Save us Obama!
It is no secret here that SBM loves “ignorant rap” music (I wish a mother f*****r would try to judge me too … lol). I have even decided to share my vast knowledge with the world in my “Moments Of Ignorance” posts … there is a dark side to all this … a very dark side.
The mysogany
For all of you who are afraid of big words and don’t know what misogyny means … I’ll help you out (your also the one’s I’m talking about!)
Misogyny
hatred, dislike, or mistrust of women.
cite: dictionary.com
But … while misogyny has been addressed in books and by well known advocates with koofis and natural hair I want to give it that SBM twist … as only I do.
When misogyny is talked about … it’s not literal. It goes well beyond just hitting a woman, kicking her down some stairs, and unannounced cumshots other blatant acts of disrespect … because I bet the most misogynystic men will claim “naw dawg … I loves me some women … I gots ta have the p***y!”
*sigh* …
Misogyny usually manifests itself as an overall disrespect for all women (simply because their women) and treating them like trophies, toys, c*m receptacles, and objects … instead of the givers of life and mothers of our children that they are (***Note*** I’m only talking about the good women with a good head on their shoulders, mean head game, non crazy tendencies, and will cook and do laundry)
To drive the point home … here are a few signs of a misogynist
Refers to every woman … no matter who they are … as b*tch. E.g. “yeah that b*tch gave birth to me and let me stay at her house for 30 years … but a b* is a b*”
No desire to treat any woman good … and is always seeing with what he can get away with. E.g “I bet I can smash her sister and then go home right after for dinner”
Touts the amount of random women he has slept with as a bragging point. Also gives himself extra points for not knowing the names of half of them.
Literally thinks ALL women as beneath him. His boss, his wife, his sister, his mama … all of them. And is quick to tell ya why. E.g. “I don’t care if she signs my checks … I’d have barefoot in that kitchen scrubbing my floors in no time”
Now that you know what I mean by misogyny (if you still don’t get it … you can go ahead and close the browser now and come back tomorrow you’re prolly one of the m*therf*ckers I’m talking about) … lets move on
BTW … I was once a misogynist. I recovered and its a daily fight (partially because I refuse to give up UGK)
It takes a strong strong … super strong mind and will to listen to huge amounts of more ingorant rap that is pervasice on the radios and television. Besides the promotion of overspending, rented rims, drinking, drugs, inflated asses, and … well 95% of what’s currently wrong with black society … you have tons of passive and active misogyny … yeah … there are two types.
Passive
Passive misogyny is not direct … its implied … like always calling a girl a b***h in a song. Also, demeans and devalues women without spelling it out.
Active
Active is worst … that’s when the someone directly tells the world that all women are b****s and to to swap em out like shoes. This is damn near an instruction manual on how to get backhanded by ma dukes.
Misogyny in music nowadays is the problem for some truly depraved actions by the youth out here. I still feel that chivalry is dead (actually read the post … it’s deep sh*t), but the rampant disrespect hurts my soul. Every woman is not a b*tch, good women do exist and need to be … treated well in bed, some women can be trusted (not all though … don’t get it twisted), and at their not second class citizens. It’s too convenient to blame music for all this … because its not just Webbie’s Gutta B***h single … but it’s not helping. If you think it’s rare instances … actually listen to the lyrics of International Player’s Anthem (I Choose You) … there is a whole song after Andre 3000’s verse
The solution … the SBM approved test before buying ignorant music. Yes … I feel anyone buying any of the actively ignorant music should be able to define “misogyny”, give 3 current examples of it, and explain why the electricity (its not just the lights) bill should be paid before spinning rims are purchased. After that … your 1 year card will be issued, too be renewed with a pop quiz on Martin Luther King Jr, Malcolm X, and the Black Panther Party.
Was today random … yeah … but do you feel me? Is there a need to fight some of the more prominent misogyny that is out here infecting our people? Is music the biggest issue? Am I the only one who can bob their head to a Soulja Boy song … but still is waiting on his public execution for crimes against hip-hop?
This was a great post and I do agree with it…i hope the that the younger generations could read this and do better…same goes for the older too cause that's who the young ones are learning from…smh
I also agree with this post and this issue does need to be addressed, so thank you for posting this. If from Jersey City {da hood} and I can't tell how many times I hear one of these young dudes talking bout how he can never find a good b* or how b*tches always treat him wrong. Umm, maybe that's because 1. You call all females biznitches or 2. You try to holla at a girl by commentin on her ass or her tig o' bitties. I always tell them if call out for a b*, don't be surprised if u get one.
I'm guilty of listening to "ignorant rap" too. I know all the words to the International Playerz Anthem.
Non post related:
Jersey City is super hood. I was there one day and thought I was on a replicated set of The Wire.
Give me Newark any day….except the number streets.
Welcome *pops champagne*
I know you'll hate this (especially since only 1 of them actually seems to be from there), but I can't think of New Jersey anymore without thinking of Jersey Shore. I'm sorry. *ashamed*
Good post…..and as a hip hop/rap and battle rap junkie, you're right about the misogyny running rampant in the genre.
Question though….due to the current season of The Boondocks, gotta ask you to clarify who you meant by Ma Dukes…..mom's or a fictional Madea like character played by Winston Jerome?
Question though….due to the current season of The Boondocks, gotta ask you to clarify who you meant by Ma Dukes…..mom’s or a fictional Madea like character played by Winston Jerome?
^^^DEAD!
Another sign is the guy who calls women "females". The one who says it nicely is a huge abuser because he soooo wants to use the b word.
As someone who uses "female" on a regular basis, I don't see why people think that word is so bad!
I use it all the time too and I didn't realize I was supposed to be offended when men did it until I started frequenting blogs. *shrugs*
Sidebar: Does this mean you're back?
it slights humanity, IMO. other species have females also (not to mention most use it in the same context female dogs, which of course is a b!tch) but a female human being is a girl/woman.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_J9lzpM1pDHM/Sb94PSSYeJI…
I'm sorry but I am going to have to give this post a no-sign. Since I'm not ignorant, I find ignorance to be funny to me. And misogyny is funny. Some great hip hop lines have come out of misogyny. Even some of the non-ignorant rappers have given out a few b words. Nas. J Cole. heck even that lite skin pu$$y nigg@ drake: "I hate calling the women b!tches/ but the b@tche$ loves it
I am not going to point the finger out the talentless like SB Tell'em and Webbie (people I don't listen to) and still give the green card to the greats, that just seems hypocritical to me. Instead i will focus on the REAL problem in pop rap and that is the materialism. I don't know how people can claim misogyny in rap when its women to buy the the commercial rap. What grown man you know listen to Nelly? Plus when I turn on my radio in NYC all I hear are crapping r&b hybrid records talking about how they want to buy a girl every expensive clothing line in the world and trick off on them. Some how that passes for romance in our community.
You can call me a misogynist, but the real problem is my lack of empathy to human being in general. I really don't care if calling you a word hurts your feelings, you are a sissy either way in my eyes. Now go hook a steak up
Materialism is a bigger problem than misogyny.. So getting money is worse than getting p*ssy from a b*tch.. Seriously? Nice try but I don't buy it.. The WORLD is materialistic.. That shit keeps the world functioning. Disrespecting women is "entertaining" from time to time, but not worth it at the expense of young girls with no direction admiring Kat Stacks. I don't know about you, but I don't want my future daughters to be subjected to that..
Your "no-sign" never addresses the problem. You addresses its manifestation in music when the point of the post was its manifestation in reality. Furthermore, SBM never gave anyone a pass/green card, he just said that it is more prevalent in a certain type of music. (Which we cant lie, it is). Of course pop rap has a problem w/ materialism but that is because materialism is a problem in the WORLD.
My comment was all over the place. Sorry.
I No-signed b/c the post was too PC.
You have to leave room for people to have fun with ignorance.
You can't tell other people what to be entertained by.
While I don't think misogyny is cool, I do think being BOLD is cool. And in this PC world, Too Short is a hero b/c he isn't scared to be himself. The Anti-Tunde
I aint mad at that
the anti-tunde? o_0
Hmm, that just makes you a misanthrope then. Hmph.
I got mad respect for you right now SBM! This post is on point!
Co-sign! Something has to be done..and the first order of business..is recognizing if you are in fact a Mysogynist…asking yourself why you listen to this kinda music on the regular..and why you purchase it?
I have two sons and I really hope the current state of music gets worked out before they hit their teens..right now I don't allow them to listen to anything…even R&B is all about having s*x with women..and s*x rooms and its just a trend…hopefull this trend will wear itself out soon and music will start being about loving a woman..and being in love…and love period.
I am so happy that you express your feelings and thoughts about this article so clearly! I feel like you! Being a woman with kindness, care and being there for others all over the world as a well known international artist, I fully agree with the writer of this interesting inspiring article.
I would like to communicate with the author of this article and also be of support to his work in the future.
Thank you to both of you for your constructive being and actions!
Lilo
I think you are missing the biggest source of Misogyny, and its not from the ignorant thugs in the hood or rap music. I can safely assume MOST men are passive misogynists, and are still great fathers, husbands, plumbers etc.
Misogyny greatest source and incredible strength comes from the intelligent, powerful and rich. Our pale skin counterparts have long been raised in communities where women play traditional roles such as mother and wife. They may push their daughters to be successful, but God forbid she doesn't find a husband and settle down with some grandbabies.
Go to an after-work mixer and listen to a group of mid-level managers who will talk about women as if they are a piece of a meat…. the same dudes who oversee mixed gender groups and can help/hinder early careers.
This is a male-dominated world,has been and will continue to be… whether you like it or not.
Aint nothin wrong witta little misogyny.. I go to the misoge parlor all the time.. Wait, what?
i literally LOL'd. Maybe I am a loser
Then that makes 2 of us,lol
Ditto
I died silently. Like I'm snickering right now. Misoge parlor. I love you.
*chortle*
iLaughed too!
This hits home for me.. The misogyny in rap has turned me off to a lot of popular music. I have too many women in my family to be so disrespectful.. If I even utter the word b*tch the wrong way, all my aunts and cousins will tie me down and have a Slapping Party.
I suppose this would be the best time to plug myself.. I'm looking towards a future in hip hop, and I promise I won't be that same bullsh*t. U can support me by showing love to my YouTube channel (http://www.youtube.com/remthemulatto) and/or following me on Twitter (http://www.twitter.com/remdotdot)
Awesome post!!
These dudes would never admit that they're part of the reason young black women are so f*k'd up now. They're the reason for a Kat Stacks becoming famous instead of going to therapy. However, one could also say that men started calling women bitches and hoes because women started acting like bitches and hoes (the video hoe movement?).. So which came first, the chicken or the egg? Everybody is responsible. The chicken and the egg should both be ashamed of themselves and do better.
"Always said if I rapped I'd say somethin' significant/
But now I'm rappin' 'bout money, hoes, and rims again…"
You need more people. Apparently, it happens to the best of them.
Well.. to be fair, u gotta give people a little bit of everything to be mainstream. People are attracted to it
Good post….society as a whole is a bit misogynistic. It isn't just hip hop. It spans across genres (i.e. a rock star singing about is "sweet cherry pie").
I have a concurring opinion. I agree w/ the end result that mysogyny is bad. However, I do not believe that rap music is the root. I generally do not buy into the whole philosophy that music is what is making people go wild. I feel that music reflects life especially in the way we think. There's a reason that music in the 90s was much better and this was because intellectually (not talking education) we were better as a people. As of current state, music is reflecting the way we value women which is foolish because they have been the backbone of our communities for centuries now.
Let it be known that I aint never met a man, mysogynist or not, who called his momma a b. Dudes be like "every woman a b but my momma aint a woman".
I disagree w/ your definition of a good woman. That in of itself may be mysogynistic.
Peyso: "I generally do not buy into the whole philosophy that music is what is making people go wild. I feel that music reflects life especially in the way we think. There’s a reason that music in the 90s was much better and this was because intellectually (not talking education) we were better as a people."
QFT. I was thinking about writing an article on how the increasing stupidity and dumbing down of society is leading to more banal, uncreative music. Art is a reflection of life, and now that kids are graduating from high school and an ever decreasing rate, you get foolishness like Soulja Boy becoming popular. That would have never happened in the 90s. I don't blame Soulja Boy either. If people are just dumb and will listen to anything, he and artists like him is the result.
It's just the beginning of the slope towards Idiocracy.
*shakes fist*
Dammit, i was just about to reference that movie before you beat me to it!!!
And if they ever make a movie about an ass, I'm moving to Canada, Brazil, somewhere…
I haven't seen the movie. I heard it was good.
To me their is a fine line between mysogyny and callin out bad behavior. I think 90% of rap is callin out females for real sh*t that they do. 10% is mysogyny. Callin females gold diggers and hos. Don't kill the messenger. Now Dr. Dre and Snoop pourin 40s on brawds heads in their videos. Mysogyny is hate for women. As much as people might not like what rappers say…..I doubt many rappers hate women. I mean if anybody hates women it would probably be a dude like R Kelly.
I mean if Nelly is doin a video called tip drill and 100 women show up to be clowned in it…..are the lyrics really mysogyny or is the dude just callin out the truth. I mean he aint smackin brawds around and sayin he want to kill them. He sayin a rack of yall brawds is some gold diggaz that would do anything for a dude with money. Then he prooves it with a video. 🙂 Don't kill the messenger. Check your girlz before you check the dudes. Don't females buy the majority of rap music?
O you could argue that females are products of mysogyny and now have diminished self worth?
*pulls out an imaginary uzi and blows away the messanger* Oh! Sorry, bro, I thought u were somebody else..
The problem is that some dudes use the word bitch/hoe as a synonym for woman. That's not fair. There are some bad girls out there. No doubt.. But why ALL women gotta get a bad rap cuz u f*k'd a couple of dirty broads. Ladies do that same sh*t. "N*ggaz aint shit" Nah, girl, all the dudes YOU f*k wit aint shit.
Some rappers make the line clear.. most don't (10% is kinda low). Now see, I'll rap about bad girls.. cuz these five star bitches and dimes and whatever they're calling themselves these days need to be called out for their indiscretions. But there will be no confusion that I love the women.. I just want these bad girls to see a therapist..
It's a mix bag to me… I love super ignorant music. Not on a normal basis but sometimes I just wanna curse and rap. I do understand what I'm listening to and what it says but it also talks about selling drugs and buying maybachs- neither of which I do.
While music might encourage the project it is by no means the root of the issue. On the other hand I think it's important that music that espouse these values (selling drugs, mistreating women, killin folks) be limited to those who understand that more times than not the people rappin about these things have not really experienced them (see ricky rozay).
cosine
BAWSE! Lol. I had too… I felt the ignorance comin on like tourrets.
Anywho… iCosign LMS.
FLACKA!! FLACKA!! (repeat 50-'lem times)
Lmao. Jesus be a fence… best line of the whole post:
"there is a whole song after Andre 3000′s verse"
Now listening to Jay-Z's "B***hes & Sister's"
Totally agree it goes both ways. If rap music is mysogyny that what is a Tyler Perry movie? 🙂
Satanism…
i just spit up my coffee.
Come on DeKeLa, that's an insult to Satan.
The root of Misogyny is power. Because men have been the more dominant sex throughout history, we have the luxury of being Misogynistic. Think of it this way. If a man says – "women are b*tches", he's being misogynistic. If a woman says "All men are dogs", she's just complaining. Both statements are stereotypical and derisive but one has greater sociatal implications than the other. Or take it out of the context of male/female relationships, and think of Racism. Racism sucks in general, but it sucks most when the folks being racist also have all the power. Does anyone know whether or not Native Americans are racist against black people? Do you care? Not really, because they have no power.
All this talk of hip-hop and it's misogyny is a little pointless to me. Misogyny permeates all areas of human life. If you wanna stop misogyny, level the playing field.
But in the power structure of the black family the black women has been head of household and primary bread winner. Probably safe to say 99% of all rappers were raised by a black women. So how likely is it that rappers really hate women? I just think misogyny is too strong a word and doesn't really describe what goes on in rap music…….Except for that first NWA album….that was mysogyny 🙂
I understand where you're coming from with the comment on the black family. My comment was geared toward misogyny in general, not misogyny in rap mucic. Rap music and those who perform it, as a whole, are no more or less misogynicstic than anybody else. They just say it.
your definition of mysogyny is not inclusive enough. Is racism simply hating another race? No, it also includes when you think that particular races are inferior to other races. Mysogyny is the same thing but plug in sex when you would have race. So, it is quite possible that these rappers are greats fathers and uncles and husbands and still be mysogynyst
J: "I just think misogyny is too strong a word and doesn’t really describe what goes on in rap music…….Except for that first NWA album….that was mysogyny"
I think NWA's second album (or third if you count the 100 Miles and Runnin' EP) was far more misogynistic than the first. This first album didn't have them dragging a woman into a car, shooting her, followed up by a song where they chant "one less b!tch you worry about!" in the chorus. And the ultimate misogynistic soliloquy by Eazy E at the end of the song:
In reality –
A fool is one who believes that all women are ladies
A n!gga is one who believes that all ladies are b!tches,
And all b!tches are created equal.
To me – all b!tches are the same: money hungry, scanless groupy h0's that's always riding on a n!gga's d!ck.
Always in a n!gga's pocket, and when the n!gga runs out of money the b!tch is gone in the wind.
To me : ALL B!TCHES AIN'T SH!T!
Although that Jamaica Funk sample by Dre is the truth! OK, back on topic…
Phaaa. Yeah I thought it was the second one I was thinking about.
Sad thing is…….soon as you mentioned one less….All I could hear in my head is the hook. "one less, one less."
Das ish cranked 🙂 No wonder my generation is so messed up. 12 years old listening to that ish. 🙂
This is similar to my initial point, ,misogyny in rap is more an "Art Imitating Life" rather than a "Life Imitating Art" discussion and is bigger than the rap industry.
As my man Hov said "Scarface the movie did more than Scarface rapper to me"
Sad to say but, misogyny is here to stay. Stopping/reducing it and its effects is like trying to stop/reduce the usage of the word "n!gga" and that sh!t is NGH (not gonna happen). Aside from that, I don't think I have a real comment for this post. But I'm going to enjoy reading everyone's comments.
=) Happy Monday
This hits home for me.. The misogyny in rap has turned me off to a lot of popular music. I have too many women in my family to be so disrespectful.. If I even utter the word b*tch the wrong way, all my aunts and cousins will tie me down and have a Slapping Party.
Do you also not watch Larry King or David Letterman? "When Step in the Name of Love" comes on at a wedding do you sit down? Did you think they should impeach and then remove from office President Clinton? How bout Dr. MLK Jr. Do you purposely go to work on his birthday? Just tryna figure out how you've come to draw the Misogyny line at Rap Music…
Well I can't answer all 21 of your Questions there, 50 Cent, but I can say this.. I hear the word hoe and bitch in rap more than anything else.. Indeed the world is wrong.. Rap is a little more wrong, tho.
And who talked about a boycott? I can appreciate a song going off on women when I get burned.. but you have to admit (tho I'm certain you won't) that rap goes a bit too far..
I think my point is, everything goes to far. Our whole society is misogynistic. Why pick on rap. If you get offered a job you're not really qualified for, are you gonna say, "no thanks, I'm sure there were 5 or 10 qualified women you passed over for me… so, beceause you clearly hate women, I'm not gonna take this job". Or, when all these guys have their dating shows where they get to name these chicks whatever they wanna name them, do you say, "This is misogynist, I'm not watching". All I'm saying is, don't single out Hip-Hop because it easy… keep it consistent.
@ Most – Hip Hop isnt being singled out b/'c its easy. Its being singled out b/c the aggect that Hip Hop has on our communities. Hip hop has a much larger effect on black and latino communities than the reality television shows or the rock music or w/e. Hip hop is singled out b/c you see hip hop everywhere. What you see in the video (in terms of fashion, demeanor, "swag") you immediately see it in the streets. Hip Hop isnt any more mysogynist than anything else but the issue is the effect that it has
@Peyso, I agree, but my point is, it's hypocritical to say you're not gonna listen to Hip-Hop but then ignore all the other forms of misogyny that are out there. To conversely pararphase Malcolm:
"You can't hate the tree and not hate the roots"
@Most if its the tree branches that keep smackin u in the face everytime u walk by, u may cut down the limbs before u deal w/ the roots
@Please, I couldn't have said it better myself.. Let's totally be best friends..
@Most, That's like saying, "Why is Batman only fighting crime in Gotham City when there's a world of crime to fight?" I'm only one man.. and hip hop is a love of mine. It comes from something I'm proud to be. I want to see black people as a whole do better.. I feel like the mass negativity in rap music antagonizes that. Everything can be dope in moderation.. but don't u feel like it's a bit intoxicated now? Buncha dudes saw what worked for these dudes and they did the same thing.. and the cycle is endless..
Well, if you watched the Dark Knight you'd know that Batman has no jurisdiction. Which is why he was able to go into Hong Kong and bring that Chinese mob boss back to stand for trial…. :0)
@Eddie.. Dammit! I thought I had em with that one..
And Batman is in the Justice League, so he fights crime in Metropolis, Central City, even on other planets.
*end nerdout*
@Hugh Jazz i know i don't know you but i love you for that nerd moment…I <3 nerds! lol
Here's what I find funny about this topic, women sometimes confuse a man who will not yield way to them as being misogynist.
If any of the women who read SBM on a regular basis had to pick one of the writers who is the most misogynistic, i'm going to go ahead and fess up, that 95% of you will pick me. That's really funny to me. I look at this post and I think it goes without saying, but none of that stuff above applies to me at all.
Here's my issue with being labeled misogynistic, i'll give an example. I'll say, "I want to be the breadwinner in my home, I want to provide for my family. I don't need my wife to do anything but keep a nice home and help raise the children."
And i'll be accused of being misogynistic.
Now if I said, "I want to marry a woman who makes more money than me, I also want her to spend her time making more moey, rather than tending to the home and the children."
I'd be a dumb [negro]. You play to win, you play to the greatest you can be. However, if I ended up marrying a woman who made way more than I did, I would not be upset at all.
A step further, that just because I don't believe in the emancipation of Freaky, i'm a misogynist.
1) I don't think women should have slept with as many people as men have. Why? Because I think we should be working on keeping men from sleeping with as many people as they sleep with.
2) A woman will be a ho, while a man will be cheered, is real. That's the way it is, the way it's always been. The reason why I uphold this to be fact is because I would hate for some woman to get herself down the road and live on an island.
3) As it pertains to sexual relations, it does not make sense for women to be out here trying to seek equality with men for serious health reasons. There's several STDs that men can carry that they don't even have any side effects or complications from. There's not one STD that a man has that only affects him and not the woman. Blue balls does not count.
So when someone accuses people of being misogynist, sometimes it's not about all that, sometimes its about the following three things:
1) I refuse to yield to you as being smarter than me or being right, when i'm right. When i'm wrong, i'll admit to it. I'm just never wrong. Ask Most, it doesn't ever happen.
2) I'm not trying to say men can do whtever they want and woman can't. I'm saying, that some of the crap men shouldn't do themselves.
3) Strip clubs are totally different for men and women.
PS – If Nelly has misogynistic videos, i'd like for someone to explain, Janet Jackson's videos, Salt-n-Pepa's videos, Lil' Kim's videos and then please tell me what was going on in that Ladies Night video…. Don't worry, i'll wait.
You make many a strong point however I disagree w/ your last point about videos. The issue isnt that one video degrades women, its that its almost every video you see. Its not always the content, its the frequency
Somebody give this man a gold f*king star!! COSINE.. Frequency!! Does EVERY OTHER SONG have to tell my little sister she's a bitch just because she's a female?
Never wrong, huh? Well that's a totally different problem. I wouldn't call it misogynistic.
Anyway, I feel some of what your saying about equality.. This talks more about that..
http://remthemulatto.wordpress.com/2010/07/26/wha…
"3) As it pertains to sexual relations, it does not make sense for women to be out here trying to seek equality with men for serious health reasons. There’s several STDs that men can carry that they don’t even have any side effects or complications from. There’s not one STD that a man has that only affects him and not the woman. Blue balls does not count."
I don't think you're a misogynist, even though I don't always agree with you. However, I do think this is one of the silliest defences of the double standard regarding numbers for men vs. women.
I don't think that's necessarily a case of misogyny, that's just the way it is. Peyso made a good comparison before: if men have to pursue women while women sit back and accept the offers, then a man who has charmed several women is viewed as successful. A woman who accepts every offer is a heaux.
A master key that can open many locks is a good key. A lock that can be opened by many keys is a bad lock.
Hugh, that lock and key metaphor was impeccable. Going to go ahead and steal that for furture reference. I won't take credit for it though… I'll be sure and cite my source by always prefacing with "A wise person once said…"
Stay thirsty, my friend!
This is what we used to call "teach tape" in football. When teaching other people about analogies, I'm going to use this.
@Sane – I'm not offering any type of defense. Like I said, i'm not giving the case for why men can and women can't or men are and women aren't. I'm stating a fact, that as it pertains to health, women should be careful. Men should chill out too, but women should chill out too.
I actually think you're making the opposite case. Women show symptoms so we know when we're passing things around and to stop such activities. Men who get no signs could be passing it around all willy nilly. Thus men should be less freedom seeking as it's more hazardous to the health of themselves (they wouldn't know they have it so they wouldn't get treated) and the health of others.
3) As it pertains to sexual relations, it does not make sense for women to be out here trying to seek equality with men for serious health reasons. There’s several STDs that men can carry that they don’t even have any side effects or complications from. There’s not one STD that a man has that only affects him and not the woman. Blue balls does not count.
^^^This is true and here is one example: HPV. The number is growing in Women and it is hard to test in men…
Also, I'd like to point out for the record, that alot of the rappers who seem like the most misogynist men in the world are family men with wives and kids. They're entertainers. Hip-Hop, more than any other genre of music, attaches a certain value to percieved realism. If Snoop and Bun B wrote songs about loving their wives or long time girl friends and tryna make it work, and coaching their sons at football games – you holier than though negroes wouldn't buy it…
Ignorance mixed with a bad influence is a recipe for disaster. Let's not pretend the music is completely innocent.
And there you have it!
I'd absolutely buy it. but I'm at a point in my life where I'm beyond sh*t that isn't realistic to me, and where I see my life going. It would be refreshing and I welcome it. I'm not a fan of faking the funk for an "image", which is probably why even as a hip hop head, its not my fave genre of music….
Just like people don't like fake thugs, nobody likes a fake misogynist..
But we do like fake thugs, we just pretend we don't like them when talking about Hip-Hop because Hip-Hop has this perceived reality we're all expecting.
We love Al Pacino – even though he's been playing varing versions of Michael Corleone for 30 years, but, we still go see his movies. You expect too much out of Hip-Hop – it's just music and music – is just entertainment.
And this is coming from somone who loves music.
@ Most – movies operate on a different premise than music. Movies are make believe. No one believes that Denzel really was a crooked cop. rap operates on the premise that what rappers say are generally true. Furthermore, people dont watch movies in the same way that they listen to music.
The gist..
All forms of art are powerful. Especially music because it's a form of media at the same time. They can move people to do things like fight the power, commit suicide, fall in love, cry.. If I make a song saying alligators aint sh*t, the people who like my song are gonna be like, "Yeah!! F*K them alligators!!" Especially the followers.. There are a lot of people in the world who don't think for themselves. They let the media tell them what to do. If rap songs about f*king bishes and hose are what they listen to, chances are they want to f*k bishes and hose.. So who's responsible for them?
If I make it big, I'm going to empower and entertain my fans..
That's all I'm sayin..
@ Peyso
"Furthermore, people dont watch movies in the same way that they listen to music."
exactly. but I can't seem to convince my homeboy that the "entertaining" that Rick Ross does is not the same as Denzel. at all.
Reecie, you would buy it because you're not Holier than Though…
@Peyso, I agree, that's what RAP – specifically operates on. That's what I've been saying. Hip-Hop has the perceived realism. It's stupid though, and it's only in Hip-Hop.
"Well I shot a man in Reno, just to watch him Die" – Johnny Cash
Nobody carede whether Johnny Cash really shot a dude in Reno – it just sounds good.
If you wanna stop Misogyny, spend your time working to level the playing field. Rap, subsequently, will take care of itself.
All this talk about misogyny coming through hip-hop versus other venues can be summed up easily. If you obtain your worldview by what some rapper says, you're an idiot.
The number one disease in America is not obesity. It is stupidity. That being said, just b/c what we're arguing is indicative of idiots doesnt not diminish its worth to society. Especially when idiots make up such a large portion of society
Peyso: "just b/c what we’re arguing is indicative of idiots doesnt not diminish its worth to society. Especially when idiots make up such a large portion of society"
I agree 100%.
Ahh, misogyny and hip-hop, the age old debate. Personally, I'm not a purchaser of hip-hop. The last hip-hop album I purchased was Common's Be. However, I still listen to some rap, and most of it sucks.
Of course misogyny is deeper than hip-hop. But, no other genre of music, no other art form has more influence over young men and women as hip-hop. You are more likely to hear a boy in high school repeat misogynistic nonsense he heard from a rap song, than you are to hear him speak eloquently about the history of patriarchy that has led to misogyny in all aspects of life.
Gold star!
Great post!!!
I hate it when a man calls me b*tch out of no where to try and get my attention… oh you got my attention and all you'll get to see is my cute behind walk the other way.. Oh and "mami, ma, shawty, hey, mama, etc… " all get the same response…
Can I get a what what?
Also, I’d like to point out for the record, that alot of the rappers who seem like the most misogynist men in the world are family men with wives and kids.
________________________
Yeah it's funny cause Snoop Dog is probably the most beloved rapper accross the world but his first few albums was straight mysogyny. Dudes motto was "We don't love them hos." and "F*&K a B*t*h." Oh and NWA actually had a skit on one of their albums where they picked up a prostitute, threw her in a van and shot her. That crosses the line to mysogyny.
The gist..All forms of art are powerful. Especially music because it’s a form of media at the same time. They can move people to do things like fight the power, commit suicide, fall in love, cry.. If I make a song saying alligators aint sh*t, the people who like my song are gonna be like, “Yeah!! F*K them alligators!!” Especially the followers.. There are a lot of people in the world who don’t think for themselves. They let the media tell them what to do. If rap songs about f*king bishes and hose are what they listen to, chances are they want to f*k bishes and hose.. So who’s responsible for them?If I make it big, I’m going to empower and entertain my fans.. That’s all I’m sayin..
I don't really have many thoughts on this. I still listen to mysogynistic music because I'm smart enough to separate it from my reality. I understand that some music may cause some stupid person somewhere to be a misogynist. I no more blame the music (or any other form of art) for that than I do when they blame a school shooting on some artist. So, I don't feel I should avoid listening to Eminem because someone feels the need to emulate him based on his music. *shrugs* Besides, if I can still watch General Hospital (the most misogynistic show on television, I'm sure), then I have no problem hearing the word b*tch on a song. They aren't talking about me.
I think there are a large number of reasons behing misogyny being so widespread (including hip hop), but I feel like hip hop is only the surface problem. It's the underlying family/societal reasons that are the real issue.
"Besides, if I can still watch General Hospital (the most misogynistic show on television, I’m sure), then I have no problem hearing the word b*tch on a song. They aren’t talking about me."
Ditto.
I will continue to use the words b*tch and ho on a regular basis as I deem fit. That also applies to any form of the word N*gga. Jay was right, I like ignorant sh*t, why act otherwise. I don't think I'm Marcus Garvey, I think I'm Big Meech (the real Big Meech).
We can all attempt to be better people and correct our speech, but will that stop certain women from being triflin' ass b*tches and scandulous hos? Or stop certain dudes from being b*tch ass n*ggas, trick ass marks or mark ass trick ass n*ggas. And what then….if we all stop using these words, how we will describe said prevailing behavior?
Shallow and ignorant…I know. But I've accepted it. You should too.
I agree with you. What other combination of words would best describe scandalous hoes and bitch ass niggas?
But at the same notion, what we speak and constantly hear is what we will become. So although I understand artists who use these words to describe experiences, hearing such lyrics/words does indeed perpetuate such behavior.
I'm not saying if we stop using these words, such "prevailing behaviors" will cease to prevail; more so that what we accept to listen to is what we accept to cultivate, and by continuing to listen to such trash the unconscious is easily manipulated.
Maybe we should accept it, though–the consistent use of these words and degradation of woman? As long as you’re conscious of it, right?
degradation of woman?
________________________
In a free society can a woman be degraded by another person. Or does she have to degrade herself?
both
But at the same notion, what we speak and constantly hear is what we will become. So although I understand artists who use these words to describe experiences, hearing such lyrics/words does indeed perpetuate such behavior.
I thing there's a discontinuity along that cycle. It's choice. When Tupac died, I tell you, I was not tempted in any way to fight/shoot/kill/yell at any guy from the east coast for that reason. When Plies started talking about "Bust-it-babies" I wasn't inclined to see what he was talking about nor call a woman one. Who are we talking about here? Guys who hate women or the males who follow the guys who hate women?
I had a girlfriend in college that once a semester, we sat in each other classes. This one class was a woman's study class and they (of course) talked about this singular topic. The end they talked about was the positive spin some female rappers do with the word b*tch. Turning something that was initially meant to demean into something of power.
I call some women females. It's not misogyny. It's me trying to not calling you a curse word due to some dumb/malicious/ignorant stuff you just did. To a lot of women I know, calling them "little girl" or "emotional" or "dumb" is a lot more offensive. Just saying…
What about the line of females (oops, I did it again…) that participated in Plies "Bus-it-baby" competition? I was sick…
The real question is: What is the source of this misogyny? You better not say rap/hip-hop. It's ignorance of the older generations seeping through the cracks. The Bible is misogynistic is various ways, but that's cool as beans. Just get a robe and say in a church, "The Bible says…" and people will clap their hands and perform internal self-punishment since their lives don't match up with that ideal. Then people will join (and get others to join). Some men and some women. The women will willfully subject themselves of second-class treatment. Leveraging one's faith against their civil/human rights is powerful.
Honestly, I think women hate women more than men hate women. Example, remember always when the topic of chivalry comes up, people talk about the woman's role in the household. That role being, a level under her husband and she heed all his words. Then someone quotes the Bible, then random Blog stalkers come out of nowhere to cosign and ish. WTF is that? We all forget the origin of "chivalry," both the location and the context: The notion that women should be treated as children (read: misogyny). But then, that same treatment is wanted by women. IN FACT, that's how a woman would gauge you as a man, i.e. how close you resemble her father physical form/temperament/actions. whaaaaaaaaa?!?! Am I the only one who sees this connect?
So I must be misogynistic to get a woman? Just to her and no other woman, I guess to make her feel special. My question is though: Why are misogynistic acts DESIRED by most women??!?! The Ol' Skool maybe isn't what you want. But saying: "I'm kinda ol' skool" makes women think of maybe their fathers, but not about the underlying reasons for such thought in society. B/c misogyny is a state of mind right? I can do anything and still be misogynistic.
But wait, call a woman your equal and really treat her that way, then you're not that good of a man. FYI, treating a person as a equal doesn't mean you don't do things for them, it mostly means there's no entitlement due to your gender. Depending on the situation, you may be entitled to certain treatment due to your ACTIONS, PERSONALITY, TREATMENT OF OTHERS. Isn't that the way it's supposed to be? Maybe that's just @my_level
Meteor Man: "We all forget the origin of “chivalry,” both the location and the context: The notion that women should be treated as children (read: misogyny). But then, that same treatment is wanted by women…My question is though: Why are misogynistic acts DESIRED by most women??!?!"
Maybe because most women don't want you to treat them the same way you treat your boys. That is, if by children, you mean handled more carefully emotionally than you'd treat a man.
This raises an interesting question though; is placing a woman on a pedestal and chivalrous acts truly misogynistic? After all, if I and one of my boys have an argument, I ain't bringing that n!gga no flowers to make up. Is misogyny simply treating women differently, even if that treatment is a higher level of respect than you'd give the average man?
No, by children, I meant as if she is unable to do for her own. As in, not being strong enough for normal life. I doubt if the beginnings of "chivalry" were saying, "Let's be nice to women" even if the acts themselves were considered nice by individual women. Once again, I can do anything and hate women.
I don't know bra… I don't respect my homie less just cause I'm not giving him flowers or not giving a of peace offering. There's a line b/t what you do and the impression it gives. That's why offering to pay for dinner can yield both positive and negative reactions. And we all know that there are two sides on an impression. What do you mean by "average man?" You mean a random guy on the street or your friend that's been by your side all these years? Honestly, I've never thought: "I respect A less than B but more than C." Either, I respect you or don't. Now, the treatment might be better based upon various factors depending on my impression and relationship with you.
MeteorMan: "I doubt if the beginnings of “chivalry” were saying, “Let’s be nice to women” even if the acts themselves were considered nice by individual women."
Actually, it was, at least in Biblical terms. Although there was certainly quite a bit of repressing that went along with that “be(ing) nice”.
“I don’t respect my homie less just cause I’m not giving him flowers or not giving a of peace offering. There’s a line b/t what you do and the impression it gives.”
I guess that’s what I mean. Men used to take off their hat when a lady came in their presence. It was a sign of respect. It’s not respecting your homie less, more than it is treating women with special respect. And that’s a question worth pondering: is that special treatment actually degrading, although it was meant to be a sign of respect?
"What do you mean by “average man?” You mean a random guy on the street or your friend that’s been by your side all these years?"
Random guy on the streets.
"Honestly, I’ve never thought: “I respect A less than B but more than C.” Either, I respect you or don’t. Now, the treatment might be better based upon various factors depending on my impression and relationship with you."
We're agreed there. I treat everyone with a base level of respect. Some individuals have done things to garner more respect or lose the base level of respect I gave them. But that’s just me. Again, my question is I treat a random woman on the streets with a different kind of respect than the random man. Could that be misogynistc? Maybe that lady doesn't want that extra respect and she feels I'm disrepecting her by giving it to her.
I love B*tches !!!!