really bunny hoppin’ or is this a ploy by Oprah and Tyler Perry to sell more product?  Any sisters have to run up in their ex’s office and smack his milk o’ magnesia secretary?  Any brothers that prefer their women the same color as their blow?  Let me know.

See Also:  Angry Black Woman or Tired Black Man? [Video]

Ignorant by blood not relation,

RightCoastLexSteele, The Toast of the Town

Comment(46)

  1. I know what I don't want..what I had. Is it really too much to ask for a blunt honest HUMBLE nerdy but handsome funny guy? some1 that knows what he want in life and is actively and successfully doin it? some1 that's survived life's struggles and learned from them? Apparently in Cali…that sh— don't exist

  2. what i had was arrogant, ignorant hood rats that don't plan for life's "adventures” for whatever reason…(i'm sure there's many excuses). they give up easily (i hear “this is hella hard” or some crap for not doin they best)

    , are very insecure (goin thru the cell and callin every 5 mins)

    ,reject any help offered (n some cases blame that person for their struggles)

    , put up a front n hide who they really are to the core (if they even know themself)

    ….and the list goes on. do i have to go tothe eastcoast and south to find a decent black man? smh

  3. I think it's bigger than men just wanting pussy. Men also hate drama. Now contrary to popular belief, I don't think that white girls are significantly less drama than black women. The problem is, black women wear all their drama up front. If they have a problem with any little thing you do, no matter how early in the relationship, they will call you out on the carpet about it right away and force a knock-down, drag out confrontation. Since these things often happen early in the relationship before the man is extremely committed or in love yet, it makes it easy to leave them the moment the drama starts. White women, on the other hand, are really subtle and passive aggressive about their confrontation, or hold off on the drama altogether until they've secured a relationship, made the guy fall in love with them or made the guy get married. Only when she's in a more secure position does she let her inner bitch out, and by that point the guy feels trapped.

    I know a few black guys who got with white women because there was so much less drama up front than black women but who ended up shellshocked when years into the relationship their girlfriend or wife gradually became a first class drama queen.

  4. Here's my $19.20. Ladies, you can't complain about me, because 'he' is a reflection of you. So if you look at the last man you had and determine he wasn't shit, well guess what, neither were you. Because he came to you 'as is' and you accepted it. Men don't change too much. They are the same from day 1 to day 26. You knew he had no job when you met him, but yet you continued thinking 'oh he'll get a job once I give him a push. No dear, it doesn't work like that. Men show you who they are within a week. Women need to realize if you accept certain things from a man, don't complain when the chickens come home to roost.

    Two, good black men are everywhere. There is no shortage. Good men are at the laundry mat, the frozen food section, the baseball game. They are everywhere. Ladies if you leave this preconceived notion of some tv version of a good man, open your eyes to the man you see every morning at the train platform. Or the guy workin the security desk at your job, hell, the car mechanic. Good black men are there.

    And third, ladies, if you live by this phrase, you'll never be in doubt. "Men start relationships, women end them". Let me break this down a bit. Women were created for man. Period. We were created from his rib. So its in our dna/natural habitat to help, love, and support the man. Whist he do what is required to sustain the family unit. If you met a man and he tells you he's in school, he's working a double (to get more money to buy a bigger house, move up the corporate ladder for more money), he's telling you that he's trying to better himself so that he can be the provider. The last thing he needs is yo ass calling/texting in all caps, "how come you don't spend time with me". No dear, that's NOT how your going to get that man. If he tells you he's working late, order dinner and have it delivered to his job. He he has classes after-work. Meet him after class, just to walk him home. If he tells you 'I have my son this weekend' bring him a bag os snacks and toys for his son. Men are simple creatures, and the less drama and madness you bring, the better he will see you as different. And may cancel a class or two, he may invite you to hang out with him and his son. You have to be his support system and not his nagging ass mother.

  5. Here's my $19.20. Ladies, you can't complain about me, because 'he' is a reflection of you. So if you look at the last man you had and determine he wasn't shit, well guess what, neither were you. Because he came to you 'as is' and you accepted it. Men don't change too much. They are the same from day 1 to day 26. You knew he had no job when you met him, but yet you continued thinking 'oh he'll get a job once I give him a push. No dear, it doesn't work like that. Men show you who they are within a week. Women need to realize if you accept certain things from a man, don't complain when the chickens come home to roost.

    Two, good black men are everywhere. There is no shortage. Good men are at the laundry mat, the frozen food section, the baseball game. They are everywhere. Ladies if you leave this preconceived notion of some tv version of a good man, open your eyes to the man you see every morning at the train platform. Or the guy workin the security desk at your job, hell, the car mechanic. Good black men are there.

    And third, ladies, if you live by this phrase, you'll never be in doubt. "Men start relationships, women end them". Let me break this down a bit. Women were created for man. Period. We were created from his rib. So its in our dna/natural habitat to help, love, and support the man. Whist he do what is required to sustain the family unit. If you met a man and he tells you he's in school, he's working a double (to get more money to buy a bigger house, move up the corporate ladder for more money), he's telling you that he's trying to better himself so that he can be the provider. The last thing he needs is yo ass calling/texting in all caps, "how come you don't spend time with me". No dear, that's NOT how your going to get that man. If he tells you he's working late, order dinner and have it delivered to his job. He he has classes after-work. Meet him after class, just to walk him home. If he tells you 'I have my son this weekend' bring him a bag os snacks and toys for his son. Men are simple creatures, and the less drama and madness you bring, the better he will see you as different. And may cancel a class or two, he may invite you to hang out with him and his son. You have to be his support system and not his nagging ass mother.

    So if you realize that no matter what your doing, he is the one who begins any relationship you have. He will be the one to determine when you are right for him. Men are supposed to find a wife. And in that find a good thing. All you ladies have to do is be ready for that good man when he comes.

    Because when he's ready, he's ready. And nothing short of death will keep him from you.

  6. I honestly don't have a problem with black men dating white women. I do howevr have a problem when black women dates white men and the brothas can't handle it. Why is it ok for them to date white but we can't?? I always scratch my head to that. I really don't understand the double standard there. I love my black men but I also don't discriminate other races. I feel like whomever I am happy with, he is my king, be it black, white, asian, latin…etc. There are good black men out here in this world and there are definitely good black women. To each his own. JMO!

  7. I feel your point, but it’s getting annoying to have black men and other people who are not black women constantly berating black women for what we are supposedly doing wrong or b/c we supposedly have the wrong mindset. The truth is unless you are a black woman, you really just don’t know.

    Although I don’t hate on interracial love, it gets even more annoying when I hear a black man telling black women that the reason he is with a white woman is because of black women and goes down this list of stereotypes as the reason (ie. Black women are too loud, too ghetto, complain too much, don’t appreciate a “good” black man, etc). They just buy into stereotypes and if these men meet black women who supposedly fall into these stereotypical categories, then they are probably just like these black women, ie loud, ghetto, etc.

    I also disagree that it is just about men liking p**y b/c I have known too many black men who date outside of their race and make disparaging comments about the looks and appearance of black women. One black man told my friend she was a great person, attractive, and would be prefect for him, but she was “too black” for him. I’ve known others to say they just don’t find black women as attractive as women of other races. (You wonder how I get men to open up this way with me, I just act like I am completely okay with everything they are saying and they open up like a book.) One of my exes told me his friends referred to black women as “monkeys”, especially dark skinned black women.

    In general, I don’t have a problem with black men finding me attracive (or white, latino, or asian), but I know that if you are attracted to white women and others, it is very hard for me to believe that you would find me attractive, a dark skinned black woman, with locs and African features. Black men just need to be more real about what it is and stop frontin’. Don’t blame black women, just admit you like white, asian or whatever it is.

    Sorry for the long a** post. 🙂

  8. My two pennies:

    I agree with the article that's not so much that good Black men are in short supply, it's that the woman usually complaining that she can't find one doesn't know what the hell she wants. Or has the wrong idea of what a "good" man is. I'm a handsome young guy, I have a good job, I do not have any kids, I don't have a jail record or any of that, yet it's VERY hard for me to find a girl worth dating, much less "wifing."

    The problem with a good majority of these chicks are deluded to the point it's comical. Their idea of a good man is someone who's going to pay bills for them, take their bad ass kids shopping, pay for their weekly manicures/pedicures & such…o yea and he has to be 6'4, drive nothing less than a Mercedes (or as one time I was told, "at least a Honda with some rims damn" smh), and have nothing better to do with his time than shower her with attention and gifts.

    Now, should I ask them what they're bringing to the table I usually get a blank stare and a stupid ass answer like "well…I might cook for him or something…I don't know."

    The answer here is obvious. Man or woman, if you want to attract a good person, you have to BE a good person. Drop the crazy sense of entitlement. Get your own stuff together and the rest will follow.

    Sounds kind of cliche I know but it's true.

  9. People need to focus on qualities of a person not their skin color. Don't omplain about what's not out there, go find it!

    I cosign with these posts

  10. Something deep inside me tells me I should just keep my mouth shut but if you know me you know I'm not good at that..

    1. Why you gotta call us bunnies and all those other names? If I wrote a similia post and had names for black women I would be racist. No I'm not calling you racist I'm just saying watch the name calling.

    2. People like who they like.for whatever reason. I don't think we should sit around and figure out why a dude prefers black women over white women or vice versa. My mom always asks why I don't try dating a white guy and the answer is simple – I am not attracted to white guys. Yes there are a few here and there but in general I am not attracted to them. Its no different than a guy prefering blondes or brunettes or girls with natural hair versus a weave.

    3. To say white women have less drama than black woman is completely funny to me because we have/create just as much as the next chick. I would rather a chick lay all the bullshit out than be passive aggressive. Passive aggressiveness is far more annoying and hurtful to a relationship than a chick making it known that she doesn't want her man looking at other chicks bootys…

    And with that I'm done…for now

  11. @BD0t – "I’m a handsome young guy, I have a good job, I do not have any kids, I don’t have a jail record or any of that, yet it’s VERY hard for me to find a girl worth dating, much less 'wifing.'" –

    Please don't take this the wrong way, but I think you should follow your own advice. "Man or woman, if you want to attract a good person, you have to BE a good person. Drop the crazy sense of entitlement. Get your own stuff together and the rest will follow."

    If the solution you pose is all true, then you are in fact the reason you are single and you may not be as "good" of a guy as you may think. Just food for thought. Don't shoot me. 🙂

  12. Duly noted. However, I must point something out comedically courtesy of Chris Rock.

    "You wanna say the n word? No problem, just give up some sh*t. You go scream n*gga all day, and I'll raise interest rates."

    I see your point though. No offense meant, it's a term of endearment I guess. Come on, YOU KNOW brothers love white women!

  13. Morning. I'm the type of dude that just loves women. Period. With that said, I am partial to black women because I grew up around black women. But in the end, the color of their skin doesn't matter to me. It's all about how they treat me and whether or not they are good people. For some reason, that's something that a lot of black women can't wrap their brains around. Stop worry about getting a good BLACK man because you don't even know what that is. You should be concerned with getting a man who appreciates you and likes you for you because he's secure in knowing that you appreciate him as well. The bottom line is that many black women expect the world from black men but aren't willing to reciprocate and thats why you see a lot of brothers with women of different races. For the most part, black men are strong, hard working, and we put up with a lot of shit on a daily basis just for being black men. All we want is for black women to sympathize with that and realize that we want to give you the world. Just don't expect that shit up front.

  14. 1.men can be sneaky azs liars. But if I'm dumb enough to ignore the signs then what? I deserve the dog I get? NO! and i don't fall for the same crap 2x! I learn n move on.

    2. yeah good men are everywhere …but i'm not attracted to every mechanic round the corner..and yes that sense of entitlement will get you nowhere! Those humble with integrity are rare.

    3. I date outside my ethnicity. Nothing wrong with that. No ethnicity is better than the other…dogs come in every size and color. Jealousy over white girls reflect insecurity.

    4. guys are simple and don't change. Thats on point. But everyone evolves and goes down a certain path developmentally. Seein where they really headed is tricky or am i bein naive again?

    5. It's hard to like what your not used to.

    6. if i date a dude for 2weeks and he aint for sh-t…I'm not either? WRONG

    7.good black men are statistically hard to find. .if not in jail they make up some insanely small percent of CALI…like 2%…guess i need to move!

    8.Love the topic and posts …good convo

  15. personally i have no problem with interracial couples as well. if i see a black woman with a white/hispanic/asian man i wouldn't think twice about it. i don't want her so why should i care?

    its so funny to me when women always seem to find losers, lazy men, momma's boys, etc. like if there is something wrong with all the dudes you encounter maybe the problem isn't them. maybe the problem is YOU.

    goldensugarplum, as far as point number 7 in your last post, i don't know if i would say statistically hard to find. based on the few posts you've made on this topic you seem a little scorned and therefore have bought into a general stereotype. i could be wrong though.

  16. 1 Thing is key.

    ASK FOR NOTHING, GET THE WORLD

    ASK FOR EVERYTHING, GET NOTHING!

    I rely on myself to spoil myself…is that bad?

  17. To me a good man is one who is compassionate/understanding, intelligent, great listenerconversationalist,believes in a higher power, appreciates music and is mentally physically and emotionally stable. I don't think that's too much. Ideally he'd be 5'10 and wrapped in caramel mocha goodness. I am partial to black guys at times, but like I said before I have phases.

    As to the theory there's a shortage of good black men I don't know about that. They're out there, perhaps you're life is not in order and you're not attracting them. I do have to point out that I have noticed that some educated black guys are a little ridiculous with their requirements for a gf. My homeboy went to Cornell and requires his girl to have attended a private institution, she must have have a great career, long hair, be no larger than a size 6, have travelled out the country (not the carribbean or Canada) at least 3 times, and a cople other requirements. i asked him does he think he's reasonable and he always says " i'm an educated black man that makes six figures and owns my condo. I'm the cream of the mutha Effin crop and have high expectations." I know a few like this. I think errbody needs to relax on the superficial things they want

  18. Oh yeah Lex I forgot to add that yes black men love white women but not as much as white women love black men.

    Golden said that good black men are statistically hard to find – THIS IS TRUTH and contrary to popular belief white women end up with just as many not good black men as black women do – we are easier to walk all over so we attract a lot of no good brothers. Trust me on that.

  19. Tunde , scorned…maybe…tired of runnin into the same BS? …HELL YEA..I work and go to school. I take care of my biz…it seem like me doin me…aint helpin me run into a good dude. Yea a booty call is easy to find but can i find some1 IM ATTRACTED TO with a good head on they shoulders and a future and yes appreciates me for me right down to my stinky morning farts?

  20. @lex that's funny

    @golden no reason at all why its wrong to rely on yourself to spoil yourself. Just don't let yourself get sucked into always spoiling your man too

  21. Umm.. Here goes my three cents. I live in dc and there are good black men. In general there are 3 groups. Group A dates only non-black women for all the reasons mentioned above. Group B date all women, BUT if they date a black woman she is light skinned. If she is dark skinned she has long hair. And then there is Group C. They LOVE black women. Main issue with this group is that they are so career focused they don't have the time to date.

    I'm dark skin and since I went natural I noticed my attention from black men decreased significantly. Most of the professional men that holla now are white, hispanic, and middle eastern. I personally prefer to date black men, but at the end of te day I want a good man.

  22. QB it feels good to be able to spoil my man but even then I get in trouble for not lettin him provide or be the bread winner. maybe this is for another topic but what is it that make dudes feel useless? material things shouldnt matter in that aspect BUT it do! is it stereotypes or history or lack of a role model?

    I'm not goin2 dumb myself down 4u to feel better

    ..sorry bout the rant

  23. Golden I feel you completely. Nothing makes me happier tha bein able to pay for dinner (ok there are things that make me happier but u know) but at the same time if I do that too much a mans ego gets damaged or he starts to take advantage… You just gotta know where to draw the line

  24. @Remi

    Not necessarily, but it's funny because while typing that out I thought someone may respond the way you did.

    Sometimes, shit just happens. Meaning you may meet the wrong kind of person, but you have to be smart enough to recognize them for what they really are, not what you want/hope them be, and MOVE ON BEFORE getting involved. If homeboy was broke, didn't have shit going for himself etc when you met him, YOU WILL not change that.

    And getting knocked up by him, only to get rid of him (or he walk out on you) resulting in you feeling like "he aint shit" just makes you look even crazier. Like mentioned earlier, it's pretty naive to think that you can change somebody. What I said is not a full-proof-can't-miss approach (nothing is). So, the difference between me and the people I referenced earlier is I don't entertain RELATIONSHIPS with these kinds of broads.

    That's why you'll never see me sitting around complaining about why I can't meet a "good woman." My shit IS together, and I will accept nothing less than that from any prospective mates.

    I stand wholeheartedly by my opinion.

  25. @ VeronicaO

    I think darkskinned sisters have a better argument about brothers favoring lightskinned women over dark than this whole white woman phenomenon. I say that because I think I know more brothers that consciously choose to date lightskin women and make it known they only date that way as opposed to brothers dating only white women. My boys actually called me out as being colorstruck cuz I honestly hadnt noticed that most of my exes were light bright and damned near white.

    As for the natural thing…I don't get it. Perm it, press it,…shoot, get dreads (I love to see a woman w/ dreads) but damn it do something with it!

  26. I usually don't reply, I just enjoy reading so much but I am one of those people that has a male friend that is perfect. I mean perfect and he's 30, no kids, never been married and he's 30! I look at him all the time wondering how on earth he hasn't been snatched up by now. But then I watch the women he deals with: smart, successful, capable women, also 30ish, no kids and never been married and I realize the women that are on his level, the very ones he should be compatible with are the ones that don't see him for who he is and don't know how to be with someone like him. You know who take full advantage of him though and would give their first dropped egg of the month to be with him? Those very women that we always turn our noses up and dogg out as much as possible because not only do they know how to treat our men, but they're doing it and they're doing it well!

  27. @BD0t – I understand your perspective, but the reason I responded that way was because all too often black women are stereotyped as complaining about no good black men, but there are black men who always complain about no good black women and continue to date the same type of woman. Further, you fail to recognize that there are black women who don't dwell on that stuff and just keep it moving and refuse to date riffraff. You made your comment as if it was just a black woman's problem.

    @VeronicaO- I don't live in the DC area, but I completely agree. Even though I am dark skinned, when my hair was long and relaxed, I would have black men approaching me left and right. I even had an ex who told me that in general light skinned women are more attractive and every once in a while there is an attractive dark skinned woman (with long hair), but it is rare. I had others who seemed obsessed with my relaxed hair and now that I have locs, can't understand why I would do that when I had such "nice" hair. There are still black men who approach me and compliment my hair, but not nearly as much as before. It's usually white or other nonblack men.

  28. @Remi

    "You made your comment as if it was just a black woman’s problem."
    —-
    Not at all. At no point in either post did I say (or in my mind imply) that I'm referring specifically to black women. I'm not really one to indulge in stereotypes.

    What I said is merely based on my own dating experiences (which isn't limited to just black women).

  29. @BDot – I made the assumption since the topic is directed towards black women. I assumed your response was as well, my fault.

    And maybe you meant to mention that it was in your own dating experiences with your first comment, but you did not and for that reason it did appear as if you were generalizing. You mentioned that you have a hard time finding someone "worth dating" in your original comment and my response was to your original comment.

  30. I dont think I saw it mentioned earlier but something should be said for "luck." Sometimes you just are lucky and come across what you consider a "good" person and for others, it just takes longer. Hell, if this shit were easy, we'd ALL already be paired up. I can honestly say that AT LEAST 95% of the black men/women I know would fall under most people's definition of "good …" Most of which in CA, btw.

    Also, lets not act like being a good man or woman is itself good enough. That doesnt mean much if the 2 of you have no vibe or attraction to each other. Then what? There's also a lot of people confusing good with perfect. I dont know ANY perfect people. If thats what you're having trouble finding, THEN I think you have a legitimate beef.

  31. This is pretty simple, and this is a problem which extends to nearly all races, except with the black man-black women situation a whole different set of worms comes about:

    so often black women look at 'good black men' and dismiss them on face…because…
    a.) they aren't 6'2''
    b.) "they talk too white" (yes I've had black women at very prestigious schools say this)
    c.) "they aren't street / thug enough"
    d.) "they don't have enough money yet"

    And the list goes on and on. Do men play a role in this, definitely. But black women who try to dismiss criticism as just not "respecting women" or "just talking down on the sisters" are missing out on taking responsibility for the role their preferences play in creating the problem they are upset with.

    To be fair, white women have the same issue, they go after the 'jerks' and many of them pay the price when like 35-38. HOWEVER,
    at least in my experience, no white woman I've been with has ever once dared to say in public company that I must "be gay because he sounds all white and has no swagger." It's with the sisters that I and many other "good black men" who are very biased toward the sisters, get passed over for … the drug dealer, or the black dude who cheats on women, etc. No it's not a stereotype, it's what I and many others have seen first hand.

    Point blank, this is not an issue about if black women are at fault, or have more drama than white girls, blah blah blah. The issue is whether or not the sisters will take their responsibility (just as black men should) for how their set of preferences and patterns of choosing men early on play a determining role in how dudes of means set their preferences too.

    A friend of mine is extremely into getting with the sisters (to an obsessive extent) but they always reject him because he's "too sensitive," yet white women, asians, latinas, etc. barrage him. Is it any surprise that he's written off black women?

    Sisters, think… if a whole group (esp. your own) consistently turn you down while others actually recognize your value now, wouldn't you adjust? The initial post was right. Men like @#[email protected], and will go for the path of least resistance, no matter how "good" they are. They say that insanity is defined by doing the same thing over and over and expecting the same result…

    No amount of Tyler Perry movies or ignorant black men bashing or [email protected][email protected] interpretations of black feminism will correct for that reality. Men are simple, women have all the control–if they change what they reward sexually, guys will follow. If being a player works consistently, more dudes will be dogs. If being super educated, intellectual and soft-spoken got all the girls, guess what, Ray-ray would be begging to sign up for a Public Speaking class, but we all know that's not how it works.

    Until the traits of good black men are valued with as much vigor as gold teeth, a rap album and a "swagger" then I'll change my mind.

    Guys are simple–we don't operate on morality, we operate on what works. If good black men aren't dating you, you have to ask yourself if you are in both your words AND YOUR ACTIONS/ sexual choices, if you are incentivizing him to do so. If you choose tims/ebonics over a professional brother who is 5'9'', don't be surprised if the dude you reject goes out with Becky who is calling him everyday.

  32. This is a very stimulating debate. I really don't mind interracial couples, most of the times I'm not attracted to the guy anyway, so why should I care who he dates. There were a lot of valid points made already, but I think we are already bombarded with media, friends and family saying there are no good black men that we have accepted as a truth. We become attracted to the wrong men because we think that is all there is. How about this we take the time to change the way we think and take off our rose coloured glasses, lower our standards a tad and really get to know people.

    On a side note I am a chocolate diva with very short hair and I live on island in the Caribbean and although I get my fair share of attention, I always wander if I would get more if I had the weave down to my backside and were two shades lighter.

  33. hey AB

    love that you brought up swag. Good point but i learned a while dack that I don't like guys w/ swagg (more like self proclaimed swag) cuz they integrity is for sh-t. The somewhat nerdy (and yes proper takin) awakward guy in the corner is who i approach for conversation…but I can't even find that anymore!

  34. To Kimolisa, goldensugarplum,

    It sounds like you both have infinitely more maturity than the sisters who are @ the school I'm in @ the moment, too bad you aren't near NY or at my school.

    That said, I would only refute the one point, I don't think the argument is that sisters need to "lower" their standards, for the standards which many black women have aren't actually "high."

    "Lowering your standards" presume your standards aren't either BS
    or nonsense in the first place. i.e. having a 2300 SAT is a high standard, having a "Swagger" or "being (fake) hard" to look thug, knocking up women, etc. isn't a lofty goal that has to be "lowered."

    The problem is that the standards themselves are falsely seen as worthwhile, when the standards need to be scrapped. Brothers who are 6'4'', and use terms like "Who dat is" are actually low standard-ones who can read balance sheets and manage a household should be considered higher. Until that happens…again hello Becky.

  35. It seems as if a lot of Sisters are stuck on why the Brothers are not steppin' their game up and how the "good men" are in short supply. I am a strong supporter of couples being "equally yoked" because in reality, many men have difficulty accepting that their SO/spouse makes significantly more than them – it usurps their position as the "breadwinner" and tips the balance of power in the relationship toward the woman. Relationships can work if it's the woman that makes significantly less, but the antithesis is rarely true.

    As a woman, what constitutes a "good black man" is obviously relevant to your background. For those of us slinging letters after our names with no kids and an upwardly mobile career path, a "good black man" is probably someone possessing degrees/ skilled trade, no kids, supporting themselves, civicly engaged etc. Obviously you want someone on your "level."

    But why are we stressing ourselves out about this? There are less brothers in school, in the trades, than there are women. Why aren't brothers going to school at the same rate? Why aren't they making the same mooves to earn better incomes like we are? Why aren't the creating businesses at the same rate? The Answer: I DON'T KNOW – THEY'RE JUST NOT!! If you can't find a brother on your level, date someone else who is, aka outside your race.

    I agree that men are relatively simple creatures. They do things because they WANT to do them and if they really really really really want something, they will FIND a way to do it. I know brothers are our first preference but if it's between being alone or with someone else who is not a brother, I support women using the later option.

    And for all those brother who are like, "Good Brothers" are all around!" Please give specific examples of exactly where you guys are for all of the single ladies. (Are ya'll at the gym, the mall etc?)

  36. Why aren't all the brothers in school, in the trades, etc. then women? It's very easy–(part of it) is that as so many of us say here on SBM, lose any chance of any hope of tail if they pursue those options, while the sisters can do so without being rendered dateless. I have tons of white friends, and none of them have to worry about being called certain homophobic terms because they "talk white" or "study too much." I could cite hundreds of books on this, but I'll pass.

    But I agree, sisters and the brothers should go find what they want and how they want, but let's be real. No one seriously argues that black women "hates themselves" if they go outside the race, while they do with black dudes who do what they can to fulfill their needs.

    In terms of where are the "Good Brothers," here's a few hiints. First, they may not be at the gym or the mall–they may be at I dunno, the library? Taking classes that aren't standard (i.e. social sciences, science…), You're probably not going to find it in the 'typical places' like step shows, Af Am classes, or 'da club' etc. In other words, you gotta do what dudes have to do when they want to find a "nice woman," they have to broaden their horizons for where they find people. (i.e. coffee shops)

    Pretty much, if you see a brother in the corner of the library on Friday, or a dude who is in the science lab, or someone volunteering in his free time, don't assume he's gay or wierd, (like most black women tend to assume) strike up a conversation. He may not be 6'2'',
    "hard looking" or ebonics speaking, but that's what you're looking for.

    Just as you don't look for "good black women" in a "hoodrat club," you don't look for "good black men" on the football field. Creativity is needed here.

  37. Here's what I know. Once I went natural, my level of attention from the brotha's fell off considerably. That was 10 years ago while things have changed a little, I still know waay to many of our people who still can't accept their god-given fabulousness! On the other hand my non-black brothers and sisters can't get enough of the nappy stuff lol!

    As for my hesitancy to date non-blacks, I recently realized it has to do with images of beauty and how I don't really fit into it. I am a full-figured tall "brick-house" type Diva and while I know my brotha's love the booty and hips, I am not so sure about everyone else. In fact, I had some of my vanilla girlfriends share that one of the reasons the love black men is because they accept them as they are vs feeling pressured to be "skinny." I laughed b/c it is true. One of the best thing about being in the black community as a woman is no pressure to be a stick-figure.

    On the other hand as an atypical sista who has a rainbow colored friend circle many of the black men I kick it have gotten comfortable enough to share with me that they are color-struck/self-hating. I even had one guy tell me that the though of black-people's pubic hair makes him want to vomit so he only dates white women and very fair black women with "good hair."

    Trust there are plenty of black men out there with self-hate issues, there are lots of them buying into the hype they black women are "emasculating AND there are plenty of black men who love black women.

    Being a good man on paper has nothing to do with cliquing with another human being and most of what I read here never addresses the fact that sometimes, people just don't connect. There are lots of good black men, but I am looking for the one that is good for me!

  38. As with iceburgs good black men and women are plentiful if you choose to really look.

    Me, I worked at various jobs, met a few woman, lost jobs and became houseless.

    Did I become a criminal? No. But criminalized as dangerous and uneducated.

    It was wrong but that's what happens when you fall through holes in a supposed safety net

    of city, state, and or government. I acctually began to believe I was worthless.

    A few women convinced me otherwise. I work when I can, make love to, and know after

    reviewing my life that I'm not that rare commodity BMW now I'm BMJ (opposite think it thru).

    I'm still a good man and though some women look down on me I know the same ones would be calling on me when I have decent clothes, money, and a home.

    Few women will help a broke bro' but that's ok it teaches dicipline, fortatude, and self honesty.

    I don't drink, smoke, beat on women, don't own a car, live in an SRO space.

    Right now rehersing for a play and though I'm at the bottom of the economic latter I do help

    my mama and ladyfriend when I can. I will rise up out of here there's nowhere else to go but up. Women see what they wish to see, if I'm seen as a zero in their eyes so be it as long as I know who I am and value myself much higher.

    The BMW's can turn to BMJ's at any moment its not giving in or up is

    what truly separates men from boys. Black women complain because they want

    us by their side but if we fall by the wayside sister's will make it because they are

    as strong or stronger bro's Its up to us to pace, get knowledge, and be the men

    they want us to be. Some of are but far to few for them to see, we are all around you

    Majestic, Sensuous, Sun loved Strong Queens of the Sheeba.

    Do not lower your sights – raise your awareness and we will be found.

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