I'd like a 5th of this, please.
In America today there is a shortage of one of the most prized commodities on the market and that is Successful Black Men. Allow me to clarify, successful single Black men. With that said, being a part of this fraternity of extraordinary men is not easy, but I’m a proud member and newly elected Secretary of Public Relations. I would like to begin by issuing the following press release:
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Dear Black women,
Given the shortage of successful Black men in America, the following guidelines have been drafted, proposed and ratified to the Rules of Engagement of Dating for Black women desiring to pursue deeper connections with Black men.
1) Women will now be required to ask men for their numbers, call them first and pay for the first date.
To be perfectly honest with you, there’s no reason why successful Black women come a dime a dozen and you can’t find a dozen successful Black men in a major city, yet we are breaking our necks to go out on dates with you. We should be getting in the club for free. Successful Black men free all night! Also, I think women should call us. “Call us first” does not include using Voicemail forwarding to try and throw the god for a loop. You call until we pick up. All is fair in love and war.
2) When a successful Black man does not reach out to you, or call you, please interpret the following:
a. He’s playing hard to get – He is not responsible for making it easy for you. Some women think that just because they show a brother a little attention we should drop everything we are doing and start trying to wife them down. You forget, according to these rules that’s par for the course.
b. You’re not the only one trying to make the team – Every good player knows that you have to field interest from several different teams before making a decision. I can’t spend all my time with one team at the neglect of my other suitors. Therefore, do not assume that you are the one and only unless you are told you are the one and only. (This piece of advice will take every woman, of every color, far in life.)
c. He’s waiting for you to prove to me that you are a priority – Women will swear up and down they are not calling some guy or asking him out because that’s his responsibility. Well, under the new regulation, the roles are reversed and women will be responsible for proving their worth. Alicia Keys said a real man knows a real woman’s worth. That’s true, but you women are hard to find, so prove it.
By order and decree of the World Alliance of Successful Men, in association with the Successful Black Men of America, we announce these rules to you. Since, we still hold the power in this country, we are taking a page from our Honorary Brother Obama, we don’t really need your input to pass this legislation. Thanks for your continued support.
With Regards,
Dr. J
Secretary of Public Relations
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We will now take comments from the SBM massive. To keep it 1-hunnit with you all, more Black men feel this way than you think. We find it so hard to believe that we have worked so hard to be successful and become the crème of the crop only to find out that we need to break our necks for Black women. One of the biggest criticisms of Black women is their independent attitude, or the fact that they act like they don’t need a man. Well let’s keep it real for a second, you need me, much more than I need you. I’m begging for an argument on why I’m wrong.
Disclaimer: No one needs no one. Man or Woman.
Ok now with that being said. I am all for women taking control and being bold I think there is nothing wrong with a woman taking a man out on a date.
But maybe I have a little old school in me but what happen to men proving themselves to successful women? Shouldn't it be both ways? Lets keep it real, there is a shortage of GOOD MEN and WOMEN. And wearing a suit and tie don't make you a good catch.(Although it is a factor)
I think women have gotten so desparate for a man that now like you said, its all role to be have to woo the man.
And as far as paying for the first date? (turns heads and whistles) LOL
YES!!!!!
And I am not paying for the first date. lol. I will pay for dates, I will take you out, but I AM NOT paying for the first date.
Ultimately, IMHO, the man should be the chooser. In my experiences, it is the MAN who finally decides that he wants to settle down. Lazy men and desperate women have caused a turn of the tables that I cannot/will not support.
Dr. J is writing like only women make men jump through obstacles just for a minute of her time, when men do the same thing (let's not talk about all the test guys will put a woman through, to see how faithful/DUMB she can be)! Please don't play the victim.
Addiitonally, not all women are like this, so it's your own fault for picking and staying those who are.
i agree…
Thanks doll!
"In my experiences, it is the MAN who finally decides that he wants to settle down."
This statement is why women don't do the chasing now. Ultimately the man, in more cases than not, is the one who has become the deciding factor in whether/when a relationship progresses, presumably to marriage. It doesn't make sense for a woman to be the aggressor if he makes the final decision. If he wants to be with her, he can show that, too. This seems like dating turned into a game rather than an exploration of a relationship (platonic, romantic or otherwise) with another person.
Soooo on point with this. Sometimes men forget that it's the man who ultimately moves a relationship to marriage. If he can't take the FIRST step we're not going to get too far.
We tried that "proving our worth to a woman" stuff. That's called being "the nice guy" and we all know how women treat those men.
But I'd claim every "nice guy" who has any interest in having a wife, gf or hookup buddy in his life learns that at some point they must flip the script and learn to value themselves.
I'm glad Dr. J. is just putting it on the line here.
I know on my own end that line about black women proving they are a priority is absolutely true. Dudes in high end careers/ professional lives don't have time to be treated like they are disposable when "Tyrone" gets more love and attention. If you want to be priority 1, you have to prove that you are deserving of that level of time, otherwise you are a waste of time. Sisters playing mind games, being dishonest, prioritizing bad men, etc. = a waste of time for anyone with anything important going on in their lives.
I feel ya, and I already assume #2. However, I'm certain #1 will never become common practice. I'm actually debating this one right now. I have a semi-regular customer at blockbuster (I work there part-time) who I'm kinda crushing on and he is clearly interested. He just hasn't asked me out, partly due to lack of opportunity because it's usually so busy. I've been considering asking him or slipping him my #, but it's not something I've ever done and I can't bring myself to do it*. Maybe he'll get around to it. *shrugs*
Plus part of me doesn't want to pay for ALL of the first date.
Oh, and I'm not really digging the last paragraph there. I will never NEED anyone, and if a man ever said I needed him more than he needed me, he'd quickly have to test that theory because I'd be long gone.
Agree! No one ever needs no one! LOL That is the problem these days. Everyone is so needy(men and women) to be with someone because they don't know how to be alone that they will do anything and put with anything to have someone…But that is another conversation LOL
co-sign!
This whole post rubbed me the wrong way.
Well….I always thought I would never *need* anyone either. And in the air-water-food sense, I still don't. But I can't help but think that my *want* for my s.o. has grown to the point where I really need him in my life. I was the one shooing dudes out the house because I would rather spend the afternoon chillin' by my dayum self. Now…..
*sigh*
Love is a helluva drug.
you know how needing people ends up working out?
Watch Angela Bassett's character on "Waiting to Exhale" after her husband leaves her a$$ for a white woman.
Pay close attention to what happens to his car.
That's all the need you could ever want right there.
In real life, son woulda had her ass in Kurt Angle Ankle Lock as soon as she ran up in his office smackin' people…
::Keeping it real can go wrong::
Humph. Try that ankle lock if you want. He woulda ended up like Larry Fishburne in the back of that limo.
#dontforgetAngiesgotguns
That's why if you're trying to get crunk around white folk, bring a bag of hot nickels or some grits or something.
Can't just go up in establishments with full-time security without some equipment.
I guess I've been ahead of the crowd… for over a year I made the decision that I would ask HIM out on a date, cover the costs, and drinks, and call him first… When I first did it he said it was very refreshing and delighted! I still do this to this date and I love it! Its just a nice way to show the man you're seeing that you do appreciate all the work they put in and that you're willing to take that role with no problem…
By the way, I LOVE the site, I call you guys "My 3 Sexy Wise Men".. Keep it up fellas, you're doing an amazing job, such a job that you finally convinced me of commenting for the first time!
xoxo,
Lola
i like…..you keep it up as well girl…..
There is alot more to being a successful man than degrees and money, status. I could personally care less if you have a degree. Are you ready for a committment? Are you honest? Have good character? Do you like kids? The list goes on…..hey, don't get too high up on your high horse. You think a woman is supposed to pursue you because there are to few of YOU? I call BULL. That is the problem with men right now…….they think they got it going on so much that a woman is supposed to be desperatetely in pursuit…No. I don't mind showing my interest after a man has made his move on me..but, if a man is interested he should let a woman know period.
I do not co-sign this post.
I agree with you. I mean a man could have all the money in the world and still be a jackass. To me a successful man is not only a man that can take care of himself financially. He has to exhibit all the other characteristics much like you mentioned above.
True, but how often do you hear women going around talking about "I need me a man who is honest and likes kids and wants commitment"? No – women are going around saying they need a man with money who will buy her shoes.
It's women like that who value the material over everything else that have men thinking like this.
i hear this all the time from women (online at least lol)….i dont hear women saying they want money over those other good things. well, this is just from my limited exposure to women in real life. so maybe im wrong. but i dont think thats the case…..
"No – women are going around saying they need a man with money who will buy her shoes."
Sorry – I just don't hear that from women. Then again, I have NO idea what women under 27 are saying or doing, lol.
lol
i guess maybe thats the difference…the age group of women. i mean, i understand that it does seem like more and more women are becoming gold diggers…when you look on tv i guess. but i guess it also just depends on the preference of women you like. maybe if you go for more high maintenance women….idk.
I don't know any black women who are going around looking for a man with money who can buy them shoes and purses and ish. However, I do know a lot of successful white women who are looking for a meal ticket.
"I don’t know any black women who are going around looking for a man with money who can buy them shoes and purses and ish."
By this statement I'm going to assume that either Comcast hooked up DSL to your cave out there in Afghanistan, or do you don't get out much here in the states.
I "personally" do not know these black women. The professional black women in my network circle are not looking for a sugar daddy to buy them shyt. Sorry. It's the truth. Now, if you have women in your life who are like this, or if you know men who have become life sponsor for golddiggers, then that's you. You people need to stop watching reality television… it's not reality.
And I have Time Warner.
I kinda have to agree with this.
Case in point: I was seeing a guy for a while and I refused to let him pay for me. (Not because of anything to do with him, it's just general principle for me to not let a guy I'm only marginally interested in pay for me in any way — it's unethical and sets up a dynamic where he expects from me/ I owe him.)
This guy drove a Lexus and wore designer clothes and lived in a nice area of town and I respected his game. It was duly noted. That was it. I do not want a man buying anything for me; I would MUCH rather do for myself.
He must not have been used to this type of person because he was constantly either trying to impress me with his material possessions or trying to downplay his status. It was as if he was baiting me like I was a gold digger while simultaneously testing to see if I was a gold digger.
Men nowadays are confused, ladies. Please keep that in mind.
Let's be clear here, you just defined what you think a successful black man is. I didn't say a degree makes you successful. I could have never went to college and been doing my own thing and be successful. It is not just professional success either, a lot of success comes from being sound in all facets of ones life. You can have all the success in corporate America, but be a nut case who can't keep a girl. So as you added things that you look for in a man, those are characteristics of a successful man too.
Another thing I forgot to mention is, a lot of times a man will say a woman is coming off to strong if she is the one in pursuit of the man. It's like sometimes you guys can send mix signals.
Personally I just do me. I believe and going after what you want and not waiting around. BUT I feel like I am the exception if I got to prove myself to him he DEF gotta prove himself to me! LOL
Already got a few options trying to make the cut! LOL
"coming off too strong…"
AGREED, I have asked some of my guy friends what they would think if a woman pursued them. Some said they'd find it sexy others said that is coming on too strong!! Where is the consensus??!! 🙁
Dr. J 0_0
Regardless of gender, whenever you see what you want…go for it…
I've taken a guy out on a date ONCE, 1, UNO..I didn't open the car door, pull out the chair…blah blah blah…But I paid…If I really like a guy, I don't mind spending money on him…if I'm really interested, although this never happens.
I know that the weather is getting nice…I'm feening to wear flip flops and maybe poom poom shorts…but the writers of SBM are already bringing the heat…77 degrees…Can't wait to see this blog in the hawt summer time…
as one of the representatives of the United Nations of Brothas, i cosign this press release on behalf of my constituency of New Negro Nerdopolis.
The League of Cocksmen also endorses this message.
This is how business gets done!
Women, look at this right here! Men we sit down and we get our ish together. We are on the same page.
PROBLEM: You ever see a group of chicks arguing with one guy, sooner or later they end up arguing with one another?
SOLUTION: Get on the same page before you guys try and do something. I keep trying to tell y'all For Sisters Only… use it, feel it, make it real.
Bravo Dr J Bravo!!!
"There’s no reason why successful Black women come a dime a dozen and you can’t find a dozen successful Black men in a major city, yet we are breaking our necks to go out on dates with you"
"Well let’s keep it real for a second, you need me, much more than I need you."
Dr. J you are going to make some ladies very angry today.
Ooohhhh…sensitive post…..
No one needs anyone, that being said, i agree with some parts of this post….i dont mind asking guys out on dates and paying. but what if the reason he doesnt call is cuz he isnt interested again?
"but what if the reason he doesn't call is cuz he isnt interested again?"
Which is usually the case. On one hand they say, I like the challenge of the chase and on the other hand they say its refreshing to not have to do the asking o_O. I prefer old school with a touch of new school, give him the green light IF he shows interest, that way feelings aren't hurt (men are not as quick and upfront to tell a woman they are not interested) and this method has shown 99.9% success.
I can agree with this,,,
Men are less likely to send a chick on her way b/c we easy to get along with. We don't have a long list of deal breakers…
or you're never the type to pass up the potential for some easy beats.
Nah you're right. I didn't want to say, he's just not that into you because it would be too cliche. But you present a bigger problem, turn the tables back for a moment. Why do people ask for a number or take a number and never call? What's wrong with saying, i'm not calling you?
Whew Lawd… the shifting sands of gender roles.
1. I agree that if I want you… I'll make a move, some kind of move. I may not ask you on a date… but I'll lead you down that path. Call it passive-agressive.
2. I do agree that the ratio of sucessful single black men:women is off. But I also think that's more than half the reason women encounter the assh0le-ish behavior we see everyday. Men know the odds are in their favor. Faithful? For what?
3. I've taken a dude out & paid before. He said he was pleasantly surprised since he typically dates "model types who pay for NOTHING" <– his words not mine. However, the fall out w/ this dude left a bad taste in my mouth about paying for an entire date. I don't know if it's b/c of the way we started (w/ my paying for everything) or b/c he is the way he is… But I felt like he wanted to pay me back for paying for the date… w/ s*x. Lol. I was like "so soon??"
I mean I understand that women do that (not me, I might add)… dude pays for date, does nice things… she rewards him. I felt weird being the one w/ the reward being pushed at… I dont know. It was awkward.
As the Lead Negotiator for the United Womens Coalition, I can tell you that the UWC is prepared to accept your proposal. With the following amendments:
1) Prior to free night in the club you will be required to purchase a new outfit, have hair ripped from your face (all wax, no shave) and spend at least 2 hours in a salon giving the stink eye to a guy you think was looking at your lady. If you believe that chex is in the picture you will also have all hair ripped from your testes, chest, underarms and chin.
2) Generally your heel will be elevated at least 3 inches and from the ground and your toes will be squished into a point. You must learn to walk gracefully in these contrapments.
3) Random women may grab your arm (or your family jewels) and give you a "And what?" look when you turn around in disgust. Not wanting to cause trouble, you must always walk away.
4) Ugly women will be the first ones to purchase your drink. You owe them your attention for the rest of the night.
5) The woman will pay for your first date and take you somewhere nice. However, the amount of money she spends on you will directly correlate to how quickly she expects you to give up the "goods" – and how good she wants the "goods" to be. Be warned, though – if you give it up too quickly she'll think less of you, stop taking you out and make you her post-club booty call.
6) Women will call you. However, you in turn will be required to wait on her call. In the meantime you will discuss the situation with your friends and when she DOES finally call you will pretend that you weren't waiting on her call.
7) You will take it as a given that your Successful Woman is sleeping with at least 2 other men. You will adhere to all sorts of silly rules in order to distinguish yourself from the pack of men she is pursuing. You won't accept her calls or advances after 10pm for example. If she wants to come out that late she can spend time with one of those loose men.
8) On a monthly basis you will lose about a pint of blood, gain 3-4 pounds, suffer from extreme hunger, cramps and emotional distress due to elevated hormone levels. Your woman will not want to be in your company during this time. You, however, must carry on as if nothing is happening.
9) In the workplace, your excellent idea will be met with a quick head nod by the group. A woman will share the exact same idea in the same group and everyone will act like she cured cancer.
10) You will earn about 76 cents for every dollar a woman earns.
11) You will spit life from your bung-hole. Our scientific research team is well on it's way to making this happen.
BWHAHAHAHA. Love it.
*standing ovation*
Sweet baby jeas', I heart this response. Thank you, thank you, thank you…. You get a standing ovation, Anna N.
I love it!! LOL!
LMAO!!
i love it too…..
I thought with all the women waving fans at this comment it was much more deeper than it was. It's hard being a Black woman, right?
Try being a Black man.
I love you Anna, but I could write a response to this that would make us all have to hug it out. Let's keep it on wax. We talking about dating.
oh please with that whole "try being a black man" ish….
*sigh* ima leave this topic alone…..
black love is beautiful……
Imma say this and then get back to the post, but everytime I see you comment on this I hear Ester Dean or Ludacris in the back of my head. Where did Chocolate Drop come from? Cough up a lung for us.
this seems like sarcasm and i wish i could get it lol…dont know what you are referring to….please let me in on it…i love to laugh…
Chocolate Drop is what my fiance calls me….no other secret meanings behind it……
i am really really dark skinned…thats where the chocolate part comes from……
Puh – leeze, lol! You got my creative juices flowin' with this one, you know my comment was more in fun than anything. Yes, yes – we know being a Black Man is hard. But is it so hard that you would hang up the family jewels and take a stab at being a Black woman? It's not a matter of who has it worse. There are pros and cons to both sides.
I'll still buy you that drink. Just don't get mad if I'm on you like white on rice for the rest of the night, lol.
Naw I can't be mad at your reply, I really can't. I'll take that drink too, Henny Black. But we can come to a higher level on this one. Imma write a post in a few weeks to dudes asking them to not sweat a girl until the 2nd drink is bought and she has smiled at you, and either touched you or laughed at an unfunny joke.
I think this will avoid this handcuffing phenomenon.
Talk about it with your people and let me know.
Hmmmm, a 2 drink minimum for handcuffin? I think you may have something here, lol.
Lead negotiator, I (and a room full of women, one who just toppled over in laughter) support your amendment.
Have I told you this week how brilliant you are?!
I'm not even going to make my own comment, cause you said everything right there.
If men are so hype on switching gender roles, because it's inconvenient or too much work, let them know what it's really about!
#3 & #4 Happen to me already
#5 – I can live with
#7 – Doesnt this happen already but yet women are more sneaky about covering it up?
Carry on, lol
What she said.
My Heroine for the week. This response is too funny and I co-sign with flourish!
As someone who spends a lot of time reading and writing about feminism (I'm a dude obviously), I'm sorry I cannot co-sign on this.
This is another case of women, when given a serious critique, trying to hog the spotlight and say how they are oppressed, and how that oppression circumvents legitimate criticism.
Dr. J. was right. We aren't talking about workplace equality, nor are we talking about any of the other things on that list. Social gender inequity does not excuse the kinds of behaviors which motivated Dr. J's post. (or any other of the billions of ones on SBM which talk about black women's *interesting* priorities in men).
Put simply, sexism doesn't mean black men have to make themselves puppets for black women–who are the ones going on national and global tv complaining they can't marry good black men!
Those sisters who cannot find the man of their dreams (of any race) have to do like men who can't find the woman of their dreams. They have to adjust, adapt and change some of the rules in their head to get what they want. Nothing in the decree by the "Women's Coalition" can change that fact. If the sisters are right that we are in such desperate times, doesn't that require desperate measures? If not, stop lying to us about the "emergency situation" and get over it.
😮 Thank you SO much for the enlightening Women & Gender Studies point of view! You realize your quasi serious debate on this particular subject that is both light hearted and i’m sure in good fun is a TAD bit ridiculous. #i’mjustsaying. No one asked you to co-sign 🙂
I had a real chuckle when I read AB's posts. I was thinking to myself "Who dis, paw? Who dis is?"
Anna and everyone that co-signed this:
Be glad I'm out of the office for training and I don't have access to a computer to respond to this.
(stupid Blackberry)
Oh, Hugh – this means that the Technical Interference wing of the UCW has met their quarterly goals.
*insert evil laugh here*
The problem with men who think they want to reverse gender roles is that most DO NOT KNOW WHAT WOMEN DO TO FULFILL OUR ROLE. Know our role then profess to want to live it!
And RCLS' post tomorrow is going to be worse? I can literally hear steam coming out of women's ears this morning. What's the over/under for 200 comments?
"One of the biggest criticisms of Black women is their independent attitude, or the fact that they act like they don’t need a man. Well let’s keep it real for a second, you need me, much more than I need you. I’m begging for an argument on why I’m wrong."
well, i guess this is the case seeing as to how many "brothas" go outside their race.
I dont want to hear about black women and their attitudes. didnt we just discuss this the other day when talking about revenge. every action has a reaction. so even if black women had attitudes, they didnt just pop up for no reason at all. but that in itself is a whole topic.
and let me ask you then….do yall "black" men sit around and list all the reasons why you dont like black women?
i agree with the others….i dont need anybody…not even my fiance.
ok, i can go on and on about that topic. so anyway. i can agree with the article as a whole. i thought it would be worse…..
"and let me ask you then….do yall “black” men sit around and list all the reasons why you dont like black women?"
Yes. LMAO.
is your mother black? your grandmother? or are you mixed with a non-black mother?
because how the h*ll can a black man come from a family full of black women and be against black women. its something i will never understand…
but this is a whole nother topic that really makes me want to cry…..just sad…..
Read what you wrote again. Do we sit around and talk about all the problems with Black women? Yes we do. Women do that too. Please don't jump to the conclusion that we have given up on Black women or that we are against them.
If women cannot stand up to scrutiny and still pass through then something is wrong.
the point i was trying to make is something that Peyso said below in his 2nd comment…that black men tend to want to talk about how terrible black women can be instead of trying to find solutions. black men tend to resort to bashing black women (not saying you….just in general), instead of discussing the reasons why we are that way (even though i dont necesarrily agree that we are that way). so in my opinion, if you sit around as a group of black men discussing the problems of black women and then turn around and say that black women push black men away (Cally's comment) and do the blame game, then yes i say that means you are against black women….especially when all i ever hear is black men saying how terrible black women can be, without also saying the reasons why and without trying to discuss solutions.
Ahhh, a good ol' reversal of gender roles. I can dig it. lol.
However, the truth is we need each other. I know some of you brothas have a "preference" for the non-Black, but the overwhelming majority does not. You need us as much as we need you. Don't let the media fool you. We have to figure out a way to get over ourselves, men and women, so we can come together.
And, if you really want a role reversal, you have to take on some of our roles. Check Anna's post above.
I found the post rather comical!
This theory reminds me of the guys that I went to undergrad with. Because I went to a PWI with a small black population (plus that lopsided 7:1 ratio of black women to black men) these fellas walked around like they were God's gift to women. They didn't feel the need to put in any kind of work simply because they had their pick of women. It's not like all of these guys were cute, overly intelligent, or had great personalities. The numbers just worked in their favor. But leave it to me to remind them that if we weren't at this school….you wouldn't get the time of day….so come on down off that high horse!
Sadly those same attitudes of guys that were once students and are now successful has carried over into the young black professional circles. No, I don't mind buying you a drink or even calling,more like texting, you first. But paying for the first date….not happenin'.
Love the blog! I must admit that I read every morning when I get to work to give me something to think about from other perspectives.
thank heavens i am not in america
Be grateful you're not in Canada where the ratio is even more rediculous. Come to Canada brothers!!!
I want to agree, I mean I really do but I cant.
I have a rule. If you wanna holler, mother effin holler. None of this man talks first or woman talks first. If I'm feelin you, I'll holla but if she's feeling me, she'll holla.
Ladies, dont try to be slick and position yourself for the bag. (Positioning for the bag = Liking a guy and instead of hollering, going and dancing near him so that he notices you.)
"We find it so hard to believe that we have worked so hard to be successful and become the crème of the crop only to find out that we need to break our necks for Black women." – What kind of homo sh!t is this? Are you not willing to break your back for your women? Are we turning in our balls now? I'll break my back for her and she shall do the same.
"One of the biggest criticisms of Black women is their independent attitude, or the fact that they act like they don’t need a man." – They act like they dont need a man b/c the crack era stole so many black men from the family. I'm not calling for a pity party for the black woman but if you dont at least acknowledge the role that black men and society as a whole has had in this, you're not looking at the issue wholistically.
"Well let’s keep it real for a second, you need me, much more than I need you. I’m begging for an argument on why I’m wrong" – I dont want a woman who needs me. I want a woman who WANTS me.
I'm all for equal everything but equal doesnt always means the same. I'll support my brethren when we're right (see yesterday's post) but today I have to call shenanigans
"I’m not calling for a pity party for the black woman but if you dont at least acknowledge the role that black men and society as a whole has had in this, you’re not looking at the issue wholistically."
i love black men like this….please teach the others….
*Praise Him!!!! All hope is not lost* Nothing more to add to your comment…but a big fat cosign.
Peyso, this comment makes me want to give you a hug.
Note to self: men have caught on to the whole "dancing nearby with a twinkle in the eye" gambit. New technique must be developed.
"Are you not willing to break your back for your women? Are we turning in our balls now? I’ll break my back for her and she shall do the same."
You and I both will break our backs for OUR women. But what about the women who aren't yours. If you're not in a relationship, are you breaking your back over some woman when you don't even know her real worth? Why are you willing to invest in something without the slightest prospectus?
"They act like they dont need a man b/c the crack era stole so many black men from the family. I’m not calling for a pity party for the black woman but if you dont at least acknowledge the role that black men and society as a whole has had in this, you’re not looking at the issue wholistically."
Then let's be real, Black men have been removed from the family since the time of slavery. Because that's actually where the issue originates. Even so, societal circumstance cannot be a reason for why we go against what's right. The thing is that neither of us really needs the other, but in reality, WE DO need each other. You can have kids without having a partner in life but is that really what's going to make a better world for us all? Should we set our bar at what has worked in the past and give up striving for what's right?
"I dont want a woman who needs me. I want a woman who WANTS me. "
A lot of people say this, I don't agree. My mother ain't never give me nothing I wanted, she gave me what I needed, because those wants and desires change like the weather. You should be with someone that you need. Someone "who completes you." And you should need that person because no one else will work for you, because that's love right there.
I hate the fact that I had to actually exhibit that I have a clue and a shred of intellect in this head of mine. This is supposed to be my outlet lol.
"You and I both will break our backs for OUR women. But what about the women who aren’t yours. If you’re not in a relationship, are you breaking your back over some woman when you don’t even know her real worth? Why are you willing to invest in something without the slightest prospectus?" – Then if you feel that its not worth it for you to do, why ask someone else to do it? When I was young, my mom used to make us give old toys and clothes to charity. I thought I was slick and would try to give broken toys and beat up clothes away. Mom dukes said "if you dont want it, why would someone else?"
"Then let’s be real, Black men have been removed from the family since the time of slavery. Because that’s actually where the issue originates. Even so, societal circumstance cannot be a reason for why we go against what’s right. The thing is that neither of us really needs the other, but in reality, WE DO need each other. You can have kids without having a partner in life but is that really what’s going to make a better world for us all? Should we set our bar at what has worked in the past and give up striving for what’s right?" – I agree to an extent. Firstly, reconstruction and segregation placed the black man back in the community. So though its the same problem, its not as continuous as we like to believe. Secondly, everyone argues against the "independent women syndrome" w/o nominating a way to fix the issue. We are partially to blame for those issues in our women but it seems that we dont want to be a part of the solution. If you have a vested interest in the welfare of your community, this is an issue that we must fix. Telling black woman to "stop it" or "just change, despite the way you've been brought up" is ridiculous and a bit disingenuous.
"A lot of people say this, I don’t agree. My mother ain’t never give me nothing I wanted, she gave me what I needed, because those wants and desires change like the weather. You should be with someone that you need. Someone “who completes you.” And you should need that person because no one else will work for you, because that’s love right there." – Material things/upbringing are not analagous to relationships. My momma gave me what I needed or I would have died. I'm not sure relationships are the same. I think you've been the one drinking the romantic comedy kool aid. The only ppl I've ever needed was my momma, my pops, my lil bro and God. You marry someone because you need them. You get divorced. What happens now? Do you die?
"Then if you feel that its not worth it for you to do, why ask someone else to do it? When I was young, my mom used to make us give old toys and clothes to charity. I thought I was slick and would try to give broken toys and beat up clothes away. Mom dukes said “if you dont want it, why would someone else?”"
I think what I was saying is that by being a successful black man you are already exhibiting the prospectus. And i'm all about women keeping their distance until they have done the background investigation and validated they are dealing with the real thing.
I agree to an extent. Firstly, reconstruction and segregation placed the black man back in the community. So though its the same problem, its not as continuous as we like to believe. Secondly, everyone argues against the “independent women syndrome” w/o nominating a way to fix the issue. We are partially to blame for those issues in our women but it seems that we dont want to be a part of the solution. If you have a vested interest in the welfare of your community, this is an issue that we must fix. Telling black woman to “stop it” or “just change, despite the way you’ve been brought up” is ridiculous and a bit disingenuous.
Reconstruction and segregation hurt the importance of the Black man in the home. The Black man was for so long nothing more than a boy. (Now, "The Man" is a Black man, and that's hot.) But even after slavery and before crack we were put in positions where we couldn't even provide for our families or protect them. Women were getting jobs at faster rates than we were because we couldn't even be a man in this country until just a half decade ago.
In terms of the independent syndrome, a lot of that could be solved if women would just cut some of the foolishness out. How could they do that? If you want to be indpendent, don't shove your independence in my face. That's problem number 1, first date, you talking about I can do abcde for myself! OK, what can we do for each other, what are we trying to do here? I'll revisit this later and give a more in-depth answer, but like I said, check out my past posts on the things women need to do to clear it up.
Material things/upbringing are not analagous to relationships. My momma gave me what I needed or I would have died. I’m not sure relationships are the same. I think you’ve been the one drinking the romantic comedy kool aid. The only ppl I’ve ever needed was my momma, my pops, my lil bro and God. You marry someone because you need them. You get divorced. What happens now? Do you die?
Enn… You need a job, but if lose a job, you will not die. Same with "needing" the person you choose to have in your life as a partner. And maybe we agree, I don't need a woman, never that. But when I choose a wife to marry, it's because I need her. I don't want nothing else.
Amen to alllllll of that. You are certainly conscious of the issues. Thank you for offering a different male perspective.
"I hate the fact that I had to actually exhibit that I have a clue and a shred of intellect in this head of mine."
Beep.Beep.Beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep_________________________________________________________________
Here lies Anna N. She fought a good fight against the powers of testosterone gone wrong. Who knew it would be commom sense from Dr. J that would cause her heart failure. Please send flowers and donations directly to her mama's house.
Finally a honey after my own heart! Respect is due equally. Everybody don't have to do anything for nobody. I like a man or a woman to be! Just be who you are minus-(gender games)( labels ie successful or better than), (crowd pleasing by rule appeasing) (mind manipulation controls) (future forecasting ie outcomes if I do this than she'll do that or vice ) (aspiring agendas) and whatever else comes with this form foreplay. We've been bamboozeld, hoodwinked and you know the rest proper etiquette is real genuine.ooh now that's hot. Get creative have it your way baby and yours honey and yours too sweetie. We just need to teach each other how we want to be treated with compassion and respect, knowing we are different but both strong! Then look into my eyes and ask with yours are you feeling me? You wanna make a rule on whats next? What ever is natural for you two is gonna blow up. We need to learn how to feel what is natural for us inspite of success. We will then get down to our roots and everything else quite naturally. Then what are the rules?
I think its quite simple: Men and women need to be kinder to each other. Some women are definitely tied up in the idea that a man has to pursue her and that her showing the same initiative is somehow wrong. That's fine by me, except when its the same women complaining about not having anyone.
CHUUUCH *snoop dogg voice*
When you guys blog, I feel like you are sitting in my head at a desk with a laptop.
I'm not necessarily for the she needs me more than I need her part … but if she wants me just as I want her … then quit the games and let it be known.
Don't tell me … "I'm supposed to … call you first, cook for you, whine and dine you …." when you are not even giving me any indication that you're interested in pursuing this and not just hungry and broke.
This is 2010 not 1864.
We're in a modern world, pretending we're not.
Nothing is absolute but there are woman out there ready to show "your men" that they don't mind paying for the date or taking them out because they're successful single women. So be careful of holding a hard line now and then complaining when your 40 and single and that there are no good black men left, cause they married white/green/blue/yellow and not you.
Other woman are not "taking" the black men from you, you're giving them away.
*sigh* @ "Other woman are not “taking” the black men from you, you’re giving them away."
you need to read Peyso's comment asap…..
I read his reply prior to adding mine .. he makes some good points but does not negate what I'm saying.
i bet….
Cally's one hundred percent right. And Peyso's response isn't a refutation of it either.
When you take a hard line about what men *must do* you, by definition, exclude guys including ones that you may actually want.
You can't have it both ways–to set a rule like "you must pay for the first date" and then act all sideways when that rule has an unintended and negative consequence.
You gotta take the responsibility–when you reject a guy (or a type of guy) you throw that dude back on the market to be taken by another woman–and you get no say in who that other woman is. Ladies here would be well served to remember the following obvious fact:
You have every right to be as picky, to mandate as many rules as you want….but guys have the equal right to go elsewhere if they do not "meet your standards." If you don't like the results of certain "rules" or "standards" then you have to change them or live with the consequences. If you do like the results, keep them and keep it moving, but it's not mens' job to try to make themselves "perfect" for you.
I have read no one's comments, I just want to shake the hand of the man that wrote this. Spot on.
I think you need to add a "d." to number "2" which is if a guy doesn't reach out or call you, maybe he's just not into you. Forget that you're not the only one trying to make the team, he's not even trying to let you onto the court for a tryout!
Excellent post. I'm actually an advocate for all dates are dutch until we are boyfriend and girlfriend. There are actually many girls that do this. My last girlfriend did.
Now as far as women approaching men. It makes so much more sense. Men don't choose women. Women choose men. If women would approach men they like or at least be more overt in letting a man know when they are interested it would cut down on so much of the BS.
Now Anna, you really think men don't put in as much work before they go to the club 🙂 You need to come to my gym. Dudes is lifting weights for three hours on Saturday afternoon just to achieve maximum swole in the club on Saturday night. 🙂
"Excellent post. I’m actually an advocate for all dates are dutch until we are boyfriend and girlfriend. There are actually many girls that do this. My last girlfriend did." – I agree kind of. I think men should pay for the 1st and 2nd date. Then you alternate. When you're in a relationship, just take turns.
"Now as far as women approaching men. It makes so much more sense. Men don’t choose women. Women choose men. If women would approach men they like or at least be more overt in letting a man know when they are interested it would cut down on so much of the BS." – We all know this doesnt work. Whenever a girl has approached me in HS or college that I didnt like, I feigned mutual interest until i got the beats and then I was out.
"Now Anna, you really think men don’t put in as much work before they go to the club You need to come to my gym. Dudes is lifting weights for three hours on Saturday afternoon just to achieve maximum swole in the club on Saturday night." This is just some true sh!t here lol
“Now Anna, you really think men don’t put in as much work before they go to the club You need to come to my gym. Dudes is lifting weights for three hours on Saturday afternoon just to achieve maximum swole in the club on Saturday night.” This is just some true sh!t here lol
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Nothin like hittin the club with your swole on a 100. Usually leads to random women feelin you up and grabbin your a$$. Women are guilty of some agressibe behavior in the club too. 🙂
This made me laugh out loud!!!! Why oh why do men think that because their arms and chests are on "swole" that we're not gonna see that pot belly in your muscle shirt?? We SEE that! lol!!!
"'Now as far as women approaching men. It makes so much more sense. Men don’t choose women. Women choose men. If women would approach men they like or at least be more overt in letting a man know when they are interested it would cut down on so much of the BS.' – We all know this doesnt work. Whenever a girl has approached me in HS or college that I didnt like, I feigned mutual interest until i got the beats and then I was out."
THANK YOU.
You were interested in the beats at least, right? So you were interested, just not in the same thing.
Wow….sounds like you went to Morehouse. That is all…
#cannonsfired
I did not and would not go to Morehouse. No shots, but something about going to school with all boys scares me. And I can't understand how they have people there who don't like women, with all them fine women across the street who been stuck up in the house not studying they whole life.
Even though I must say, Cornell's girls, way more stuck up and they really never been out the house. Chuuuuch!
me of all people went to an all woman's college. it wasnt too bad though…
He couldn't have went to Morehouse. It's a proven fact that every guy the graduate from Morehouse would try to squeeze in the word "Matriculate" (or other forms) into their writings. I haven't noticed this as of yet. lol
lol…very true. I've dated my fair share of M-house men and this entry sounds like one of the first lessons they teach at that school.
An inflated sense of entitlement and a pass to not treat ladies like ladies. Long and short of it is this, men (successful or not) should court women. I've found that when a woman pursues a man, the men lose interest and become turned off.
Truth: A husband should love his wife more than she loves him (and this starts with dating/courting). So bunk that, I'm not hitting you up first OR pay for the first date, otherwise we're just hanging out, and trust I have girlfriends for that
It's not that we lose interest…it's just that it wasn't a match… a risk that men have to accept as commonplace in our roles as initiator. Women, trust me when I say that a man's lack of interest post-initiation is not punishment for defying the social order. It's one of those EA Sports things–it's in the game.
I hate to say it, because I love this blog, but sometimes (this week especially*) I come to the comments section and I get more fearful of not finding someone than I do when I read the statistics on black women's lack of options.
Try putting yourself in the shoes of a man. Looking at some of this stuff from a males perspective. All the post this week have really just been men venting a little bit. I think if women had to do a lot of the things men are expected to do, they'ld vent about it too.
And it's not like we sayin we don't treat are women with respect. We're just kind of pointing out some of the hypocrisy inherent in the unwritten code of conduct we all adhere to in dating. I think in the year 2010 a little more parity in the dating rules is warranted if women expect to be treated as equals in every other area of life.
Oh, I guess I forgot to actually write the footnote there. I haven't had much issue with any of the original posts this week and can definitely see where both sides have been coming from. It's the comments section, and now that I'm trying to explain why it's got me feeling like that, I can't put it into words.
in a perfect world. lol i have been approached like this before. let me say that there is a fine line between a woman taking control, being aggressive and pursing a man to turning into a stalker. it may seem flattering that a woman/women is/are vying for your attention but that ish can get old real quick.
i would like to make an amendment to number one though. women can ask me for my number and call me first but it just feels weird if a woman paid for the first date regardless who invited who.
Thank You! The voice of reason. Give me a break, men would get tired of women coming too forthright with them all the time. I do not care what you say. If all women began to act in this manner I am 100% sure that men would be missing the way things used to be where there was a bit of a chase and mystery to women… I think it's cute SOME TIMES when a woman buys a guy a drink and shows her interest outright in some other form cause i've done it before…but it's not a habit I plan on making.
LOL you know you're crazy right? But it brings up an interesting conversation as far as successful Black men being a limited commodity (as if they and we didn't already know this), and Black women expecting them to still keep their asses in line and not let that sh*t go to their heads.
"A man becomes as attractive as an attractive woman when he becomes successful and is publicly noted. Power`s an aphrodisiac." -50cent (ha)
So then they should be treated as attractive women???? EHhh maybe by the unattractive women.
You guys are bringing the heat all week. I like how you worked as a unit … different topics.
Its been a great week, shame I might not be around tom
This made me laugh out loud!!!! Why oh why do men think that because their arms and chests are on “swole” that we’re not gonna see that pot belly in your muscle shirt?? We SEE that! lol!!!
________________________________
I can tell you as a gym rat. The dudes with the big arms and pot bellys are not the ones working out on Saturdays. Those are the dudes that only work on Mondays and Wednesdays when the women come in for aerobics. Only real gym rats work out on Saturdays, Sundays.
The big arm dudes…I call them tank top dudes….or wife beater dudes. They don't want to be in shape. They just want to look good in a tank top. 🙂
Note to ladies: If you want to know if a dude really works out. Look at his back or his legs. People that don't really work out never waste time on the back or legs……never mind the fact that these are your two biggest muscle groups.
"I can tell you as a gym rat. The dudes with the big arms and pot bellys are not the ones working out on Saturdays. Those are the dudes that only work on Mondays and Wednesdays when the women come in for aerobics. Only real gym rats work out on Saturdays, Sundays." – I guess i fail the gym rat test. I hate working out on the weekends, I rather play ball.
"The big arm dudes…I call them tank top dudes….or wife beater dudes. They don’t want to be in shape. They just want to look good in a tank top." – This is me. Jay Cutler once said "I dont want to be able to lift 500lbs, I just wanna look like i can"
"Note to ladies: If you want to know if a dude really works out. Look at his back or his legs. People that don’t really work out never waste time on the back or legs……never mind the fact that these are your two biggest muscle groups." – CHUUUUCH. Biggest muscle groups means the most calories burned. Working these other groups helps everywhere else (Back = Biceps, Legs = Core) and prevents u from looking like a damn triangle
I aint gonna front, I got the mini keg. You know the little one you can get from the grocery store, I think Heineken makes it. I used to have the big keg of Natty Light but that's when I was built like Terrance Cody. I'm trying to be more like Joey Porter these days though.
I feel you. Flat stomachs are a matter of genetics mostly. I was born with a pot belly and will die with one no matter how many situps I do. It's just my genetics.
Weekend workout is the best. But yeah the gym is like a ghost town Saturday afternoon which is how I like it. Suprisingly a lot of people work out on Sundays though. At least at my gym.
I swear the back is like an obsession. Once you realize all the positive benefits. Most people don't realize working your back will make you appear almost 3 inches taller because your posture improves.
Well, most of us don't MIND the potbelly….just don't squeeze it into a muscle shirt thinkin' it's the business, lol. It's actually easier for a guy to hide a belly than it is for a woman (empire waist pregnancy-lookin' shirts are not hot in the club).
I went to a meeting for an hour and cotdamn.
Let me just say this and then i'm going to go through the comments and respond. Black men have not given up on Black women. I, Dr. J, can personally say that if you go and sort my posts you will see several posts by me, in which I provide solutions to the issues that men have with women. I don't just rant and rant and rant, (even though as we mentioned yesterday, that might be all some of the readers ever really pay attention to).
PS – Currently, if you are not paying attention, or missed it, me and @peyso are actually having a great discussion. Meanwhile, my arch nemesis @AnnaN and me are discussing dating policy and are going to attempt to pass reform this evening.
if you are discussing it on the internet then thats cool. but in real life when yall sit around in a group listing off the reasons why you dislike black women…its a different story.
yall know what im talking about. what goes on in the internet world does not cover up what goes on in the real world…..big difference..
but i will leave it alone……..
by the way, i do see that on this site there arent just rants about black women……
At the risk of losing some credibility in the League of Cocksman, I must disagree with some of what you said homie. RCLS and the League of Cocksmen, please hear me out.
Some of what's being said here reminds me of that Buppie Black Guy attitude which I can't get down with. I found that fellas in cities like ATL and DC have a high horse attitude because the ratio is in their favor. I understand that we're college educated, successful, etc., but I never felt like that puts me on a level higher or allows me to dictate a gender role. But then again, I never been one for the dating games.
The man in me wants to pursue women. I like women starting up conversation or doing whatever, but at the end of the day the old school mentality I have kicks into gear. At the same time, I'm not going to turn down a drink if a woman buys it for me. I have bills to pay too. Sidenote – I like a Stoli O with Tonic.
What I'm trying to say is that, I'm not willing to release my role as a man for free drinks and to kick back so women can chase me. It ain't in me. I acknowledge and support the statesman from World Alliance of Successful Men, but this Cocksman can't fully rock with this new legislature.
Joe Lieberman is that you?
(Some of y'all won't get this until the way home.)
lmao!
are you calling him a fake man? a traitor of sorts lol…
my major in college was political science…..
Only Tea Baggers do name-calling man.
I'm still confused as to why people call those guys tea-baggers. Like… i'm not going to call another person a tea-bagger, point blank, period. They are members of the Tea Party. They drink firefly and sip tazo tea.
You know I couldn't resist:
"This is how business gets done!
Women, look at this right here! Men we sit down and we get our ish together. We are on the same page."
– Dr. J
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Bwahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!
*slaps knee, wipes eyes*
*Deputy Dawg wheeze*
LMAO!!!!
i forgot he said that earlier…..glad you pointed that one out…..
This is a bit Arlen Specter-ish…..
loved what you had to say though Seattle…..
this was cute. I enjoyed reading. good thoughts–IF the roles were reversed. luckily for us women they are not hahahahahahahahaha!
oh and funny everyone is saying how they don't need anyone. I just wrote a blog post yesterday that says the opposite–so I'll be the lone dissenter (I'm assuming I am–haven't read all the comments yet). no man is an island–we all need somebody. I don't look at need as a negative thing…
We need each other. All that no one needs no one bullisht is keeping us apart. Seriously… Now that I got the serious part out of the way…
LOL!!! This post is too cute! Now I will say I have called first. ABSOLUTELY HATE IT BUT WILL DO IT. I have initiated dates, never the first date. I've paid for dates, never the first one. And buying a random dude in the club a drink… Please. Especially when I don't expect (often times don't even want) him to buy me one. I turn down drinks. Always have unless we already know each other or you know one of my friends that I'm with OR we've been having good conversation & I think you're interesting… Then we can get to the drink buying. But if I don't have any interest in you… Keep your money. Please!
I do not believe we are in desperate times. Black men are not that hard to find. You see them everytime you go out. Expand your boundaries & give the eye to the white guy with dark hair & blue eyes who has been cutting eyes at you ALL night. Take that Latino guy up on his offer to take you dancing. We have options here! Lets exercise them, goddesses.
I am, however, working on approaching men. *screams* The mess terrifies me beyond belief! So any willing males that wanna help this old fashioned girl step out of the box a little…give me some tips. From a man's perspective. Lawd, bless my soul when I try it. Approaching a man was on the list of things I'd never do right before dating white men BUT times are changing so help a goddess out!
Other than that… Love the post! LOL… Peace.
no interracial dating for me. i love black men unconditionally…and i just dont see dating other races as a helpful solution. it only covers up the problems. and because i want to see the black community flourish, i have to say stick together and support black love….
but thats just me. some people do call me a racist, but it is what it is. to each his own though…i try not to knock others for jumping fence……
ditto on that.
We need each other. All that no one needs no one mess is keeping us apart. Seriously… Now that I got the serious part out of the way…
LOL!!! This post is too cute! Now I will say I have called first. ABSOLUTELY HATE IT BUT WILL DO IT. I have initiated dates, never the first date. I've paid for dates, never the first one. And buying a random dude in the club a drink… Please. Especially when I don't expect (often times don't even want) him to buy me one. I turn down drinks. Always have, unless we already know each other or you know one of my friends that I'm with OR we've been having good conversation & I think you're interesting… Then we can get to the drink buying. But if I don't have any interest in you… Keep your money. Please!
I do not believe we are in desperate times. Black men are not that hard to find. You see them everytime you go out. Expand your boundaries & give the eye to the white guy with dark hair & blue eyes who has been cutting eyes at you ALL night. Take that Latino guy up on his offer to take you dancing. We have options here! Lets exercise them, goddesses.
I am, however, working on approaching men. *screams* The mess terrifies me beyond belief! So any willing males that wanna help this old fashioned girl step out of the box a little…give me some tips. From a man's perspective. Lawd, bless my soul when I try it. Approaching a man was on the list of things I'd never do right before dating white men BUT times are changing so help a goddess out!
Other than that… Love the post! LOL… Peace.
I am horrible at noticing when a women is flirting with me so subtle signals don't work. Here are two that have worked for me in the past:
A women at the club was standin next to me at the bar. She asked me what my name was. Pretty simple right. It worked. Even I couldn't miss that signal. Obviously if a woman I don't know asked me my name in a club she is interested. I picked up the convo from there. If a guy can't pick up that signal he is stupid and you should move on.
A women at a party I was talking put her hand on my knee and left it there a little to long. I got the hint. Now some men might not pick up on that one cause some flirtatious women tend to do a lot of touching when they have no interest. So it can be a little confusing. But a brief somewhat inappropriate touch will usually get a point across.
Just like with women, 1) a simple 'hi, what's up' works, 2)sincere compliments go a long way 3) being willing to talk about yourself (no TMIs), and listen to that person…genuine curiosity. If you are a halfway attractive woman, you have to do something galactically stupid to mess it up.
This reminds me of my "If I ruled the World" post … a lovely lovely dream.
I couldn't (wouldn't) read all the back and forth in places, but the blog post was interesting.
Gender roles have shifted, once they settle and the new contract is established, some of this mess will settle itself out.
I think part of the problem for black men is: choice. There's too much of it. The gift and curse of too many choices.
[Disclaimer: I live in DC and I love just walkin home b/c I'm bound to see some beautiful womenz on my way home. I also understand the dilemma of choice.]
Thanks, J. I could do the asking the name one. Hand on the knee… We might have to work up to that! Lol!!! But walking up to a dude and asking his name… Simple & genius. 🙂
I respect where you're coming from, but I call bullsh*t.
As much as men SAY they want an independent woman, they really don't.
I'm sorry, but If I'm the predator and you're the prey in our romantic equation, I'm going to just be in it for the chase or the temporary. I would never actively pursue a man I cared about because every guy friend I have (and I have quite the stableful) cannot STAND a broad who makes it too easy for them. The fun is in the pursuit and men are suspicious of things they can catch too easily, IMO.
Now, I understand chivalry is dead or should be or whatever, and I am perfectly happy to go dutch on a date and open my own car door, but I am saying flat-out that I will NEVER respect a man that I feel I caught and trapped. It subjects him in my mind to something that is weaker than me and I need a
strong African warriorreal man to hold me down. And that means one who goes after what he wants, namely me.So, I respect what you're trying to do, but as aforementioned… Bullsh*t.
Um…. lol, well I don't like a predator. But I do like a girl to stroke…me a little.
Question: Do you think a man should respect a women that he feels he caught and trapped?
I do feel like you respect things that you earn versus things that are basically given to you. It's like that with material sh*t, why not with love sh*t?
I don't think we are talking about serving up your pu$$y on a platter 🙂 We are talking about letting a man know that you are interested and then letting him take it from there. He can still pursue you, wine you and dine you. But at least he knows off the top that there is some mutuall interest. Even in this thread women have said they hate being harrassed by men in the club that they are not interested in. Have yall ever asked yourself why men harrass women? Because the only way we know a women is interested half the time is to bother every women we see until someone responds to us bothering them.
Now second. I always caution women. If you always want a man to make first contact. You will probably end up with a player type that cheats on you and dogs you. Cause they are the smoothe types that excel at approaching strange women and pursuing them. You're passing over a lot of good men that just don't happen to be a smoothe as the guy that approaches 10 women in the club and leaves with 6 phone numbers.
See, now, I'm totally down with indicating interest and light flirting and basically letting a man
who is working with more intelligence than the average grapeknow that I'm digging him.This post is less about women loosening the f*ck up and smiling more at clubs (trust, I hate mean-mugging b*tches too) and more about the reversal of gender roles and I'm just saying to men out there, be careful what you wish for.
Question: do you really want a wifey who will smash and dash on you without so much as a
turkey sandwichkiss goodbye?Question: do you really want a wifey who will smash and dash on you without so much as a turkey sandwich kiss goodbye?
__________________________
A lot of married chicks are already there. Sign of the times.
No man is an island. We all need each other! As an educated, progressive, financially and emotionally secure female. I don't have a problem hollering at a dude or calling first or inviting him out first. Times have changed.
I was born and raised in NY and found that dudes were more aggressive there and did most of the chasing. I'm now a Atlanta resident and I can smile, wink all day yet dudes won't approach. WTH! So I've taken matters into my own hand. lol I've approached dudes and it is not that bad.
lol I live in Atlanta and I know how it is. You gotta snap up a man before the guy next to you does lol.
I was just about to say that the reason men aint l;ookin is because they checkin dudes, lmao
where's my comment?
Why are roles reversing & who said chivalry is dead? Chivalry is dead only if you allow it to be. Men really don't want the roles reversed. Don't just reverse the roles of dating & then get married & all of a sudden want to be 'the man'. Understand reversing the roles is a lot to ask.
I just take this post as a sometimes thing. Maybe, every so often, a man would like for the scenarios in this post to happen to him. *shrug*
Me, give me a man that goes for what he wants as somebody stated before. There is something about a man that goes after what he wants especially when it's me. That's how a man gets treated like a man. You want to be the woman & get treated as such? You'll be sitting on the curb.
Now with showing a man that I'm interested… I have been confused several times thinking he knew & he really had no idea I was feeling him. Women & men look at things different. Women we have to be very blunt when we're interested in a man, I see. Men aren't good with hints.
#1 – You think making all this dark skin look this damn good is easy cuz we don't spend all day doing it? We appreciate the lengths some of you go through, but if the process is too much for you, downsize and be more effecient, or stop complaining.
#2 – Completely ridiculous.
#3 – If it's a gentle grab, I'm sure most dudes won't care.
4) Not a problem. This is the reason men play a game of Cee-lo or Madden before hitting the streets…the loser is assigned First Infantry Wing Man duty and is responsible for entertaining said ugly woman. Cute fat girls don't count as taking an L.
#5 – Save the time and money, get 2 lean cuisines, and break out your best Vicky Secret outfit.
#6 – He probably wasn't actually waiting on the call…so I guess this can stay.
#7 – This is already the status quo.
#8 – You're buggin'.
#9 – Yea…fine…whatever…
# 10 – Not a problem, seeing as you'll be spending the extra 24 cents on us.
#11 – See #8
LOL these blogs are making a sista jaded and I am not even old or experienced enough. I have to remind myself every few seconds that there is someone for everyone and these silly musing are not the gospel.
SMH
Good week! I actually thought Dr. J's post would be more misogynistic. I'm pleasantly surprised lol
As a black man, my heart agrees 100% about the New Rules of Engagement of Dating for Black women. It would be great just for one day. It is good to dream. Yet my head (the top one) doesn't agree. As men, we are not going to win that battle. I don't even know if we should fight it.
My two cents:
For brothers, 1) I don't think it helps that we see women as our "reward" for being successful black men. They are sentient beings with free will that have a number of things going on with them at any moment. It's a little sexist and just impractical because it can breed resentment (and the same entitled attitude we accuse women of having). Resentment can leech you of the morale and stamina you need to be in the pursuit of Ms right (or even Ms Right Now).
2) A variation/corrollary on 1) They owe us nothing!!! We don't have to be tricks/simps, AND we can do inexpensive "qualifying" dates; we don't have to break the bank for high-end jazz-clubs and five-star restaurants on the first date.
3)Get out the box of hollering at women at clubs. There is no cover charge, "ladies free before 11" or buying drinks at laundromats, supermarkets, post offices, bank lines…or the paranoid, defensive politics of clubbing. You get a snapshot of her in everyday life. The club ain't going nowhere; so do something different.
4) as men, we have MAD ADVANTAGES!!! we aren't judged as harshly for our closeness to the dominant beauty standards. Women care more about HOW we look rather than WHAT we look like. We have more power in deciding WHO, WHEN, IF, HOW MANY and HOW we approach. They have the final say, but for women, that ability is nothing without opportunity. Having said that…
To Sisters,
1) More women initiate than you think. It's not as rare or taboo as you believe. I, as well as other male friends, have been approached by attractive BLACK women before (and the social order/universe didn't implode) , and they had the advantage because women generally don't have the guts to do so. In most of my relationships, there was always some mutual chasing in the beginning. No dude I know who has been approached have ever said "she didn't let me initiate, so my d*ck got soft, and i gave her a fake number/walked away/clowned her"
2) a man paying for everything does not measure how much he is/isn't into YOU…it measures a) his access to money b) his knowledge of protocol and c) how much he wants the booty.
3) Tradition/the desire to know if he's interested/being ladylike are ALL EXCUSES TO AVOID THE RISK OF REJECTION! I know how to initiate, but in all fairness, just like housework is not women's work–just work that men were too lazy to do so they redefined it–approaching a potential partner is not men's work-just work that women are too scared to do. Men are taught to accept the risk, bother everybody until somebody buys our brand of bulls*it, and treat it like a numbers game.
In short, everybody should just do what works and not strive so hard to be "right" about men and women's places.
Interesting, interesting, interesting. I think men create a false of urgency which can put women in a desperate state of being. No man or woman on this earth should be desperate for a relationship. A relationship should not define the person God has created you to be. A partner can definitely enhance what's already there, but desperation is a state of being that should be abolished in every single person's mind. As one of the ladies above stated, there is a shortage of good men and good women!
I've enjoyed reading all these posts. However, it further lets me know that black men seem to have a strong sense of entitlement. You want everything, while putting in the least effort. By no means should a woman be paying for the first date, or any date. If men want to wear the pants, they need to step up and take charge. Personally, I don't think black women should be crying about finding successful black men, because they're clearly not looking for successful black women.
Do you believe a day will come when it is easier for black women to find suitable black men to see romantically?
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