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Jill Scott, Get Over It

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There were a ton of articles I contemplated posting, and I had some good ones lined up for you, but we broke stride and went with current affairs.

If case you didn’t get a chance to read what Jill Scott had to say on Interracial Dating, you can catch up with the conversation here; http://thoughtmerchant.posterous.com/jill-scott-talks-about-interracial-relationsh. Make sure you read it thoroughly because if you don’t, you will get you’re a*s handed to you in the comments section.

Jill touched on some points and I first want to commend her and state that few women have articulated why they feel a certain way about interracial dating so well.

Jill you my homegirl and I got all your albums, but I will have to respectfully disagree with you.

SBM massive, as I speak on this, first and foremost it’s about the best advice I was ever given about advice. “Take advice from whom it’s given.” Jill Scott is a divorced, mother of one, who’s marriage failed after one year. She compares her Black men to heavy dark liquored beverages, she’s also not the skinniest woman, but doesn’t have a problem telling all of us that she has problem with people who keep Getting In The Way of what she’s doing. She’s doing Tyler Perry movies, (which might I add releases this weekend, might I get a, “publicity” from the congregation), but It’s Love.

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Jill Scott was not brought up racist, but like most Black people in our country, we need to admit that we were brought up as racialists. While you may not be in a position to exert power over another race, you have been raised attributing certain outcomes in life to race. Using race to determine and interpret future occurrences or situations that may arise in someone’s life.

Jill also mentioned that we have always stood together, and to that, I’m asking where are you now? The Black Woman of today bears very little resemblance to the Black woman of Slavery and the Civil Rights movement. Black women have adapted to the times, they have evolved so much in the last 20, 30, or 50 years, therefore it has to be okay for the men to do so as well. In my opinion, we’ve spent so much time NOT needing each other, that we don’t even WANT each other anymore. And we’re not going to sit here today and throw rocks as to whether Black men left or were removed from the household, we’ll be here all night.

Also, you don’t need to remind Black men of what we’ve been through on account of White women. Keep in mind, that you don’t want us to remind you what we’ve been through on account of Black women neither. As a Black man when you are born you get a download of information, similar to when Neo receives training in the Matrix. In this download you get s*x, dating, relationships, how to fry chicken, pee standing up, ways to go to jail, jail sentences to expect for anything, and how to keep a straight face when you know your boss is racist. If your parents are wealthy they may spring for, “How to dribble a basketball.” The point is you do not have to travel too far to find out that up until recently Black men running around chasing white women was a good way to end up dead or in jail.

Jill Scott spoke about how it feels to see a Black man with a white woman, and the cross she has to bear. No one will take that away from you, sister. No one. That’s real. And a lot of Black men would not be here without a lot of Black women who carried a cross that they didn’t ask for in life and we appreciate that. But don’t put it on young successful Black men, it’s not our responsibility to fix it by only dating Black women. Let us be great. Give us the ability to make choices in life, and we will afford you that same. It was said in the transcript, “Our minds do understand that people of all races find genuine love in many places. We dig that the world is full of amazing options.” If you understand that and really mean it, and aren’t just saying it, then you have respect that not every Black man is going to solely date Black women.

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My sincere advice to all Black women is that they stop belaboring on this point. If anything carried me though the trials and tribulations of this world it would be this excerpt, “Accept the things I cannot change.” I go to work everyday and I can’t change the fact that I’m Black, nor can I change the fact, that people at my job judge me and may be racist. But I’m over it. And just like you women love to yell, “OVER IT.” Then by all means, sister, be “over it” with interracial dating. You really don’t have time to be worried about the men who do not want to be dating you.

Comment(229)

  1. " You really don’t have time to be worried about the men who do not want to be dating you."

    Your absolutely correct. I for one am biologically hard wired not to like, crush, care, look, etc at another human being who has no interest in me. (In the romantic sense)

    I see and understand Jills perspective, but I do agree with the gist of this post.

    BTW, they gave her an actual column from the beginning of the year. Its kind of sorta semi permanent I believe.

  2. I agree with you Dr. Jay. I have my opinions about interracial dating as it pertains to me, but I don't give a ripe fig what anyone else chooses to do. I don't understand why does.

  3. we’ve spent so much time NOT needing each other, that we don’t even WANT each other anymore

    Could not agree more with that statement. We are so busy tearing each other down that we will never enjoy each other. So what if someone has preferences? You probably would not date them anyway!

    I like her music but who made Jill Scott the 'spokeswoman for black women" everywhere?

  4. I understand where Jill is coming from. I get it. She says, "there is a quiet pain". I totally agree. Although, there is essentially nothing I can do about a black man preferring or loving a white woman. It does make me "wince" too as Jill stated, when I hear about a successful black man, first time married…and its becky. Im sorry. I understand love finds you and color should not matter…but, I feel a certain way and it does go back to the history of this country and slavery, its 400 years removed, YES. But there are still repercussions from it, we are still feeling the fallout…

    Don't get me wrong, I understand the black man is going to date who he will. I am not hateful about it. I'm not going to make a big stink over it..but, I get where Jill was coming from….I'm over it, but alot of black women feel this way. Its just a fact so it must be addressed.

    1. I'm sorry Queeny. But just because it bothers you doesn't mean it has to be addressed. In reality, interracial dating is not the problem with the black family. And these couples do not owe the world anything. As long as it is with another adult human being, no one should have to explain their relationship.

      I'm not trying to oversell it.. but mixed couples should be revered for their courage. Its hard going thru life with everyone judging your decision and looking at you. Than to make that relationship work?

      Heck anybody not makes a relationship work in this day and age should be applauded.

      1. Like I said I am not going to make a big stink on it. Dr. J wrote a post about the subject and I addressed it….that is all.

      2. I agree with you CHeeKZ. Interracial dating is absolutely not the root cause of problems or a break down in anybody's family other than those immediately involved in the relationship. It really is nobody’s business, people should concern themselves with the things that concern them.

        Great post Dr. J (have an issue with a few details but hey..) the issue is tired to me and I think people do need to get over it. It is a personal choice to date whomever we like. Holding some sort of anger or hurt about the issue is not going to change something you personally have no control over. I don’t love anybody that doesn’t love me, so if a man doesn’t want to date me, marry me.. I can surely find somebody who does.

  5. I'm with Chocolate Drop. This subject still hurts like a new wound. Can't keep beating a dead horse. I'm a "whincer" for life. :-

      1. No I'm not commenting because of this topic…not because it's not about sex. I have more to talk about than sex my dear.

        How many times under past articles have I said something when one of you men say something against black women. I can predict a bad storm.

        Plus, I'm against interracial dating…nothing personal, just business.

        So please don't ever assume sh*t when it comes to me. How the h*ll you gonna speak for me? Lol…thats some funny a$$ sh*t.

        1. Dear Drop of Chocolate….

          Isnt the fact that interracial dating bothers you more of a reason for you to stay with Dr J today?

          Would you say you are 'happy' being tight about IR dating? Are you trying to hold on to this viewpoint?

          I only ask b/c your viewpoint is entirely different from that of the honorable Dr MLK's dream.

        2. My dude Cheekz… do not talk to her. She's out, she's out, she's not getting back in the game until the Bills win the Super Bowl. I'm not having racists on my post. She's the kid in elementary school who could never be goose. We got 13 players and we playing 6 on 6, she's not getting picked.

        3. LOL

          I'm not racist sweetheart. My OPINIONS on interracial dating have more to do with black people than white people. I have nothing against white people. The only problem I have with interracial dating is when I hear black men blame black women. That is my only concern. If you want to hop the fence, then that is not my concern. But please just dont tear each other down in the process. That was my point….

        4. Dear Chocolate Drop,

          Most of your posts here have been quite excellent but I have to get the red card on this one.

          "Saying something against black women" is not inherently wrong—after all, how many sisters here bash black men and say "Amen" or "co-sign" to that without a moment of self-reflection or critique or hesitation?

          I agree 100% with Dr. J but I'll go a step further. For someone to be out there saying "I don't support interracial marriage/dating" that's a component of what makes the lives of these couples so difficult, not to mention, it's an attitude no different than the white men who would arrest or lynch black men for going after their women.

          It's an outdated belief, and one worthy of public discussion. If it's wrong for black men to "close ranks" and say that black women should ONLY date them, why is it acceptable for black women to be hypocritical and expect the same and then rant on ABC News, Russia Today, etc.?

          Dr. J.'s post was very very diplomatic, far more than he had to be. It tried to express empathy with a position he doesn't necessarily agree. If you can't do the same, then there's nothing we need to assume here about your intentions–it's quite obvious.

        5. So worried about how I said something, that yall missed my whole point.

          My point was….I don't support interracial dating because I hear black men AND black women for that matter bash each other and blame each other for reasons why they choose to hop fence.

          I hear black men say black women push them away with their "ms independent attitudes". I hear black women say all black men do is smoke weed and go to jail. These are the things that I am against. If you want to date interracially, that Is cool with me. I have family memebers who are of other races whom I love with all my hearts. Again, nothing to do with other races, but everything to do with our race. If people could just date other races without blaming their own race, then I could get with it.

          Even on this blog I have read black say "this is why white women are taking your men" and things like that. This is my only concern.

        6. Cheekz…interracial dating does not bother me at all. It is the reasoning behind it that bothers me. Not saying that every black man (or woman) who dates interracially needs or gives a reason for it. But we all know that we (in general) do tend to bash each other as a group when speaking about dating/relationships.

          Black women don't like anal…."Thats why white women are taking black men away from yall".

          I really do just want us as a group to love each other. Of course you can love who you want, but you dont have to be against each other to love others….

        7. @C. Drop

          The reality is no one group is gonna love within itself 100%. Thats not possible in human existence. I dont even think this is a us vs them or black men vs black women post. Its a "why the thought of judging ppl for IR dating is outdated" post. So I believe your fears can be quelled

        8. @ Steetz…I feel you on that. That is the only response I have gotten that makes me think. “The reality is no one group is gonna love within itself 100%. Thats not possible in human existence.”

          I guess that is my mistake. You have inspired me and I thank you for that….

          @ AB below….???

      2. Chocolate, unfortunately I have to say that we did indeed get the point. The way you said the point IS the point.

        You refer to the rhetoric of how black men and black women describe the other group in their decision for inter-racial dating.

        Yet you refer to "Black America" (with capitalization) as if its monolithic. You refer/signpost to the other "blacks" who oppose interracial dating, whose logic often devolves into 100% racism, sexism and bigotry. They too say "what you don't support a difference of opinions" when challenged for 1950s "Birth of a Nation" thinking. One can't have it both ways–sounding like a bigot, then critiquing others for their "problematic rhetoric" then using that same rhetoric again and again and again.

        I think the reason this issue keeps coming up is that it cuts to the quick of a lot of pathological beliefs in black culture/politics. So often we don't know how to get out of each other's way, letting others live the lives they want.

        We waste all of this time ranting about "half breeds" or what makes a real black man "black enough" etc.instead of focusing on our own life projects and overcoming oppression.

        That's my problem with your comments (both the content and the rhetoric), Chocolate. They come from a place that says "I have a right to not like you" to someone, but yet surprised that the audience says "we don't like you for disliking us." Let's get 100 on this: who the heck would smile after being told "I don't like you?"

        When you say you don't like "half breeds" it's not merely a "difference of opinion" it's a big flip off to a LOT of people who shouldn't be opposed based on a factor they can't control (who their parents are). When you say you "it is what it is" or "it's not personal it's business' it is most certainly personal because it is stigmatizing a whole group of people who in their own lives contribute significantly to "Black America."

        The value of "black solidarity" doesn't justify disliking or dismissing people who deserve to be seen as human beings with agency. If you don't believe me, just ask black feminists who didn't like how black nationalists treated them.

        So Dr. J. and my and others' responses are not about attacking "black women" per se, but instead attacking one particular view that even many other sisters would never and ought never endorse.

        1. Proud "half-breed" 🙂 Funny thing is, I find that people that are unaware of how beautiful they are…they are the ones that are offended by such "descriptions". Never ever ever give someone power over your emotions. I'm a proud "half-breed"…"oreo-cookie"…whatever you want to call me. I love me…love the way I look…wouldn't change it if I could.

          Nice going AB..

  6. I didn't get that Jill was laying blame or saying only date sistas. She was just giving voice to a very common feeling. Especially when you can meet a brotha, get a gut feeling that he doesn't mess with sistas before you KNOW, and then find out that you're right. It's really just a feeling that some men give off. Kind of a "Eat shyt, sis" attitude. Oh well – my first criteria for liking you is that you must like me, lol.

    But who gives a flying f**k about interracial dating on such a momentous occasion? Today is a special day….a day to be remembered for all time…today is..

    THE 10TH ANNIVERSARY OF MY 21ST BIRTHDAY!!!!!! I'M STILL ALIVE! YAY ME! *adjusts chin strap on my protective helmet* YAAAAAAAAAYYYYYY!!!!!

    And I BEDNOT see any April Fool's jokes! None!

    1. That's the way I was looking at it too. Now, I have no idea how this topic even came up in the interview, but it seems that Jill was more trying to put words to the feelings or give an explanation of some sort. I don't think she was condoning feeling that way. Just my 02.

      Happy Anniversary to your Birthday, girl!!!! I hope you are doing big thangs today.

  7. I will comment so that others won't assume sh*t about why I'm not.

    This is the only topic that can get me pissed off. I hear so many black men bash black women, that I just cannot support interracial dating. I support black love to the fullest. The day black men stop bashing and blaming black women for hoping the fence, that's the day I will be alright with interracial dating. But because black love is so weak right now, I cannot support it. Again, nothing personal, just business. And my opinions go a lot deeper than that…as in, I don't like half breeds. But that is something I won't get into. Also, I tend to be radical, as in racist. It is what it is. We tear each other apart so much it's sickening. Trying so d*mn hard to fit into mainstream (white) America, that we are forgetting to support our own culture…who the h*ll else will? So sad.

    Thank God my fiance is super dark. Soon dark people will be extinct lol…I laugh to keep from crying….

    1. I hope to God that you don't procreate. 1) I don't think you read my article, because I didn't bash Black women at one point. So I guess you don't mind me interracial dating. Furthermore, that means this is the day Black men have stopped bashing Black women. 2) You don't like half-breeds. What type of self-hating individual are you?! Cue Fab…. aaaaa where do they dat at? 3) Tearing down our own culture? Did you forget you was posting on a black blog… hilarious.

      Please don't comment anymore. I'll sign your hall pass. You AT&T right now… "nah… you good!"

      1. Lol…I will procreate now that you said that. We need more black people like me who support black love.

        1. I never said that you bashed black women

        2. It is what it is. Just like you have a right to like certain people, I have a right to not like certain people.

        3. There is a difference between tearing individual black people down and tearing black people as a group down.

        And did you just tell me not to comment again? LOL. Of course people don't want to hear a difference of opinions on this topic. I forget that everyone is supposed to be all for interracial dating. Sorry, I have a mind of my own. It might be trendy to hop the fence, but I will forever be a leader.

        Those are my opinions. Just like you have a right to engage in interracial dating, I have a right to not support it. Again, nothing personal.

        Believe it or not, but I actually don't care who people date, just as long as you don't make excuses and blame black women for the reasons why. I'm not talking about what you wrote in this article…I'm talking about the comments I hear from black men daily. I'm speaking in general about my reasons for not supporting it. I have that right.

        1. Wait, so it's wrong for black men to "Tear down black women" but yet its PERFECTLY ACCEPTABLE to tear down "half-breeds" (never mind the dehumanizing rhetoric)?

          Can someone explain how this "logic" makes sense?

        2. I'm really gonna avoid answering that question because it would really make you go off…seriously it would. And I really am trying to change. Again, its a work in progress….

          So I will just say I gotcha and keep it at that….

        3. As a "half-breed", I really can do nothing but shake my head here.

          *This is reminding me of some Voldemort type is, may as well call me Mudblood.

        4. Let me say, that I was with you on the reasons that you typically hear for why both men and women date other races (black men don't know how to treat women, black women are just to angry, black men always come tied with 4 baby mommas, black women aren't submissive enough, etc.) being a HUGE problem.

        5. Most people shake their heads at me when I comment, nothing new.

          But I know what I said was offensive, but I was just speaking my true feelings. I cannot be fake and pretend to be something that I am not, even if it's on the internet.

          Again, I tend to say it's nothing personal, just business, but of course I know that is wrong. It is just the way I am. Sometimes people don't have logic for why they are they way they are, and I've come to accept that my logic when it comes to race isnt really logical. But again, it is something that I am working on…

        6. I feel like you come on here expecting to get jumped on for your opinions, and for the most part nobody has done that. However, I think you took it one step to far in actually be outright insulting and offensive today. Your point could have very easily been made with out adding in those comments that targeted specific groups and just highlighted what can only be referred to as your racism. I wasn't agreeing with every statement you made, but I was getting the gist of what you were trying to say and couldn't fault you for it. In fact, like I said, I agreed with part of it. The fact that you made some insulting (and unneccessary) comments just makes you (and your opinion) less credible.

          This board is full of outspoken opinionated people, so nobody faults you on that alone. However, we have just as much right to call you out on the floor about those opinions. Some comments can't be defended simply by stating "it's my opinion, and I'm allowed to have it". I promises I'm not trying to attack you, and I hope that you trying to gain more perspective is genuine.

        7. I'm not trying to be credible. I just expressed my opinions. Don't see how opinions can be credible when everyone has them and are subjective. But I feel you.

          And again, I'm not a fake person. So yes my intentions are genuine…..

        8. mad late on this but dang… hating "half breeds"? If you were all for black love and healing the state of Black America you'd realize that includes ALL of Black America. That's a spiteful comment and I'm quite ashamed that you could potentially be a spokesperson for the movement.

          I'm not sure what your issue is with people with more than one race but I hope and pray that you won't stay this twisted and hateful the rest of your life.

          I truly dislike thinking that someone has such a disdain for me because some of roots come from countries other than Africa. SMH.

    2. Thats some real ignorant isht …

      You'd prolly want to off yourself if you ever found out there was white in your bloodstream.

      Sad.

      1. By the way, I know I am radical with my opinions, but I will never resort to saying racist things about other races. That is not something I do because I am not concerned with them. I am concerned with the state of Black America.

        How are you gonna have a post about interracial dating on a black blog and not expect that at least one black person will be against it. Now you're saying you want to kick me off lol. Am I supposed to agree with everything you say, especially a controversial topic like this. And especially when I never went on to bash other races or anything like that.

        1. "By the way, I know I am radical with my opinions, but I will never resort to saying racist things about other races."

          ^^^

          Newsflash hun, you just (insert SAT word that Meteor or Peyso would use) an entire group of individuals, the mixed people!! In denouncing and advocating your abhorrance of their "kind", you in turn hate the races that joined to create them! Everyone is entitled to their opinion on this site. They are also entitled to react however they want. Your views are your views, but please don't come here, make those type of comments, then try to #swindle us to ease the blow [||] of the message. That's all I'm saying.

        2. Apparently I'm not entitled to my opinions when someone says kick her out lol.

          But again, I feel you….

          It is what it is. I'm not gonna change overnight. One step at a time……

        3. LOL. This is the second time today somebody has called me junebug on here. I really need to meet this person now.

          Now I'm seriously curious. Where is this person from? What does this person do? And how are they so much alike me that you keep mentioning the name?

        4. You wanna meet her? Is there a mirror close by you?

          "I know….If I leave out the "I" in the the "Juniebug" that should keep them off my trail…I'm so smart"

          Hey….don't mind me…just a little antsy to get my 4 day weekend poppin' off!

          Pay your taxes, people.

  8. first off, i didn't read the article, (not awake yet) but i did hear her quote on the radio regarding how she feels when she sees a black man with a white woman. i understand how she feels and can relate.

    when my mother died in 2003 from cancer my father promptly ran out and married a white women about 9 months after her death, much to the shock of my sisters and myself. (we're talking mr. "pro black man with raised fist" the entire time we were growing up).

    our retaliation (especially since he hadn't just MET this woman) was to stop coming around. (we do cash his checks on our birthday's and holiday's) but to me, it makes a statement about what he really desired all along. yuk.

    sorry dad, we can't hang.

  9. See, NOW do you understand why I bowed out of this topic the first time. But Dr. J's assumption on why I didn't want to comment made me come back at full speed. I tried to leave it alone…..

    My opinions stand and they will continue to stand until I see black love become strong again.

    I really don't want to do the back and forth with this one. I just wanted to state my opinions on the matter since Dr. J assumed I didn't want to comment because it wasn't about sex…..

    continue….

  10. I can see where Jill is coming from & I'm sure she isn't the only woman (of any race) who feels that way. She just wasn't afraid to voice her opinion. That's just what it was…HER opinion. I personally don't care who any1 chooses to date bcuz if its not me its none of my business. There's a lot of 'the-black-woman-aint-sh*t' talk going around but it never bothers me bcuz I feel like it doesn't pertain to me. And those men that feel that way wouldn't be some1 I'd be interested in dating anyway! A woman is a woman & we're ALL complicated no matter the color of our skin or our ethinicity. I don't judge Jill Scott for the way she feels, the same way I won't judge a black man for marrying a white woman. There's only 1 judge & His judgement is the only 1 that matters. With that said, self-hate is a huge problem in the black community & what I'd like to see is more black people loving themselves. Once that happens maybe we'll have less discussions about interracial relationships bcuz it won't be an 'issue' and/or matter as much to some people. Black America is in a sad state & if I think about it too long it will depress me so I'll sit back, read todays responses and hopefully they will disprove my last statement… *Peace*

    1. "Black America is in a sad state & if I think about it too long it will depress me so I’ll sit back, read todays responses and hopefully they will disprove my last statement…"

      Yea I doubt it……

      I'm just gonna sit back and read the responses too. I've spoken my peace and won't be responding anymore. I'm sure the worst is yet to come…..

  11. Jill Scott's only marriage lasted 11 years (she was married when her 1st album dropped) & ended b/c she was always on the road, pretty much. That's understandable. Her child (after being told she couldn't conceive) is by a man she intended to marry & who intended to marry her… Until he went back to his ex. Also understandable, it happens all the time. That relationship lasted a little over a year, I believe.

    So Jill has a little more expereince than she's being given credit for. Mock the fact I know all this if you wish. Just had to get it straight. Peace, good people.

    1. A woman of her stature should be able to have PR. And because I know she does, they should update her wikipedia page. (Wikipedia is not a source, but it is a reference point.)

  12. In my humble opinion … I agree whole heartedly with this post.

    Love it or hate it, it happens and continues to happen.

    Successful and unsuccessful black men are dating white woman, asian woman, indian woman and so on. So I doubt its that only or all of the successful woman choose to date interacially but instead these are the ones in the public eye that we are reminded of and see most frequently.

    Live and let live.

  13. Hmm…

    Familiar topic. As someone that has played Marco Polo in the wonderful world of dating, I understand all of this. I see people talking about the wounding and wincing this causes. I've been wounded too, but in a different way.

    There was a stretch in high school and part of college where Black women showed close to zero interest in me. I wondered what it was, but didn't spend too much time thinking about it because other chicks/women did show interest. I went with that because well…it made sense. When I got to college, I had a white girlfriend for a bit. Once that ended, I went through a stretch where I just went with whoever was interested in me. I dated another white woman my junior year of college because she pursued and respected me and suddenly Black women started going nuts. Now all of a sudden I was "doing a disservice" and fell under the "he's not really about sh*t and he's looking for the easy way out" labeling.

    Me aside, I heard the comments made about other Black men dating white and other women by Black women. I was and still am not able to understand why it mattered so much who someone else dated when they had no interest in that person…until they dated inter-racially. I still get irritated when it happens now. There's something bothersome to say that someone has to weather the storm and has an obligation to find someone that "looks like them" no matter the cost. If it happens, it happens. If not, then it's whatever.

    I just think people need to worry about themselves when it comes to this stuff and not a random couple walking down the street. I also think we need to kill this idea that Black men who don't date Black women are weak or hate themselves or have low self-esteem. Those type of people exist even in same race relations. And quite honestly, a lot of the decisions we make in dating are based on past experiences. You can infer the rest.

    1. Late to the party, but I had to say that I agree with my cohort Slim here and Dr. J. I've seen what Slim's describing happen to some of my friends and it's happened to me too. You're not on the radar with Black women and then it's a huge deal that you're dating a woman of a different race. ::Kanye shrug::

      Beyond that, I'm a mixed kid myself so I don't mind interracial dating. It is what it is. I don't think it diminishes my love for Black women, I'm just attracted to a lot of different women.

      Let us live. We're in the 21st century, shoot the President is a mixed kid. You figure all this would be a moot point by now.

  14. I believe there are three reasons one dates another.

    1. An emotional attraction draws the person's attention. This type of attraction has little to do with the physical. "Inward" attributes and similarities bring the two parties together. Each person feels completely accepted and not judged by the other

    2. A physical attraction draws the person's attention. Of course this is purely based on appearance. It can be natural physical beauty, the illusion gained from monetary wealth or status.

    3. A mixture of the two

    Either way, people date who they want, when they want.

    Concerning black women being upset by black men dating/marrying women of other ethnicities, especially white women, I believe the anger comes from a measure of low self-esteem. The "wince" in Jill's spirit was not really a feeling of betrayal but rather rejection. Subconsciously, the thoughts "I look more like him than she does. Why is he with her and not with me? Is there something wrong with me?" are raised.

    I completely agree with Jill's analysis of white women being placed on a pedestal during slavery and by current media. At a young age, I used to run around the house white a towel on my head wishing I had long flowing hair like my white friends at school. That feeling of less beauty and inferiority was then (and is now) hit home my images in stores and magazines, on tv and the red carpet.

    As a 28 year old black woman, what helps me accept my full lips and tightly (TIGHTLY) curled black hair is love for myself. What allows me to not care about the appearance of my brother's girlfriend but worry about her character is acceptance of myself. What permits me to feel joy for all those who find love is happiness for myself.

    A person cannot feel betrayed by one that owes them nothing. We as black women need to understand black men owe us nothing! However, WE owe OURSELVES everything! We owe ourselves love, acceptance, and happiness.

    I am sure many will disagree with my assessment. However, if one is really confident in themselves and position in life, the private actions of others will not produce a negative thought or feeling. Confidence in yourself decreases the need for approval from others.

    1. Spot – on!! You laid it all out perfectly.

      I agree, it is hard enough to find love nowadays, be with someone who loves you, makes you feel good and makes you feel comfortable.

      If a black man is interested in the next white girl, I don't really see it as a slight to me, b/c he probably wasn't checking for me anyways…soooo we keep it moving right?

  15. I haven't read the article yet nor have I read any of the comments. I do agree with Dr. J.

    Black women need to hop on the caravan of love & find love wherever it is best for us. I used to dislike Black me for dating women of other races… And I still do dislike the one that use excuses like 'Black women have attitudes' & the like for dating White, Latino, or Asian women. If it's not for love then it's wrong… Period. If I meet a Robin Thicke look-a-like & give him the time of day it'll be because I hope to find love at the end of that journey.

    I have other beliefs that won't be shared. I will say when I visualize my husband, he's Black. But if God has a different plan for a goddess then so be it.

    Peace (once again) *on to read the article*

  16. I'm not reading any comments. I'm not subscribing to follow-up comments. As a young, successful black man (who has a thing for brown skin black women) I have one thing to say…

    My sincere advice to all blogs is that they stop belaboring on this point. This sh!t is getting boring and old. I swear we had this convo 2 weeks ago.

    1. Did you seriously think that we wouldn't post on it? If we hadn't a million others would have. In fact, I wasn't going to post on it… But I realized that this is one of those things that won't go away.

  17. i read so many viewpoints about this.. it seems like so many people are for interracial dating as long as the reason for it isn't "such and such".. because i guess it's all about intention, right??

    but with all that being said.. love who you love.. i know that once you go interracial, that you're going to have to explain your choices more than normal.. BUT if you find two people strong enough to withstand it, then "Eff everyone else".. finding love is hard enough.. and as a human being, at my core, i would just like to be loved.. if we're compatible, then i don't have to answer to anyone… even my momma (who gave me life)

    i know for certain though.. that if there wasn't any interracial breeding on my family's part, that i wouldn't be who i am.. with a last name that's Scottish.. and a European heritage that i can't wait to discover..

    solving the issue with the black community ISN'T gonna happen because "Robert" that lives on my corner chooses to make his stand and only date black women.. the problem is so much deeper than that, but no one wants to talk about that…

    so deeply rooted, that i sometimes feel that God is just looking down and thinking "the only way i can make it right is to wipe them out, and start all over.."

    i don't know how it got this way.. even sadder because it's like i'm witnessing a death in front of my own eyes..

    1. That is a deep stament, I hope God is not feeling that way. Peole should love who they love for the right reasons and most importantly love yourselves!!!

      1. You don't happen to be related to me do you? My sister's name is Kendra and I've sent her links to this site in the distant past. I just want to know if she's lurking around here.

  18. i wonder if this is the same *wince* I, as a man, felt when i was overlooked for this guy, that guy, when i was shown little to no interest.

    if it's the same, then i understand, in a little way. that someone that is attracted to someone different that you hurts…because you feel that person wouldn't be attracted to you…kinda like, everyone one is attracted to..should be attracted to that person..

    ah the days i thought like that.

    While i understand the white-black dynamic that makes up a real part of American history, i cannot, in good conscience, see a white person, or a white woman in my case, and automatically assume that she is is "teh enemy". that wasnt how i was raised.

    i understand that a lot of times, the reason people seek 'other' isn't because of love. i can't worry about that, because in the end, everything has a way of working itself out.

      1. *re-reads comments*

        ah yes sir, so you have…

        as representative of Nerdtopolis, i issue a motion to retire this subject. Pharrelz (Forrealz). i think the emotion of most of the readers (male and/or female) is that if you do it outta love, ain't nothin to be said

  19. I swear the SBM Massive has my phone tapped. The girlfriends and I were just talking about this while laying on the beach in the Bahamas. & just yesterday I had a huge agruement w/ a "pro-black love" male friend of mine who as an issue w/ me being open to dating other races.

    My reason for being open: love & statistics. Pure & simple. Not that I don't think I could find love in an black relationship, truth of the matter is if I could find love w/ a black man I'd prefer it. However, I refuse to shut myself off to the other colors of the wind (to quote Pocohantas). Statistics comes in like this…

    Consider for a second: the # of available (legally single), non incarcerated & working black men… I'm not even talking about preferances in physical appearance, personality, job type/income, political or religious affliation. Just the basics… working, single, out of jail. The number is small. Then consider the number of those men who date women of various races. Suddenly I no longer find myself in competition w/ only Shaquana & Keesha but w/ Isabella, Kim Lee & Becky as well. If my only focus is a black man… then I've just increased my competition 5 fold. If our men can date outside the race, and find happiness elsewhere… why shouldn't I? Why wouldn't I take the opportunity to even the playing field of love?

    My friend went on to talk about slavery… and the white man taking advantage of the black woman, etc.

    Anywho… I think I just went in a whole different direction. My point is good post Dr. J. I don't think it's any one couple's responsibility to take on the fears of an entire race or to stifle their happiness b/c of the sins that were committed. I feel as long as the person(s) in question are dating someone different than themeselves out of self-loathing then more power to them. And if they are self-hating… I am not #CaptainSaveaSimp

  20. I am the product of an interracial marriage (Italian, Irish, Black and Native American Indian) so uhhhhh I'm ok with it…otherwise I wouldn't exist to annoy the masses as I do. 🙂

    1. Hmm…then you have inspired me too.

      I'm actually in the process of self-reflection (before today) and I really am working on myself when it comes to this topic. But progress doesn't happen overnight. I will get there soon I'm hopeful.

      1. We are all works in progress Choc…ALL of us..and if we're not…then we should be or else we're in de-damn-nial. hehehehe 😉

  21. As a matter of fact, you all have inspired me, not just Streetz. And I thank you all for that.

    I wish you all a great day…

  22. Wow…I would comment on some of the things that are being said here but then I'd be here all day. Chocolate Drop…I feel for you today. I would say maybe you should've just taken the day off on this one but then again I'm glad you posted. Your opinion is just as valid as any1 elses on here. I will keep reading bcuz although I don't agree with everything that's being said on here I won't attack any1 for having an OPINION that differs from mines. That is all! 🙂

    1. Thank You. And I feel the same way about other people's opinions.

      And again for the record, Dr J said I didn't want to comment the first time because the topic wasn't about sex. I found that to be highly offensive and decided to express my offensive opinions in turn, when before I was going to keep them inside and just sit back and read…and try to learn something and possibly grow. But since he tried to put me on the spot, I delivered to avoid assumptions. And now he doesn't like the delivery when he should have let it be.

      But it's hard changing your core beliefs but I will get there one day (or year)….

  23. I feel like I have alot to say on this issue. Bare with me if I ramble.

    Firstly, I understand where Jill is coming from, I think we all do. I have a friend at work, who's asian and white mixed. She's young, and very attractive. We take lunch together often, I can see the judgement in the eyes of the sisters that see us sitting together in the cafeteria. I always wonder if they would think differently if she were hideously unattractive. I don't think they'd really care. Nonetheless, I feel where they're coming from too – if only they knew that I'm actually married to a beautiful sister who I love dearly.

    Anyways, am I against interracial dating, no, do I think it's as simple as "people loving who they love" – no, not hardly. Very few black people or white people grow up picturing their weddings with the image of someone of another race in their mind. That's just not the way it goes. When's the last time you saw a little white girl with a black Ken doll? (I'm being general, there are exceptions of course). I say this because, I think it's important that we realize that when we see an interracial couple – for both individuals, something, at some point likely changed in their desire or worldview. I think any individual considering an interracial relationship needs to consider what in their worldview has changed, that now makes this acceptable. I think sometimes, the change can be pure. It can be the result leaving your comfort zone and becoming aware that other cultures exist and can add value to your life. It can also be the result of just meeting a phenomenal person who just, does it for you. Other times, I think that change is not so pure. On the black side, it can be the result of self-hatred. The idea that a white-woman is the ultimate "trophy-wife". Nowhere was this more apparent than in a game I played with college suitemates. We had a contest, with a point system, for the women we slept with on campus (juvenile, I know, shame on me). When we first suggested the point system, one of my suitemates said – "what about white chicks – they should be worth extra points"… it was telling. I admonished him, and he saw the light, but, that one moment, was very telling of his worldview.

    On the white side, the change, as I said, could be pure, but, it could also be the result of age old 'white-guilt'. It could also be the result of new found liberalistic thinking. It could be a form of rebellion against a their parents, or it could just be Obama. It could also be the result of a lack of other options. Black dudes should beware, often times, white chicks don't start dating black dudes till after they've been run through by their circle of friends or, till after all the white guys they'd prefer to be with or marry end up with other people. A black dude for a lot of white chicks, is like a consolation prize, unless he's a millionaire.

    For the sisters who don't care one way or another, I think you guys are great. You guys are probably in the smaller percentage of black women who are going to end up married to a black man. You're also probably drop dead gorgeous, have multiple degrees, make a 6 figure living and can s*ck and good d*ck and could hook a steak up (as Notorius would say) The rest of the sisters, the sisters who are essentially average looking, or the sisters who are shaped like Jill Scott, or the sisters who only have a bachelors degree; they will end up wincing. This is the sad state of affairs for black women. It's a product of pure #'s. If you're a young black male, who's successful, kinda cool, makes a good living and is not gay – you have your choice of the best of the best of the best of black women (and a few decent white women). If you're a sister with the same stats – you might end up settling for something a little below what your "ideal black man" was.

    I guess what I'm saying is this: if there were more "eligible" black men out there, interracial dating wouldn't be an issue. (By "eligible" I mean college educated – cuz that seems to be most black women's bare minimum.) When you combine the fact that there are so few "eligible" black men out there, with the fact that a decent percentage of the ones who are, are choosing women outside of their race – I can see how it would be a little discouraging the sisters.

    1. "I guess what I’m saying is this: if there were more “eligible” black men out there, interracial dating wouldn’t be an issue. (By “eligible” I mean college educated – cuz that seems to be most black women’s bare minimum.) When you combine the fact that there are so few “eligible” black men out there, with the fact that a decent percentage of the ones who are, are choosing women outside of their race – I can see how it would be a little discouraging the sisters."

      the interesting thing about this is that someone is that looking back on the guys i went to college with (fyi – an ivy league school)…while id say most are still single..out of those that have married…they married black women…if they are in a relationship, they are in a relationship with black women..sh*t, i think there were more openly gay guys, than men that actively seek out white women (as far as i know, there were 2 openly gay guys)

      i do have a weird question…do black women have more of a problem with gay guys they find attractive getting with other men? or with black men getting with other shades of women?

      1. I think sissters don't mind seeing attractive, black gay dudes, as much as they mind seeing attractive straight black dudes who are married to white women because, if he's gay then the assumption is that he had no choice. He's just gay – it is what it is. If he's with a white chick, he had the opportunity to choose between the white chick and a sister, and he chose the white chick.

        As I think about it – I think the underlying emotion that causes the wince, is the comparison. I think when a black woman sees a black man with a white woman, she unconciously compares herself to the white woman from the perspective of the black man. Somewhere deep inside of herself, she feels like he chose the white chick over her – specifically.

    2. Your comments per usual are iron clad.

      I think all folks had a point system in college. The crazy thing is the chicks did too lol. I think that people do have a tendency to want what they can't have. And there's a huge roaring argument for white women who are looking for their "big black buck." And that's cool. I had a coworker who I used to have lunch with, white.. who once said, "I am looking for a boyfriend, preferrably Black." I felt uncomfortable with her statement and I told her I don't think I can have lunch with her anymore. I have another coworker, white.. who once said, "I'm through with Black guys, they're all full of ish." I didn't even feel uncomfortable, but at the same time I told her, "Sweetheart I hear the same thing from Black women all the time. You ain't through with us."

      I have some boys who date white women and they see white women as trophies. (Depending on the white women you get. I know some white women who are just as hood as some Black women.) But they feel like they hit the jackpot; the woman caters to them, the woman is everything they want in the bedroom, kitchen, living room (when watching the game), in front of company and at company events. I will be quick to tell them that that's not a white woman thing, because you can find Black women who do the same thing. (How hard will you have to look for that though, is up for discussion.)

      Have I ever dated a Black woman and compared her to a woman outside her race and got upset? Yes. For example, I got in the "I don't care what people think about me" argument with a girl I was dating. My point was, when you act a hot mess it's a reflection on the people who are around you. So don't act a hot emss around me. I thought to myself, in my dating history, I have only had this problem with Black women. Not latinas, asian, or white women have ever done this. So I thought it was genetic, j/k. But seriously, that was my dating experience. The thing is I didn't drop the chick because of that and go date another race. I dropped the chick because she was a hot mess.

      What's my point? I don't know, it's somewhere in there.

  24. More and more, within the black community, I see a desire to assimilate that bothers me. Interracial dating is a manifestation of some blacks belief that white is better. Never has assimilation been so acceptable in the black community. In the past we rejected european people and culture not based on their skin color, but because of the corrupt, immoral values and socio-economic systems they subscribe to. But now, it seems starting with Generation X and even more so with Generation Y assimilation is an aspiration. We celebrate Jay-Z and Diddy for sellin alcohol. They gettin money. We send our kids to white schools. We live in white neighborhoods. Oprah builds schools in South Africa instead of mentoring girls in Chicago because in her words, "Black kids just want ipods." We co-opt Republican talking points designed to minimize the impact of slavery….like "Blacks need to take responsibility." LOL Seriously WTF does that even mean. When did sellin out become cool?

    Black women and black men have been at war since slavery. It's really the last major area we need healing in. We made a mistake in the 1990s by emphasizing family first. We should have emphasized the healing the needs to take place between us first. Before marriage.

    So my beef with interracial dating is that is so often based on a belief that "their are no good black men" or "white women are better." It's not organic. For black men, in most cases, if he had no money the white women wouldn't even look his way. In the case of black women, in most cases, it's a black women that was raised in white culture…..so now in her adult years she claims there are no good black men when the truth is she just can't relate to black men because she was raised to reject black culture.

    I could go on but I'll chill for now and respond to the I just pissed off. 🙂

    1. NOOOOO!!!!!! Just when I was about to try to change….

      This is the perfect post…..and exactly how I feel. D*mmit J.

      But of course you said it better than I did, without the insults…..

  25. haven't read all the comments but I felt Jill. she doesnt' speak for all black woman but I still feel her sentiment. I really don't care enough about what other people do but I still have an opinion.

    so funny you clowned Jill for her brown liquor song (that was my bbm status until today, strange) and I wrote a blog post last week using one of my favorite songs "The Fact Is (I Need You)" Streetz said y'all bammas sent me to the dark side and maybe its true. I had to get that out of my system last week. lol

  26. Lol at Chocolate Drop being about 12 comments deep on this post after saying she won't comment anymore today. I knew you'd be in the mix. I just felt it in my soul.lolol

      1. Who in the h*ll is this junebug person you all keep mentioning? Seriously, if I speak like this person, then fine so be it. But don't keep calling me this person's name. I am the one and only Chocolate Drop lol. I doubt there is another like me.

        And If you would have read what I said, I said that I am now going to comment because Dr J made an assumption as to why I chose not to comment at first.

        1. No disrespect, but Juniebug = Chocolate Drop are the same people. Recreating yourself and using a different alias does not change the fact that we are admins of this site and can tell the same users because we get information about you, so that if for example, you go comment crazy on a post and say a bunch of things that might be racist or threaten to harm someone, we can turn you over to the proper authorities. Therefore…

          let's keep it real, we all know you fronting, so we go to radio to let them know you fronting.

          (PS – Whenever someone says "no disrespect" or "no offense" they about to say something disrespectful and offensive.)

  27. I'm ashamed to admit that I'm a "wincer" sometimes. It's not that I'm against IR relationships (my most significant relationship was with a white man), but it's almost instinctual. I see tons of IR couples come through while I'm at BB, and I find that I only wince when you see those stereotypical black men/white women combos. The ones where it is very clear that the man is with her for the extra benefits (submission, good credit, and all around taking care of her) and the white woman is with him because she somehow feels it makes her "cool" to be wanted by a black man. Now that I think about it, it's really all out ghetto stupidity that makes me wince. *shrugs*

    While we're on the subject, I hate that these types of posts on the Interwebs always talk about how black women react to the BM/WW combo. What about how y'all react to seeing a BW with a WM? I had to deal with those reactions for years and I still see it on the rare occasions I go out with my sister and her 2520 husband. You guys are no better, it just so happens that there are less BW/WM combos than the other way around.

    1. I aint gonna lie. When I see it either way, black women white man, or white women black man, my first thougth is "You fake a$$ sell out bamma." Then I calm down and think OK, they cool, just keep your mouth shut when we talk about the black agenda since you obviously turned in your ghetto pass. 🙂 But to be honest, I don't really trip cause I don't think I would really want to date the kind of black women that dates interracially on a regular bases. They are usually women that are not comfortable around black people because of how they were raised.

      Now the only time it's cool is when the white person is black. For example I went to schools that were 99% black. So if you were white you were still black. Hell I know white dudes and white girls that are blacker than some black people I know.

        1. Usually pretty easy to tell. Honestly interracial dating is usually something you do or don't do. The way she talks and dresses usually gives her away too. Like I said. Usually it's certain types that are into interracial dating.

        2. @ J –

          True. I can see where you going w/ this point. I know exactly the BW you are talking about. And as always, there are exceptions to every rule & there is no need in trying to cover them all here.

    2. I'm from a significantly different background and upbringing. When I see a Black woman with a white man I don't really care that much. I usually attribute it to that's who she met based on her environment. I saw a Black women snuggled up with her White boo on the metro the other day. Consequently she had on Uggs, black tights, and a track jacket that said Potomac Crew. I snapped my fingers and said, makes sense.

      Now if I see some chick from HD Woodson Basketball (school in SE DC) with some white dude, i'm like now where'd she meet him at? I'm still not wincing, but I look at them the same way I look at a couple when the chick is taller than the guy.

      I'll take this further, that same coworker I mentioned who said she was done with Black men. She's from the suburbs in VA, went to VA Tech, lives in Northern VA. Dates Black guys from Bowie (black suburbs in MD) and Capitol Heights (PG County HOOD). *scratches head* I'm like now this woman is going out and actively seeking black men, but then she mentioned in another conversation. "Oh I used to be cool with the football team. They were always in my apartment." I snapped those same fingers and was like, makes sense. You like ignorant Black men. #noshots to VA Tech football players or grads. Michael Vick and Marcus Vick?

      1. Yeah but that is kind of my point. I'm from PG County. Right on the SE border. In general the women around my way and in my schools have no desire to date white. And when they do it's a white person that lives in the hood, dresses and talks black.

        The black women I see dating interracially, as you said, are usually the ones raised in Virginia. White neighborhodd, white schools. When they do try to date black they think the black men are mean and ghetto. Why? They really just don't understand the culture. They have been raised in white culture and that's where they are comfortable.

        That's why I relate the increase in interracial dating with our rejection of the black community. Assimilation wasn't even possible until the 1970s. Once we started abandoning our communities we started abandoning each other.

        1. I actually went to Wilson in DC. But the rest of J's family was at Suitland or Oxon Hill. We had one cousin who went to Duvall and that's where her life story goes LEFT!

      2. Translation: The whole football team smashed.

        @Sane, I tried to be general in my post and not get into the whole gender thing.

        But, that said, I think, when I see black women with white dudes (or dudes from any other race) I automatically assume that they're like Halle Berry. Halle tried… she tried really really hard to find a great black man, and even she gave up. David Justice beat her till she was deaf in one ear and the other dude, who's name is escaping me, originated the now super popular "I cheated cuz i'm a sex addict… and need rehab" excuse. Finally, Halle said F' it… a got with the white dude she's with now.

        I assume sisters with White guys were either brought up around white folks, or, they tried really hard and, eventually just settled for someone who would treat them right, regardless of race.

        1. But even with Halle. This is why I'm saying black women and black men need to heal. Those men shouldn't have beat her. Why did they? And why did she choose the same effed up dudes every time.

          Justice = Pretty boy with money

          Benet= Pretty boy with money.

          Why give up on black men cause you made bad choices. It upsets me when women say there are no good black men so I had to date a white man. There are plenty of good black men that aren't being choosen cause they don't look right or their money isn't where someone felt it should be.

          We really need to start making better choices based on values and then maybe we won't be so hurt when we hit 30 that we decide something is wrong with our race.

        2. I had a whole post written, and the damn page refreshed on me and I don't feel like retyping it. Basically, I think these same assumptions that you men are stating are equal to the "winces" by women. I don't fall into any of the categories that you guys are saying you assume that women with WM are probably in and I damn sure haven't given up on black men.

          I already get hit with the assumption that because I'm light skinned, read for pleasure, enjoy music beyond rap/R&B, and am able to speak with proper English that I am "whitewashed" and turned in my ghetto pass. So, I'm sure that any assumptions that were made when I was seen with him were similar to the ones I'm reading here. That's okay, no sweat off my back, I'm comfortable with who I am and it was them that missed out on knowing a damn good person.

        3. J- As far as passing someone up because they don't look right, is the solution to date someone you just aren't attracted to?

  28. Dang, chitlins! You all have been busy, lol. Well, let me get into it:

    @Chocolate: Little sis, I feel where you're coming from. And from the bottom of my heart let me tell you: don't waste your time. The black love that you share with your fiance is all that you owe the Black community. You can't know what an individual's personal story is, or how they came to be. Even if you could know, you couldn't change it. All you CAN do is love yourself and your Black man. And start slathering your tummy with cocoa butter NOW so you'll still look good after you have ALL 5 of that bamma's babies, lol. What's good for you is good for the whole.

    Now, I love my brothas. Truly I do. But if I met my s.o.'s spirit and personality in a white man….let's just say we'd be playin' President Jefferson and Sally Hemmings all day and eerrry night. And because of MY beautiful and undeniable Blackness, it would STILL be Black Love. You could take my nth of a percent statistical point and put me in the "Happily Married Black Woman"category.

    1. Anna, believe it or not I entirely agree with you. This line says it all: "What’s good for you is good for the whole."

      Or as others would say it, "Do you."

    2. Yes I am truly starting to see this point. All I can do is focus on my own black love. Ours might just be the last of it.

  29. clap clap bravo.

    If you ain't checkin for me chances are you aren't the type of guy I'm checkin for. I've been around guys who are nearly exclusively into dating white women and a lot of the reason why tends to stem into other parts of how he treats black women (except for maybe his mama)- and that's a turn off. if you want to exclusively date becky it doesn't rain on my parade… chances are I'm checking out that cutie adam right behind you 🙂

    1. If my name was Becky and I was Black i'd be pissed. Real talk, I know a white chick whose name is Tasha. And she's not a stripper. And it's not Natasha, it's LaTasha with the two capital letters like we do.

      1. LMAOOOOO! I was just thinking that. It's hilarious how black people use the name Becky = WM.

        I know a black family who has a son who married a WM. The ENTIRE (extended fam included) family calls this woman Becky. I think some of them really think her name is Becky. Let me state for the record, it's not. Lemme add that she adds to this foolishness but actually answering to Becky. *shrugs*

      2. One of by closest friends is named Becky (not short for Rebecca…just Becky), and she's black. It is extremely offensive. The other day, a few friends and I were contemplating why many refer to white girls as "Becky." I believe the honor for the designation should go to Sir Mix A Lot.

  30. ignorance throughout the comments today. Just like on commenter said ealier (forgot who sorry) i''m just shaking my head at some of these comments here. to think in this day in age….

    edumakation my friends…

  31. SaneN85 says: April 1, 2010 at 12:55 pmJ- As far as passing someone up because they don’t look right, is the solution to date someone you just aren’t attracted to?

    ____________________

    So Halle Berry can't find a good looking single black man that won't knock her in the head? 🙂

    C'mon now. Obviously she could. But she choose good looking, black men with fame and money. And what comes along with that is often arrogance, entitlemen, disrespect and cheating. But don't attribute that to all black men and tell me you have to date white men now. At least admit that screening process may be a bit flawed.

    1. "There are plenty of good black men that aren’t being choosen cause they don’t look right or their money isn’t where someone felt it should be."

      I was responding to this specific part of your post. I'm not implying that a good looking black man who won't know you in the head isn't out there, just responding to this part.

      1. Well I'm not sayin date someone you are not attracted to. I'm just sayin, whatever your type, their really is no shortage of good black men. I've made this point in other post. If your preference is for gorgous 6'4 black men you gotta understand that man has options. He may cheat and women will chase him all the time. But don't tell me their are no good black men. You've choosen to limit yourself. Which is fine. But your lack of man is not do to a lack of availability. It's a consequence of limitiations you have imposed.

        1. I want to just reiterate that I have not chosen to limit myself, and have tried to make that clear. So, I'm going to assume that statement was made in a general sense.

          Also, choosing to limit yourself can work both ways whether limiting to any race but black, or limiting yourself to just black men.

        2. Also, my lack of a man isn't a consequence of the limitations I impose, it's a consequence of the expectations I impose. I could walk outside and get a man within five minutes (especially since I work across the parking lot of the Department of Corrections), but I do have expectations of how I want to be treated, etc. Yes, sometimes there is a shortage of good black men in specific areas. There is also a solution of moving somewhere else.

          I feel where you're coming from, I just think that not everyone can be pidgeon-holed into the descriptions you're giving.

        3. LOL, I agree with both of you. Sane, your posts are definitely not anything like the ignorance that J is critiquing (i.e. people who get on ABC News and rant how "settling" for a 6'2'' guy is lowering standards).

          At the same time, I do agree with J in that expectations and standards cut both ways and in a general sense we black folk have interesting "requirements" that seem to defy common sense. i.e. I've heard (on an Ivy campus) a sister in a Ph.D. program in cultural studies say proudly, "I need a man with some street in 'em) And that same woman was complaining about "non street" black men with white women. I could do nothing but bite my tongue and shake my head.

          Nonetheless, it's important to see the relationship between one's standards and results.

          If for example, so many sisters demand that a guy is 6'2'' and up, they have to know that they are going 3-4 standard deviations above the mean, meaning they are weeding out far, far more than the majority of people. Let's not even get into the 6'4'' requirement… Such a person should quiet themselves over seeing the shorter folk look at other options, regardless of race.

          I could reverse this logic and talk about black mens' preferences, but this post is too long already.

  32. I think Jill and a whole lot of black women need to get over it. I can understand the "wince", but she needs to get over it, not just for the sake of black women but bc there are more important issues to worry about than who's dating someone unless that someone is you.

    1. not so, some of my cousins look mixed race…i'm not particularly dark skinned either…there might be white blood in our family but we're not sure but it's not something we've been able to trace back with certainty going back through the generations…

    2. Don't know where folks get that from. Too much Henry Louis Gates DNA testing. Dem Ivy League Post Racial Ni**gaz will have you joining the tea party and dating interacially 🙂

      1 white ancestor out of the thousands of Africans doesn't exactly make you a European.

      Anyway, race is culture. How you speak, what you wear, where you live, how you live, your traditions and value. Race is not genetic……unless you listenin to dem IV League Post Racial Ni**gaz. Like I said. I know white people that are blacker than some black people.

      1. You have some type of non african blood in you if you're light skin right or wrong? Our people were all of darker skin shade. Thats what im sayin.

        **save the albinos**

        1. son. what about the Ethiopians? or other african countries of the continent where black people come from that are not "dark" all of that aren't dark are not of euro blood.

        2. As a re-establishing founder of the Gamma Rays, I would like to say that we appreciate all of you light skinned sisters however you got here whether you be; mixed, straight up, on the rocks, albinos, midgets or white.

          We will be holding our 2nd Spring Informational on May 15th, location: TBA.

          "We need more Gamma Rays!" – BB X-Ray Vision

        3. Again not true. North Africans look like light skinned black people. Light skinned with straight hair. Moroccans, Libya, Ethiopians

        4. do you people seriously think that black people in north and east africa never went across the water. yo a*s is afraid of water, but our people haven't been afraid of water for a long time.

          speaking of interracial dating, it's in our blood. folks from mali had boats over in south american long before any conquistadors. they was trying to see what was good too.

      2. I would actually resist the assumption that race is culture. Race has cultural components, that's true, but to assume an equivalence is rather dangerous. i.e. A dude "assimilating" to survive a tough white school isn't "less black," they are simply doing a different hustle. Similarly, I don't think someone must listen to hip hop or walking with a swagger to like black culture—they can just as well listen to jazz, study African-American studies and start a nonprofit to get poor kids out of the ghetto.

        I've met plenty of black professors and people in business who do not engage in the "black culture" at all, but who go through hell from white people to help black people. They may "assimilate" but yet they too are part of the race…or well they ought to be considered as such.

        1. @ J, Reecie and Streetztalk …

          People of Northern African descent actually ARE mixed. Their lighter complexions/eyes and straighter hair are the results of years of long ago intermixing with/conquest by their Arab neighbors to the north (who genealogically are considered Caucasian).

          Liken it to the same phenomena with Latinos … they are (save for the Spanish) essentially varying degrees of a mixture of Spanish Europeans and indigenous Americans (white and Indian) with some African ancestry splashed in here and there.

    3. lies! some light skinned black ppl just have indian in their family. other light skinned black ppl just have albinism or something!

      1. every light skin black person i know with a little silkiness in their hair wanna say they got some indian in them. let me guess, cherokee?

    4. I don't know about that though. I am a very light complexioned woman from West Africa who can almost say there is no white in my family…my folks have looked back too, we might be wrong though but I doubt it.

    5. keep the beat going i want to chime in…

      real talk this term half-breed or even mixed has Black people all up in a bunch and they don't even know that everyone is… with few exceptions.

      it is almost scientifically impossible at this point to be of one race in the world. there's been so much breeding amongst the races you can't possibly have a true blood line. But if you're Black and living in America, unless you are a first generation African American, there's very little chance of you tracing your blood line. You'd have to know your entire tribe going back thousands of years. Even when Gates did the special on PBS he said it would actually cost hundreds of thousands of dollars to trace ones blood line to have conclusive information.

      But back to my original point, how you get upset with someone who is mixed? Even if you go back to tribes in Africa, if I was from this tribe and you was from that tribe, your a*s was mixed. We might look the same but we mixed. So what does it really mean? It's all relative.

      You know who didn't like half-breeds? Adolf Hitler.

      Are we trying to emulate the Anglo-Saxans here? C'mon son.

      1. Genetics determines your phenotypes. Your physical characteristics. Your race is how you live. The fake dudes like Henry Louis Gates want you to believe that you are your genetics. That you are as white as you are black because you have 1 European ancestor out of thousands of Africans.

        Get your mind right cause these dudes will have you thinkin you white. Dem Ivy League "Professors of African American" studies is a bunch of closet conservatives that couldn't find the hood with a GPS. C'mon now.

        1. "Dem Ivy League “Professors of African American” studies is a bunch of closet conservatives that couldn’t find the hood with a GPS. C’mon now."

          Amen to that!

        2. Wait a minute… now I'm not necessarily a fan of the Ivy-League Af-Am professors (I'm not in that field at all, I do statistics and public policy ish) but this is a pretty nasty thing to say.

          The academic world is pretty damn conservative as is—and we should respect the work and struggle these folks go through to talk about black people *at all.*

          A few quotes I've enjoyed from white professors at an "Ivy School:" "Who cares about black people drowning in New Orleans, it's just a hurricane."

          "If you are a black student, you shouldn't do things about black people, it's not objective."

          "We are diverse because we have 1 black student this year."

          Point is, you gotta be less arrogant dude. I may not agree with Gates and company (most of the time I write stuff ripping their ideas apart) but to call them a fancy up form of "Uncle Tom" is not respecting the game whatsoever.

          We need these people to help protect black students who go through these rather racist universities so that they become the future CEOs, nonprofit starters, civil rights lawyers, etc. who may hire your kids someday.

          I have a lot of "ghetto" and "hood" friends, many of whom have gone to jail, killed people, run drug rings, etc., and they would never, ever talk like this about these "Ivy League" professors because they respect the game.

          And by the way, Gates DID spend time in the hood, and so do many of the other professors who do good sociological work on inner-city life.

          But yea, if our requirement for blackness is so strict that we require a dude to look, act, sound, walk, a very particular way, then we are completely doomed. Thankfully this kind of attitude is getting out of vogue.

    6. dude, you can't be serious. o_0

      my mother is light (lighter than you i might add) and she is hardly a half breed. straight from west africa.

      1. Tunde

        1) I apologize to you that you werent selected by nature to be blessed with a natural membbership to LightSkinNation. However you can claim membership under our legacy clause

        2) Please school me on that, because I was under the impression that our people (African) were of a particular hue on average and any one of us who were lighter or fairer of skin were mixed with something somewhere down the line with another race. I want to knwo so I dont spew misinformation.

        1. naw i'm soooo good. i don't want to be part of your light skinned nation. i love my complexion.

          the majority of people that i've come across in nigeria are of a darker hue but there are plenty of lighter skinned people. a lot of people on my mom's side are about your complexion. it has nothing to do with mixing of races. africans come in a variety of colors. lol

        2. Light-skinned Nigerian checking in…:-)…Hmmmm….both parents are Nigerian….can traces both sides back several generations. No Euro here…please reevaluate your beliefs.

  33. #longa$$comment

    I don’t agree that Jill’s thinking about black men has everything to do with her size, a failed marriage or the fact that she is a single mother cos those things are not the sum of her experiences…

    I’ve been feeling that sting since I was 14…maybe even before that… I am being honest…it exists within me…and it took me a long while to understand why it hurts…

    I asked some else about this before I commented here. Her take on Jill’s view was ‘She was rationalizing prejudice. We are a new people & our task is to create a new history that unhinders everyone’. I co-sign this response…100%…we have to stop teaching our kids that it’s wrong to think interracial dating is wrong but we must also teach the kids to take pride and contribute positively to our community…it hasn’t been easy to get where we are…that said they may still want to jump ship and marriage a white person…that's fine but they need to understand that the grass aint always greener on the other side just cos it’s different…

    I cannot truly relate to feeling betrayed cos of slavery in america…#differentpointofview

    I’m just an african girl…born there but raised in england…I’ve been lucky to know many friends from different cultures growing up…I find that this sting occurs in girls where culture and tradition is held dear in their families (e.g. african, japanese, indian etc)… it is not just a 'black with white' thing to my friends and I…

    In England when I see interracial dating, I think traditon is not an issue, assume there’s love and I don’t blink… but I wont lie when I see an african brother with a white girl… my sceptical eyebrow raises and changes my face into a scowl almost instinctively …sometimes it doesn’t just sting it cuts me right up…prime example of the latter is my younger brother…he is now dating a white girl…not a problem but what I do have a problem with is he tolerates sh*t from her that he would never tolerate from a nigerian girl…but he’s told me that if they get marriage he wouldn’t mind bringing his kids up traditionally or even moving back home to nigeria to do so…one aspect of tradition for us also dictates that our women are raised to be submissive to our men…I’m talking near total submission here…

    My father beats, cheats, disrespect and controls my mother…he stopped her career and holds the purse strings…looking after him and the kids was meant to be enough of an aspiration for her…sad truth is my mother was raised to know her place and she believes that she’d be seen as a failure if she left my dad… I was raised to never fail a man and to serve a husband no matter what a man’s failings may be; never questioning him…even if he’s beating you to death u are told to just pray…not leave…no counselling or intervention…just prayers…that’s it… I’m like huh?…pray but get the f* outta there too… #sowrong…Anyway as far as my mum’s concerned she failed cos I won’t conform to this stupid notion…

    There is absolutely nothing wrong with interracial dating or marriages…i've seen some good ones…in any good relationship there must be love, respect, trust, honesty, communication and teamwork (each is the strength behind the other). Usually in nigerian society, this is not the case …white women are held on up a pedestal and revered as delicate flowers but we are not…that aspect of it for me parallels what Jill explains…so yeah I’m cynical when I see a black african man with a white woman…why?…because he did nothing to change things for his mother or his sister(s)…I don’t doubt that as a child he might have initially tried to protect his mum but as he grew up and reached manhood he helped to perpetuate this myth that a man is his woman's god…so the cycle never ends in our society….usually in an interracial marriage where they move away from the western world to live back home, he will teach his kids the same thing his father taught him about a woman’s place in his world… because he wants to continue to have his cake and eat it! And that’s my problem with interracial marriages back home…it's twisted and the thought just cuts me every time.

    1. "I don’t agree that Jill’s thinking about black men has everything to do with her size, a failed marriage or the fact that she is a single mother cos those things are not the sum of her experiences… "

      Thank you, I was gonna say something about this, but I got caught up in a sensitive subject for me.

  34. looks like i missed one hell of a post. over 100 comments already. i agree with dr. j on this post. this right here sums up my feelings on the topic:

    "But don’t put it on young successful Black men, it’s not our responsibility to fix it by only dating Black women. Let us be great. Give us the ability to make choices in life, and we will afford you that same."

    i am an advocate of interracial dating. i don't see anything wrong with it. i actually haven't gone that route but if i was feeling someone of a different racial background i wouldn't hesitate to pursue things. when i see a black woman with a white man in public i don't think ill thoughts about her or him. it really doesn't matter to me.

  35. I'll keep this simple and short. There are obviously 2 sides to this. The Black Woman side and the Black Man side. The Black Woman side has been calling Black Men dogs, broke N-words, etc for as long as I've been alive. The Black Man side has been calling Black Women gold diggers and h0es for as long as I've been alive. We've let a few on both sides spoil the bunch. In short, we have to stop this sh*t and start showing some respect to one another. To the women I say, be realistic with your standards. You're single for the same reason the dude you just turned down is single and it ain't because you want to be. Men, looks fade, brea$ts sag, and a*ses develop dimples. We have to start looking at more than just the eye candy. There's more to women than just what you see. Believe me on that.

  36. I think it's hilarious that Google Ads is now throwing out an ad for an interracial dating site on the side of my screen. Just sayin.

      1. Thank you! I'm hoping to inspire more of you to put up your pictures because I like to put faces to the names here. Although, I guess there's really no way of knowing that you didn't cut & paste out of a magazine or go crazy on photoshop (I'm convinced Tunde did because those teeth are almost blinding).

        1. Well I'm paranoid and I know people everywhere. And I work with the government. And I'm like a 100% honest in what I say and the things I've done. (Although I've stopped sharing as much as I used to on the internet) So I will probably not post a picture. Sorry. It's just the former gangster in me.

        2. imma add a pic. but the next time one of you's run up on me in the Giant while i'm buying toilet paper, i'm punching you in the throat. #truestory

          Her: OMG, are you Dr. J?!

          He: [Places generic brand toilet paper back down]

        3. Dr J – Thank you. Bright side I guess, now you can say that you can understand how celebrities feel. Well, at least some lesser known celebrities.

          J – I understand and won't hold it against you. I am a little too honest about some things on here as well (my fam) and wonder if one of them will stumble across here. Especially since when I was still lurking I sent a couple posts to my sister to try to show her how she does some dumb ish.

          *Part of me thinks you don't want to put your picture up because you look like a cross between Gollum, Flava Flav, and Lil' Wayne. Just sayin.

  37. Well, a lot has happened in the comments since my lunch break.

    I read Jilly's piece, and I understand it. She expressed how IR makes her, Jill Scott, feel. Her spirit, her soul hurts, and she attempted to explain. The problem with this topic is that the proponents of IR never truly seek to understand why some black women feel this way. Proponents don't truly hear her, and thus bellittle her feelings, and tell her to "get over it." Here's the thing, black women have been getting over it ("it" being slavery to IR and everything in between) for centuries now. What do you think gave birth to this "strong black woman" meme?

    Most people have made up their minds regarding IR, and refuse to truly listen to the other side. Calling someone racist because she isn't excited about IR is not an effective way to encourage dialogue, and is a shallow way of thinking about the issue of IR. It's a lot deeper than the multi-cultural black intellectuals of today would ever want to admit… because we would rather just "get over it, get over our past, than to critically deal with it so we can actually heal.

    1. Let me be clear, I didn't say Jill was racist, I said she was a racialist. I called that commenter racist because she said I hate half-breed. That's racist.

      And if you peep the post, I said that I feel Jill and I won't excuse her sentiments, but when I say get over it, what I mean is, IR is not that deep, we're making it deep. We're overcomplicating the subject because some people are fighting tooth and limb to fight change. I think the truth of the matter is that we have dealt with it, some of us have, others haven't and they are still complaining about it.

      1. I hear you… really, I do. All I'm saying is, IR is deep for some. Our experiences shape us, and some black women have experienced being rejected b/c they are black women… not just in relationships, but in all facets of personal and professional life. Instead of saying "get over it", let's have a legitimate discussion about it, keeping history in mind. That's all…

  38. After reading this post I really had to sit back, absorb and think about how I was going to respond to this.

    First and foremost I just want to say that I love black men, without a doubt I love them. I think black men are one of the most amazing creations to walk the earth. Eveything about him screams that he is a leader…he was born to lead, the ultimate alpha among the many races of men, in my opinion. So yes, I am bias to dating a black man…that is just my preference.

    Now on to this post. Dr.J I must first commend you for tackling this situation but I must say that I do find some personal discrepancies in this post.

    First, our girl Jill was married for seven years not one. She had all intentions of marrying the father of her child until he called it off and left her for his ex. The song to which you make reference does not simply speak of how she views her man as her personal afrodisiac but she also uses the term Crown Royal to express that her man is regal, that he is of royalty and it was never about people "Getting In The Way" of what she was doing, the song was about principle and sometime for principle you gonna have to whip some a**. Sidenote: I did get the joke. And yes…Its Love cause at the end of the day, through it all she still has more than enough love to give. So, her track record alone makes her more than qualified to speak.

    I do agree and believe that we are were all brought up as racialists in some way. We all have been made to believe that certain outcomes in life are attributed to race. Hence the violence thats been going down in DC for the past few weeks.

    To your question as to where we are now… We are where you have lead us to be. We are lost. The reason we don't resemble the black women of generations before us is because your voice has become silent in our lives. Believe or not next to God your voice is one of the most powerful voices in our lives and because of your absences we have lost the directions necessary to stand beside you, to walk with you,to talk to you, to love you, to respect you and to be vulnerable with you. We have adapted to change because we had no choice. You were taken from us. The majority of you falling victim to the streets, violence, drugs and death. So we had to adapt. Generations and generations of the absence of you in our lives has landed us here. So we have had to put on our strong face and develop the character of not needing you. But truthfully we do…we always have and always will. You are the balance in our lives. In recent generations all we have witnessed is our mother push and be strong 24/7, 365 days of the year. Many of us have not had the pleasure of seeing our mothers exude the qualities of the black women in the Civil Rights era. We have not had the pleasure of seeing her be vulnerable with her man, to be supple, to kiss him, hold him close and tell him how much she misses him and needs him. We have not had the pleasure of seeing her be a successful woman in the street and a Domestic Goddess in the home. So I ask you how are we to even begin to need and want you and resemble the qualities that made black women so great in the Civil Rights era if we have never witnessed first hand the roles required to fill this position?

    And yes I had to bring up the fact that Black men were taken from us because the truth is relationships and families begin with you! You are the head and therefore the leader.

    I agree with you that we do not need to travel to know that just a short time ago you all were in jail or dead for looking at a white woman let alone dating one. However, I do not believe she was placing any type of responsibility on you young successful black men to only date black women nor belaboring over this topic. I believe she was just bringing understanding to the reaction of black women when they see a black man with a white woman. So, often our reactions have been labeled as hatred but the truth is that its a pain…a deep pain not hatred. So really there is nothing to be over because there was nothing to argue in the beginning. The article was just a woman bringing to light the reasoning behind most black woman's reactions to such a situation.

  39. Black women aren't the only ones that need to come to terms with interracial dating. There are many races who share the same sentiment when it comes to interracial dating it just so happens that the black woman's opinion gets the most attention and spotlight because she is honest about her thoughts. Truth be told every race of women have a problem with interracial dating. This white woman that is so wanted, complains about indian, hispanic and asian women taking their men, i've heard it many times.

    Everyone is always quick to label it as closed-minded, but is it? Would it be seen as normal if an elephant and a horse decided to start a relationship and procreate? Yes, that's random and pertains to animals but still it would be seen as unusual and not of the norm.

    I am dating a black man and have dated black men all of my life. They happen to love me and me the same of them. I have no problem with getting them and the same applies to them of me. I personally can not see myself giving birth to a biracial child not knocking those who do.

    I feel that black men need to come to terms with interracial dating. If it were so much about "love" and dating who you want no concerned with what people think, some of the black men who do date interracial don't seem to exercise the same confidence they display when they and their love are alone behind closed doors when they are in the street. I can never recall seeing a black man with his woman of another race walking proud with her, it is as if he is searching for the disapproval from someone especially a black woman when she walks past so that he and his love can quietly whisper to each other how disgusted they are with closed-minded people when they themselves are closed-minded.

    I say to each their own. In reality not all black men are dating interracially, it is just getting the attention because it is a hot button topic.

  40. J – I understand and won’t hold it against you. I am a little too honest about some things on here as well (my fam) and wonder if one of them will stumble across here. Especially since when I was still lurking I sent a couple posts to my sister to try to show her how she does some dumb ish.

    *Part of me thinks you don’t want to put your picture up because you look like a cross between Gollum, Flava Flav, and Lil’ Wayne. Just sayin.

    _________________________________

    LOL. No I have participated on other boards before and didn't realize I was telling stories about people that were on there. I like to be honest and if I had a picture up I probably wouldn't share as much.

  41. I say to each their own. In reality not all black men are dating interracially, it is just getting the attention because it is a hot button topic.

    _________________________________

    So true. I hate to belabor the point but it really is only certain types of dudes. Tiger Woods, Bill Bellamy, Wayne Brady types. The only real hood dudes that date white girls are rich dudes. Celebs and ballers. But your average dude that grew up in the hood and went to school with black people does not date interracially. Maybe occasionally. They might f**k interracially but they don't go around chasing white girls and probably wouldn't marry one.

    1. Clarify something for me. What is the difference between a Bill Belamy type dude and a "hood dude" that makes them more attracted to white females? Are you saying only successful black men date white women?

  42. First, i want to say i LOVE black men. I don't believe every negative stereotype or generalization aimed at them by the media or ABW. I don't believe them because i am a happy, single, educated, no-baby-daddy having, no-weave wearing sister so that kinda makes me a mythical unicorn. So, if i actually exist i know the same goes for black men. I personally, know tons of great guys that only date black women so i don't really see this as an issue. Of course, i was raised in Memphis (side-eye to IR dating) before i came to Dallas (more IR dating) so that could be the reason. I think everyone should love who loves them and not be concerned with what everyone else is doing. The only problem i have is when a man or woman exclusively dates outside of their race due to some negative experience they have had. It seems kinda weird that you have totally excluded any person that look like your own parents, siblings, children. So what you weren't hot stuff with the ladies in high school/college, NO EXCUSE. I was funny looking in high school but came into my own in college. But, i still love black men. Even though, i do give the side-eye to a few guys that see me now and have a case of The Vapors (Biz Markie). LOL

  43. I'm not an avid reader of this blog…but ran across this post and found the comments interesting.

    I wanted to pose the question (forgive me if its already been discussed, there are a lot of comments); Is it only the successful Black men with white women that cause the wince or is it any Black man? Is there an issue when Becky is married to RayRay from around the corner who is working as a delivery driver or maybe even unemployed?

    1. My observation is that this really only happens in the south, mid west or smaller towns where the white men tend to be uneducated and poorer. In which case a black man might be more desirable than a white man if the white girl has aspirations of living better. In big cities racism is more subtle. In the DMV for example there is really zero chance of some suburban chick from Fairfax bringing home Soufeast Black from around my way. It just doesn't happen.

      1. I don't really have a problem with IR dating, but it hurts a lot less when Becky is with Ray Ray the delivery than when she's with the dude that has a degree and the 401K, jussayin'. Maybe I need to get out the south though!

    2. This isn't a real answer to your question, because I tend to really not have an issue with IR relationships (unless it's the situation I pointed out above); but, I personally don't equate success with having higher education and lots of money. So, Ray Ray the delivery driver could be successful (to me) if he spends wisely and is intellegent (regardless of a piece of paper that says he is).

    3. The reality is both. Ray Ray, whether unemployed or barely employed, or Mr. Successful, or the Baller all of them. Black women don't want to see their men outside of their race if they object to Interracial Dating. In short, not hey don't want him, but you can't have him either. This is the type of logic that @Streetztalk brought up on Wednesday.

  44. I enjoyed reading the comments more than I enjoyed readint the article itself. Dr. J should be ashamed for condeming Chocolate Drop's because of her comments. It was just plain disrespectful.Isn't the point of commenting to voice opinions and get differing views so everyone should be applauded for having an opinion.

    Personally I am perfectly fine with interracial dating, seeing a black man with a white woman or vice versa takes nothing away from me. I have enough self confidence to know that if a man doesn't want me, it's not my fault and there's nothing I can do nothing about it. However what does vex me is a black man that solely dates white women reason being because they think ALL white women are more attractive than black women or because they want a "pretty" baby.( yes, I've actally had an acquaintance said this bull. Basically a light-skined, "good hair" baby." In a way I think solely dating people ot of your race is a form of self hate like Tyra Banks once said. If you do not think your own race is beautiful then there's something in your own reflection you must hate.There are some men that will not even look once at a woman of color no matter how beautiful she is but will quickly chase after a white female with a face that looks like a car just ran over it.

    1. If you're wondering why… and her name is Juniebug not Chocolate Drop or whatever alias she comes up with next… it's because she said something extremely racist and insensitive. Earlier this week she did something similar and I didn't like it. She has a tendency to say the wildest things and that can turn people off from a post. But she does this on purpose. When she was Juniebug I enjoyed some of her comments, but calling multiracial people, "half-breeds" was totally out of line.

      The fact of the matter is I was right, if it's not about sex she's nowhere to be found. She bowed out early because she knew she wouldn't be able to hang. She couldn't, case closed.

      PS – I find it odd that you have to announce that you are bowing out too. Do I call ESPN and say, I'm not watching Women's basketball, before I change the channel? Does ESPN laugh at me if I keep watching for another 8-9 hours. (Re: 20 comments today by her.)

      There are differences of opinions and there is offensive behavior. I have no issues with what I did.

  45. Yall are right. I didn't answer the question. Yes I'm not really upset when I see a brother with a poor white girl (i guess I have to flip the script.) But remember I said race is not genetics. It's culture. It's how you live. In my mind the poor white girl is more likely to share African American values and beliefs as opposed to a wealthy waspy white girl. So yes, I'm less disturbed when the white girl appear poor, less blonde, less waspy or whatever the white girl equivalent of Ray Ray is. 🙂

  46. I'm not sure I understand where your response came from Dr. J. I listened to her talk about HER pain. She said noted where it came from, she said more power to them. I didn't hear her say ONCE that black men need to come back to black women. I didn't hear her give a prescription on how to make black men date black women. She commented on an issue that OUR community has been talking about for a long time. She made her comment. Some people feel that way in the closet and some people are out in the open. Feeling a sting and saying "That's wrong" are two different things. I think she is entitled to her opinion, just like anyone else.

  47. Yes this subject has been beat to death. I feel like with all that happens in the world today if two people can find happiness then who am I to question it? We spend so much time looking at other people trying to figure out what they're doing that we can't get our own lives straight. If people want to date outside their race then what's it to me? I'm still black, I'm still beautiful and I'm still going to be me. Even if its for the "wrong" reason I'm not going to stress it, the woman who's with him now did me a favor. One less mistake for me to make! Find your own happiness and keep it moving.

  48. OMG! Can't believe I read every damn post in this…[bored and waiting for the Rotten Tomatoes show to come on]. Best comment so far [and I'm misquoting/paraphrasing] When taking advance be wary of who's giving it. Are women really taking relationship advice from a big chick, 2x divorced raising a kid by herself? She has every right to her opinion, but it's HER OPINION…who cares? Most of us [read: college educated, gainfully employed Black folks] don't think twice when passing an IR couple. Why? Got too many other concerns [mortgage, student loans, what to cook for dinner tonight, etc…]. And BTW, if you're lucky enough in this world to find someone who loves you, respects you and treats you the way you DESERVE to be treated you better hang on to them because you might not be lucky enough to find another. :o(

    And LOL at all the DMV folks up in here…HoCo stand up!!!! :0)

    Oh and Seven and Sane…if ever in doubt you've got one single, straight, employed BM out here that loves 1/2 breeds… >:0)

  49. In my opinion, we’ve spent so much time NOT needing each other, that we don’t even WANT each other anymore.

    This is the most simplistically profound statement that I've read on this blog. Kudos, Dr. J.

    I can't wait to get back to the office next week so I can get in on these conversations again. And Happy (belated probably by the time you read this) Birthday, Anna N!

  50. Both my parents are from west africa. My mom is mistaken for a hispanic all the time.

    Do not be so quick to discount Streetz. Africa was ran thru and thru by all….by the Europeans, by the Moors, by EVERYONE. There is all kinds of mixture of blood in Africa. Not to forget we were once a strong empire in ourselves which comes with a lot of foreign trade.

    Northern Africa and Eastern is of Middle eastern lineage. Its mainly the west where you can find the less shared blood, but still exists.

  51. Quite frankly, I wholeheartedly agree with Jill Scott, in spite of her being "overweight, divorced with 2 children and 2 failed marriages. "

    I didn't know perfection was the criteria for being wise or offering a simple opinion about a common sense observation.

    Based on the way many of you seemed to jump on Chocolate Drop for expressing a dissenting opinion, it seems clear that ppl really aren't paying attention to the ramifications of what's going on.

    With interracial dating, people seem quick to assume that the love is actually "genuine." But how would you know that? Because interracial couples deal with more scrutiny, than non-interracial couples?

    I'm sorry but I've been around white women married to black men that hate black women. I've been around white men dating and married to black women who claim that they're not racist simply b/c they married a black woman. So how could these types of people possibly truly love their black spouses?

    Racism doesn't disappear due to interracial dating. Rather, it becomes more pacified and rationalized.

    Then, we as black folks start talking about "live and let live."

    I don't believe these interracial relationships are all rosey and perfect, although I do feel that true love can be found across color lines.

    So yes, I do whince, because more times than not both black women and black men involved in interracial relationships have problems and stereotypical notions about black people.

    I also find it rather suspect that many of these interracial relations suddenly appear as soon as $$$ is involved.

  52. I just had to comment on this.

    The problem for me is with the blanket statements. I'm very objective – I try to see all angles on things unless it goes against my morals/values, even if I have an opinion.

    Jill Scott's "shared pain; history; struggle; progress'" (to paraphrase) – we don't all have that shared pain nor history. Because race doesn't define culture or historical experience. There are plenty of Africans do not identify with the American black struggle. Swedes and other Europeans may not relate to what the American white history is about. Just because they may look "black" or "white" respectively does not mean we can pin what we feel on everyone else.

    Hell, blacks owned slaves. whites were indentured servants and slaves prior. So how do we know, by seeing a person of a certain race with another of a different race, that their historical bloodlines don't connect and relate? Is this the norm? Who in the hell knows for certain one way or the other?

    Personally, I'm attracted to whatever race of woman I'm attracted to. I date and have dated whatever woman I please. She can be black, asian, latina and yes, white. The two most meaningful relationships I've had thuse far was with a Trinidadian and a Korean. does that make me less of a black man? No. None of that means I'm self-hating or hating black women. Beauty being in the eye of the beholder is a tired cliche, but its true when it comes to companionship. And that is fueled by that individual's beliefs and influences, no matter how right or wrong one may think those are.

    And to assume that majority interracial couples are genuine is just as asinine as to assume that majority are not. Its equally asinine to assume that all intra-racial couples are genuine because of some point of shared history.

    In this day and age, with so many spheres of influence, it comes down to the individual. because while many of us identify with our shared history, our personal history guides our preferences as well. That you simply cannot blame on self-hatred. You can, however, blame it on that person's preferences and let him/her live their own life.

    1. I'm not sure if your comment was directed towards mine or not, but here's my response.

      One can't touch on race without making a form of a blanket statement, because we all are naturally inclined to be biased based on our individual experiences.

      In the same way you may not be self-hating, that does not mean that other blk men and blk women aren't.

      My point was I agree with Chocolate Drop, J, and another commenter from above.

      Personally, I am against ingenuine interracial dating, and I think a lot of times that exists in the USA.

      I can't speak for London, where it's the norm and where the same racial issues aren't present.

      Still, individuals make up a collective, whether we like it or not.

      The problem is blacks have never learned to work together, and potentially, this is why we have remained the "low man" on the totem pole, because individual needs always usurp community needs and even the needs of future generations.

      IR dating is just another way where blacks remain separated. I'll become cool with IR dating as soon as we fix our stuff, and by the looks of things that's not going to happen, so I might as well go with the flow.

  53. Jill Scott and every other black woman needs to get over it. Successful black men aren't sitting around single waiting for successful and ATTRACTIVE black women. Men have a smaller window for marriage and children than women do. If the white woman is attractive and supportive, why wait? Men are more focused on looks than women. Being successful isn't enough. So black women need to stop crying when they're Jill Scott's weight and can't find a man. If you want him to be successful, you need to keep yourself up.

  54. Ok, wow, I'm very late to the party.

    I just want to make certain points.

    I am an 1st generation African American, yes my parents were born in West Africa. In some West African countries, some slaves did return to Africa after slavery was over. That's why you will meet some Africans with americanized names. i.e. John Williams. (yes I do know someone named that LOL) So that COULD, i said could, so don't yall be jumping on me LOL, be the reason for some lighter skinned Africans, the same thing goes for northern Africans, they are further away. Plus Africans explored the world too, just because you didn't learn that in school doesn't make it any less true.

    Also, the closer you are to the equator the darker your skin is, genetically it has to do with protecting the skin, the more melanin, the more protection etc. That is the reason why people who are of nordic decent or live further north have lighter skin and hair… Swedish people for example.

    Ok back to the subject at hand. I understand where Jill was coming from and where Dr. J is coming from.

    I'm not going to lie, I work in the corporate world and when I see certain black men, I automatically know that they don't exclusively date black women. And it's true, the more successful you are the more, there will be more instances of BM dating outside of their race. Now does it bother me, no, because a long time ago I decided that I was going to look at it for what it was, and 9 times out of ten they wouldn't be men I would date. Don't get me wrong, I love an educated man, but certain types don't attract me. I need someone a little more down to earth, and ones that I have encountered aren't like that. I'm not trying to make a blanket statement, but that is just my experience.

    I also feel like a lot of BW need to get over it. maybe I'm naive, but the anger about the situation is what baffles me. THAT IS NOT YOUR MAN, now if you lost your man to a white woman and you see them walking down the street, then I can see you being angry. But you don't know that black man, and you don't know that white woman. Worry about what is going on in your life and in your relationship. I will also agree with Chocolate Drop, on this point, the blaming of BW as to why you will only date outside of your race is tired and ridiculous. If you prefer something else, then just say that and I will respect it.

  55. Let me add my two cent to this subject. I understand where Jill Sott is coming from. I also understand Dr. J's stance on this subject that we should not care who other people are dating. but being 51years old and still single (not for the lack of trying) I wince too. But let me say this living in a large urban area that is very segregated. I see black men with all races of women, but I do not see very many men of different races pursuing black women as our men do. I guess if the playing field was balanced, maybe we as black women would not "wince". If you look around in your communities, places of employment, churches. etc. the women outnumber the men. whatever function I attend be it a party, cultural event, fundraising event, etc. the black men are not there. for every ten black women, there may be one black man. unless you are at a sporting event. We, black women are not being pursued by our own or any body else for that matter. so it hurts when you see someone with potential that does not select one of us. the point is we as black women are not feeling the love, being wanted and desired as the women of other cultures are. I could go on, but I want Dr. J and others to look at this perspective and understand why we as black women would "wince".

  56. I've been checking this blog out for a while. Good stuff. I've dated interacially a few times, and wanted to put in my two cents in…

    First, I've got to describe myself. There's a point to this. I look like a skinnier Charles S. Dutton. On a scale of 1-10, I'm a 6, on a good day, a 7, and if I could cut out red velvet cake, beer, and carnitas, I'd be an 8. I'm a fairly successful corporate cog. I've got my own career aspirations. Never been married and don't have kids. I'm what one would call, a blerd, that is, a black nerd, and I revel in it. That being said, I can hold my own on the court and know my way around a boxing ring.

    To make a long story short, I'd say I'm a decent catch. Yeah, I have quirks, a flippant tongue, and could lose a few pounds. I'm a work in progress. But I'm faithful, ambitious, and a not so bad person to be around.

    Still there? Fantastic!

    I've dated around, but I've had trouble catching the eye of a lot of African-American women…that is until I'm not with one. Then, I get eyes filled with daggers. I get called a sellout by women that couldn't be bothered to make eye contact with me if I'm just saying "Hello".

    Please don't misunderstand, I KNOW I'm not God's gift to women. My problem, is that it seems like I'm not allowed to date women that want me by women that really don't seem that interested in me.

    I just want what anyone else wants, and that's to be happy. If I find that with someone who has less melanin than me, should I be denied that happiness?

  57. Well, RVC really is one of the better things in life. Cream cheese frosting on the tongue. Moist, crimson cake melting in the mouth.

    I'm going to need a damned shock collar…

    1. I literally lol at the shock collar…my sentiments exactly…there's little better than red velvet cake *sigh* Now I'm going to be in search of some as soon as I leave my daily place of imprisonment. Thanks A LOT sir! LOL

  58. So I saw this blog on 20 something bloggers and had to click on the link. Anywho, interracial dating is a touchy subject and everyone has a different opinion on it. As an African-American woman I have dated different guys including white ones and while that is great and all I would prefer a black man. I date white men and other non men of color not out of a preference but because white men are the ones who ask me out. I have to admit though I know where the "wince" comes from and I still do it til this day. We may not agree with everything Jill Scott had to say but trust, she didn't say anything a lot of African-American women talk about or think in their heads. I also think it's important to discuss these issues as a community. Perhaps our sisters need to follow the lead of black men and be open to other options as well instead of waiting around for men who are persuing options elsewhere. its very important to always be critical and thoughtful in regards to these issues.

  59. I don't know if anyone is still reading but I had to share this.. last night I was watching Law & Order SVU and Jill Scott was guest starring on there. Her character played an abusive sister to her sister with MS. She was a mean lady who manipulated her sister and stole her money. It was ironic because I was looking at her like, "look at her being mean to the unfortunate and that's supposed to be her family." I was mixing reality and fiction, but I thought i'd share.

    In other news…

  60. @sept919 if those black men are not at the places you put down then were do you think they are?

    If the black men were you live are dating other women then why do you think they are?

    What can black women do to change this?

  61. I hate woman that say, “black men have it easier cause they can get any woman of any race and its much harder for black women to get men of other races.”So what are saying black men should only date black women cause black women can only get black men? Do you know how selfish and degrading that sounds? I mean thats bullshit if a black man can get a woman of any race so can a black woman so please stop complaining besides theres alot of worse things in life then marrying someone of a different race. And dont give me that bullshit that the media worships the white woman. Black men go through the same shit in the media everywhere you look its always something about Zac Efron or Brad Pitt or Rob Patterson or George Clooney and everytime there is a list of top 20 most beautiful women in the world who is always top 3? Beyonce thats right a black women so please dont give me that media BS cause black men have it just as hard its just we arent as open about it. And i’m not trying to attack any black women i love black women i’m just saying it goes both ways.

  62. I'm late but all I can say is damn and smh. I couldn't possibly read all of these comments but the early dialogue between chocolate drop and some of you brought a tear (I didn't let it fall though hahha). I haven't been in the dating game long, and though my daddy was not the best, I love him and I love Black men, and I get why any race of women would love them too.

    Whatever! Date who you want. But the way in which I am so carelessly treated by SOME Black men is what makes me wince. SO i get what Chocolate is saying about the problem being from within our own race. The comments that i've heard about Black women from Black men….The hatred. The encouragement from so many Black men to not date Black women because of a or b (barbershop talk) and because they've been hurt.

    Women are women. We are pretty much all the same acorss them board. Treat us right we will do anything for you no matter what race.

    But to hear some Black men say, we are not even worthy of consideration, that crap stings. The reasons why some of my very own friends refuse to date Black women baffle me. You can't tell me to get over that.

    "That's why your men don't want you…" I'm supposed to get over that? Spoken by someone who looks just like me. And Black men are saying it ain't possible for 100% of a race to date within itself I get that too, but when the intent behind the action is malicious, we have a serious problem. And it's just a mess.

    AND THEN, when a Black woman does get over it, and dates outside her race, boy does she hear it. Let ANY man I know find out I'm dating an other and I will never here the end of it. Like not funny banter and the congratulatory dap that Black men receive when they date outside their race, but the pure hatred and disrespect of the relationship. Like the relationship isn't even valid.

    And the mere fact that some Black men, some of you on this very post can't understand how Black women feel or don't give a damn is the problem. I'm hurt and I don't have to get the hell over it. How callus? How hateful to even say some bullhockey like that?

    But alas, just because something bothers you, does not mean you are against it. Interracial dating. Who cares? Be happy! I'd date outside my race if I met someone who loved and treated me with respect.

  63. As a woman of African descent, I understand where Jill is coming from whole heartedly. Black people today do not love themselves as a whole, and do not love each other. Take that anyway you want. Jill did a great job of expressing herself beautifully and eloquently.

    With that being said, I find it interesting that certain people want black woman to get over interracial dating, without understanding the essence of what a black women is, without understanding why black male/female relationships are pivotal. A black women is the mother of civilization, period. Every human being in the world was derived from herself and the black man. The primary role of a mother is that of caregiver. Look at the state of her children today, in utter disarray. How can she be happy to see that her children are failing, and her counterpart (the black man) is not there to help her put them back together. How can she turn away when the world tells her and her man that she is not good enough, so her man no longer values her African features but that of another.

    The issue is so much more complex than black women getting over it. The black man and woman need each other. The black family needs healing. I would be for interracial dating if it was genuine. (not saying its all ingenuine). But the shit is much deeper than boy meets girl, and boy likes girl. Why is boy attracted to said girl, and not someone who shares his hue. Why are the number of two parent homes in the black community depleting. The foundation of a functional society lies within the family, and if the black family is not together…then guess what their is going to be a whole lot of chaos concerning people that look like us.

    Coming from a traditional West African stand point, I see so much dislike when it comes to relations between African American men and women, its downright shocking sometimes. We need to get away from this Western way of thinking that we don't need each other, cause we do.

  64. I ALWAYS TYPE IN ALL CAPS, I AM NOT YELLING, LOL… HOW MANY BLACK SUPERMODELS ARE THERE? WHO CONTROLS THE FASHION INDUSTRY AND THE MEDIA? MAYBE IF THEY PUT MORE BLACK AND MINORITY WOMEN IN THE SPOTLIGHT… IT WOULD NOT SEEM AS THEY ARE TRYING TO PORTRAY WHITE WOMEN AS THE BEST TYPE OF WOMEN…. THAT IS THE REAL REASON BEHIND IT. HOW MANY RICH WHITE MEN RUN OUT AND MARRY BLACK WOMEN??? I AGREE WITH JILL

  65. Today is July 14, 2011, a year & some change removed from this post, but it is my belief that BW are just as outraged today's just as they were when this post was posted…

    @ChocolateDrop Off the meatrack, I hope you have evolved since this ordeal… You prove a point I was thinking to myself today…

    Black women cannot express their disdain for BM/WW IR Dating without looking like an ass…

    The Elephant in the room that a few men posted throughout the comment section is…

    WHY ARE BW CONCERNED WITH BM THEY ARE ULTIMATELY NOT ATTRACTED TO…???

    Now do you see how BW might look like assholes when they do this psycotic mess…

    I am waiting for an answer to this question… I'll wait…

    I always bring up this scenario because it illustrates how BW evaluate potential in the dating market…

    Wait until a dude is "ready" instead of checking for him in your dating prime…

    The reason why BW are up in arms because they get picked last to date… They have no leverage…

    When BW have dating choice… It is all wavy…

    But it is loathed when a BM has dating options…

    And BW are so up in arms about who BM date, but alot of you don't even treat BM well outside of your immediate family members…

    BW are only "loyal" to BM for three reasons

    1. BM are more attractive

    2. BW are picked last to date & marry by other races

    3. BM are the only ones who are going to put with your BS…

    So… I read all the comments & I am still waiting for legit answers to why women like Jill Scott feel a certain way about the BM they really would have no interest in…

    So, when the next interracial post shows up, I will repost this this, and see if I can get some perspective from the woman's side…

    Super Saiyan To The End

    1. Everytime you speak I have to remind myself you do not represent all black men. You're fixation is unattractive. fwiw, I'm white.

  66. I am a white woman and I only date black or mixed men.

    1) I do not find white men attractive at all, like ever.
    2) I like the contrast of the two skin tones – mine and his.
    3) Mixed babies are beautiful.

    It's just a personal preference! That's it. I've come across many black men that don't date white women. There's a lot of white men that don't date white women. It's 2013, interracial relationships are not uncommon.

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