You believe she put every single one of their last names together to make her son's last name!
SBM: I just don’t get it.
The Baby’s Mother: What is there to get?
SBM: When was the last time he even say little Jay-Quan?
The BM: When did Jay drop the Black Album?
SBM: You know that’s crazy! The n*#$@ slums as a father.
The BM: What is your point?
SBM: Why does he have his last name? What happens if you get married? Why should his name live on even though he puts no effort in raising his son?
The BM: You asking a lot of questions right now. I invited you over to invest in these guts, not analyze my son’s last name.
SBM: I mean … Ima put it on you … but Imjusayin
Yes … that is based on a real conversation.
I don’t pretend to understand the mind of a baby’s mama. The complexities of keeping a relationship with someone you have a child with, but aren’t married to or dating might be beyond my understanding. Many women find themselves in this weird situation of loving a man who doesn’t love them, yet they are forever linked to this person through the child they conceived. It’s complicated and difficult, but it is what it is.
But there is one thing I often wonder. One facet of the baby mama & baby daddy dynamic that I haven’t been able to figure out. If you couldn’t tell already …
Why do women with no-good baby daddys give their child their father’s last name?
***disclaimer*** I am only talking about the dad’s out there who don’t raise there kids and are “no-good” ******
This might sound like a stupid question, but it’s not. If your child doesn’t know their father, why does he have his name? If this guy can’t take care of his own kid, why should his name live on? Why does someone who contributes nothing to raising the child deserve to leave his mark on them?
She hopes to eventually marry him
It’s so sad. Ever met that woman who just keeps hope alive. The BD has a new girlfriend, bought a house with this new chic, and hasn’t sent his kid a birthday present in 6 years. But in the back of her mind she is convinced he is going to just wake up one day and think “I need to take care of my daughter and make an honest woman out of her mama”. If this is you, or someone you know … smack the sh*t out of said person.
It’s Baby Mama tradition
Baby’s mamas have some sort of code. Random nonsense that they pass on to the next one of their friends. A ghetto tradition of sorts. Second on the list is “your child shall hold the name of his/her daddy. If you don’t know the daddy, just assume the richer out of group of possible daddys”. Apparently the first one is “the baby’s dad will always be granted the p*ssy upon request”.
It costs money to go to court
Shut this sh*t up. This is too big of a problem to let the $200 court fee stop you.
I hope to one day be a father. Not just a dad, a sperm donor, or the dreaded “BD”, but I’m trying to be a modern day Huxtable. My son (I refuse to have daughters) will carry on my name. It’s like putting a signature on my greatest work of art. It’s being able to claim something that I personally molded and worked on. My name will be my gift to him.
So when I meet these chics with these sorry ass reggins who point at their child and say “that’s my boy” during the one time a year they see them … I want to smack them.
It is a big deal. It makes you look stupid. Fix it!
SBM aka Future “World’s Best Dad” aka “One more reason I don’t date women with kids (yeah … I said it)!”
The closest person to me to ever have to deal with this issue was my little sister.
Even though I tease her incessantly about being a hoodrat (and a snowflake on top of it!),
she made the right choice.
Her baby is Ashley Lane, and damn, am I glad for it. That child's daddy is a loser if I ever have seen one. I'd rather have my niece try to live up to anything other than his name.
I completely agree with this. Although I'm not a mother or a baby mother, I still don't think it makes any sense to give your child their father's last name if he isn't present. He doesn't deserve that gift. My mom was married to my dad when I was born, and once he acted up, she changed my name back to her's, which is why I have two birth certificates. I'm so glad she did that.
your mum brain wash you to dislike your dad spoke bad about him throughout the years cus he didnt abide by her rules 99% black woman matto is its either my way or the highway they dont believe in compromising
I don't have any kids and im trying my damnedest to keep it that way until i have two rings on it (no shotgun weddings for me). But if i had a kid with someone who wasn't my husband i doubt i'd give my child their father's name. Especially if the dude is a deadbeat. That's just senseless.
And not knowing who your baby daddy is? For real tho? You should at least let one visit from "aunt flo" happen before you hop on the next available peen, in my opinion. But them chicks on Maury crack me up with that whole testing 13 guys. All i can say is i wish i had their kind of free time. Where do you even find the time to sleep with that many people in a 1-2 month window? smh
You'd be surprised how much free time you free up by not having a job <del>and sex takes like 7 minutes, right?</del>.
:-p
Well sometimes some moms do it some there's a connection between the kid and the absent father. One complication is when it goes to official stuff you always have to prove your kid is yours. Opposite problem is when mother thinks the kid having an identity is some kind of gift to the father??? It's something for the kid to know who he is. So if you keep kid away from his dad, you only hurting the child in the long run.'unless dad is a real deadbeat than anything goes.
Dated women with kids before. One had two, a boy and a girl. Girl wasn't having any of it but the boy was crying out for a father figure. The other one had a boy. Not my place to say but we disagreed about how to raise children and I guess that makes it clear we shouldn't be dating anyway. It's not my busines but if you doing a bad job why have I got to stick around and watch?
Good post!
I don't get that either…you are not married to this man but you are not going to give this child YOUR last name MOM? I guess, it's some form of making an attempt to hold on to these Men…or, denial, maybe it's immaturity…I don't really know…it makes absolutely no sense to me…I can't call it.
I haven't commented in a while, but this post really resonated with me ( not the term "baby mama" I would never refer to anyone in that way. I find it disrespectful because of the negative connotations associated with the term).
My father was not very happy about being a father when I was born and, as a result, I have my mother's last name. I am very happy that she did that. Although my father and I have a good relationship now, he did not contribute as much to my upbringing as my mother did, so I do not believe that his name should live on through me. Ironically, my father does not have any other children, so it is a sensitive topic for him because he has been trying to get me to change my last name since high school. However, I never would. When I was graduating from college, he asked me to use his last name on my degree and I told him absolutely not. When I was graduating from law school, he asked what name I would be using for my degree, and I told him I would be using my own name. I could tell he was hurt, but I don't care about his feelings regarding that. Nonetheless, I care about my father, but I would never attach his name to any of my accomplishments because he did not make me who I am today. It's always funny when he throws any graduation party for me, he will tell people my first name with his last name and I let it slide for those times, but I would never use his last name on anything official. My first name is Yoruba, so I figure that is a good enough of a connection to my father's culture. People always find it odd that I have a Yoruba first name and a Scandinavian last name, and I love my name. It really speaks to me and the blended cultures that make me who I am.
I never understand when a woman gives her child the last name of a deadbeat. That, to me, is foolish, why would you want to create even more of a connection with someone who does not care about you or your child? I can only speculate that, deep down, when I woman has a child with a man, no matter how despicable he is, she is hoping that they will somehow be together and raise their child together. Or maybe a hope that he will be a better father if he has a connection with his child through his name because there is no emotional connection. I can't judge anyone for that, but I can imagine that is a difficult and painful position to be in.
Well the last name is given at birth, and everything I've read spoke about moments after birth. Now if the guy is CLEARLY not going to be there before you even give birth I can understand that argument…….but if you're procreating with a man who will be out of your life 9 months later, your child's last name is the least of your worries. Make better decisions ladies and have a better screening process for the prospective father of your children.
There are ALREADY countless baby mamas running around serving as cautionary tales, why not take heed to the warnings?
Good point, Rick. Ill add my comment here.
As Rick stated, you don't ALWAYS know the dude is going to be a bad father before the birth of the child. Even the worst father can sometimes manage to stick around for those 9 months of pregnancy.
To SBM's point, if he aint sh*t from jump street – which I wonder why you're having s*x with him but whatever – then I def agree the last name shouldn't be a given. If there's a hesitation about legacy and all that other made up BS, then as some folks have pointed out, you can change the kid's last name (and yours) when/if yall get married.
Follow-up question: What if he is a good father but he doesn't want to be with the baby mother, should the name be withheld then too? Or is this only a "punishment" for bad fathers?
Thank you, I was waiting for this Rick! Give a man a chance to be a deadbeat!
I really think it's mostly tradition…I mean traditionally, women get married and takes the man's name, the children born of that marriage have the man's last name. That's just he way it's been for a long time. Granted we've veered off course as late and marriage then children is certainly no longer the norm, but we've got a lot of years of the marriage then babies mentality to overcome before people just automatically name their child after themselves.
Not to discount hope…hope is a helluva drug. SBMs 1st point is not to be underestimated.
I agree with this! Sometimes, I think women do it out of tradition/that's the way it has always been done. Although my father is not a deadbeat, I am a bastard (I always laugh when people use this antiquated term). I asked my mother why she gave me my father's last name and she just said that is how it is done.
When/If I have a child, my son/daughter will have MY last name whether I'm married or not.
My sister had her son but was not married to her Baby's Daddy and gave my nephew her last name. Her Baby Daddy was not necessarily a dead beat, but my sister was of the mind that MY CHILD will have MY LAST NAME. If her Baby Daddy wanted their son to have his last name, they would have to have the same one (for anyone not following, they needed to get married). So my nephew had one last name for a few years of his life and when my sister and her husband got married they paid the money to get it changed. The interesting fact I learned later is that her husband actually has his mother's last name.
If anyone watched the show "All of Us" the ex-wife kept her married name because she did not want to have a different name than her son. She wanted her name to easily identify her as the mother of her son.
My question would be to men that are not deadbeats and not married to their baby mama, would you have a problem if your child did not have your last name?
Wait, so are you planning to change your last name if you're getting married? Or are you saying your future husband is SOL if he thinks his last name is going to be passed along to any of HIS children?
I think folks should do what they want. I don't really question someone giving their child the last name of his/her father regardless of the status. Well perhaps if you're not sure who the father is, it doesn't seem fair to just pick a name randomly from among a host of potential fathers.
With that said, I think we should start a movement focusing on these dang first names. I have seen some of the most (dare I say it…) ignorant ass names in life. I don't care if your kid's last name is Johnson, Jackson, Brown, Smith, or Thomas BUT if their first name is Ty'Wanese, Cwrenity, Smirnoff, Organgello, Quanisha, Sinfony then I'm shaking my head all day. Again it's their choice, but I'd like to establish the Advisory Committee Against Foolish Names.
I did not mean that my future husband is SOL. My point was if I am married that me and my child will have my husband's last name. However, if it just so happened that I am not married, I plan to give my child my last name.
****I also concur with the first name comments. It is getting outrageous.***
1) Just because you don’t marry the baby’s father doesn’t mean the child shouldn’t have his last name and any women saying "Well if he wants his child to have his last name I should have it to" should have thought about that before getting knocked-up.
The only reason I can see keeping the child’s last name as his/her sorry daddy is money, If he dies while my child is 18 or under my child will get his social security. My cousin’s father died when he was very young like 2. He was’nt the greatest father (even though his family did their part) but when my aunt had him the hospital put his last name (idk how he didn’t sign the birth certificate) but when it was time for his estate to be given out (social security) the state didn’t give my little cousin anything because he hadn’t signed the birth certificate and my cousin didn’t have his father’s last name
Plus it can always be changed once they are 18 .
"…but when my aunt had him the hospital put his last name (idk how he didn’t sign the birth certificate) but when it was time for his estate to be given out (social security) the state didn’t give my little cousin anything because he hadn’t signed the birth certificate and my cousin didn’t have his father’s last name."
Your cousin didn't get anything because the father did not sign the birth certificate. That is a legally binding document. Someone should do some hood classes on what legally links a child and father. If the parents got married three seconds before the baby was born, the woman's husband gets 'assumed paternity'–one of the damn near 1400 rights and benefits that come with marriage. But beyond that, if the dude didn't sign the birth certificate, last name be damned, it's not his child–legally.
"Your cousin didn’t get anything because the father did not sign the birth certificate. That is a legally binding document. Someone should do some hood classes on what legally links a child and father"
First of all I know a birth certificate links a child to the father but a last name does the same thing and the question was asked to her by a lawyer, why didn’t he have the last name. So cut the entire hood classes bullshit I was just giving an example and everyone who has a baby out of wedlock is not a hood rat or lives in the hood. Ims aying when you fighting dfor certain things for your child sometimes your child having the fathers last name can help cause the first thing ppl ask when fighting for certain things is well if it's such and such baby why dont they have the same last name.
Dang Smilez…you mad?!? I didn't see it as being that personal. But also – she's right, last names don't carry nearly as much weight as actually signing the birth certificate. A good friend of mine was told he'd be a father shortly after he deployed to Iraq. He was still overseas when the child was born, but the mom gave the baby his last name. He got back, some stuff didn't add up, he got the kid checked…it wasn't his. He has NO responsibility for that child, he has the paternity test proving that the kid is not his but more importantly, he did not sign the birth certificate. He tried to reason with the mom a little bit on changing her kid's name because that will be hard to explain to the kid later.
Wow. Really? I don't make this up. The rub, however, is that a lot of hospitals are allowing women to add whatever name they want. It's getting a little bit harder now though since things are computerized. Just like I would caution anyone to ask for a lawyer before saying anything to cops, I tell all men to wait before signing a birth certificate cus if the child ends up not being yours, you're still legally/financially responsible for said child.
How Is Paternity Established?
If you'd like to formally establish paternity, ask the father of your child to voluntarily acknowledge paternity. If he agrees to this, he agrees to accept responsibility for the child and pay child support.
The birth father can voluntarily acknowledge paternity in two ways:
–He can be present at the birth of your child and sign a Declaration of Paternity or Acknowledgment of Paternity. This paper is also necessary in order to have the father's name placed on the child's birth certificate, if you choose to do so
–If he isn't present at the birth, he can complete an affidavit of paternity any time between the birth of the child until the child turns 18. If this affidavit isn't completed before the birth certificate is issued, and you want the father's name listed on the birth certificate, you can apply to have the birth certificate changed to add the father's name at a later date.
(http://family-law.lawyers.com/paternity/Whos-Your-Daddy-Proving-Paternity.html)
Second as or the classes, people also need to understand that even living together means NOTHING. Most states don't recognize common law marriages. So when people think that living together and having a baby proves paternity when there has been no legal marriage doesn't automatically make the man responsible if he doesn't sign the birth certificate. (http://www.ncsl.org/default.aspx?tabid=4265)
If the mother dies and the father is NOT on the birth certificate, he has no rights to that child. Contrary to what we see on Maury, courts aren't forcing too many people to get paternity tests OR admitting external paternity tests into evidence.
Those are just three of the things people need to understand. A simple google search will correct a lot of the rumors people are building their lives on.
I'm re-posting this without the links. I think the links are causing me to be in moderation. If anyone wants the links, you can find the sources by taking a sentence from each and googling it.
Wow. Really? I don’t make this up. The rub, however, is that a lot of hospitals are allowing women to add whatever name they want. It’s getting a little bit harder now though since things are computerized. Just like I would caution anyone to ask for a lawyer before saying anything to cops, I tell all men to wait before signing a birth certificate cus if the child ends up not being yours, you’re still legally/financially responsible for said child.
How Is Paternity Established?
If you’d like to formally establish paternity, ask the father of your child to voluntarily acknowledge paternity. If he agrees to this, he agrees to accept responsibility for the child and pay child support.
The birth father can voluntarily acknowledge paternity in two ways:
–He can be present at the birth of your child and sign a Declaration of Paternity or Acknowledgment of Paternity. This paper is also necessary in order to have the father’s name placed on the child’s birth certificate, if you choose to do so
–If he isn’t present at the birth, he can complete an affidavit of paternity any time between the birth of the child until the child turns 18. If this affidavit isn’t completed before the birth certificate is issued, and you want the father’s name listed on the birth certificate, you can apply to have the birth certificate changed to add the father’s name at a later date.
Second as or the classes, people also need to understand that even living together means NOTHING. Most states don’t recognize common law marriages. So when people think that living together and having a baby proves paternity when there has been no legal marriage doesn’t automatically make the man responsible if he doesn’t sign the birth certificate.
If the mother dies and the father is NOT on the birth certificate, he has no rights to that child. Contrary to what we see on Maury, courts aren’t forcing too many people to get paternity tests OR admitting external paternity tests into evidence.
Those are just three of the things people need to understand. A simple google search will correct a lot of the rumors people are building their lives on.
Also, what happens when the alleged father has a common name like 'Johnson'?
Thank you Ms. Smart for clearing up the estate situation. Last names do not play a part of estate, custody or other similar matters.
Addressing this comment:
"1) Just because you don’t marry the baby’s father doesn’t mean the child shouldn’t have his last name and any women saying “Well if he wants his child to have his last name I should have it to” should have thought about that before getting knocked-up."
1. It may not be about the MAN at all in this situation. If I am a mom raising my child, there is nothing wrong with me wanting my child to have my last name. It is ideal to be married so that everyone has the same last name. However, if that is not the situation there is nothing wrong with a woman giving HER child HER last name.
2, TWO PEOPLE make a child, if he wanted his child to have his last name…HE should thought about it too! These are the problems MEN & WOMEN run the risk of having when they knock someone up or get knocked up.
I know it does'nt play a whole part in getting the estate and the situation happened 23 yrs ago. And the lawyer asked her why dont they share the same last name. I just think it helps the situation.
OK so the father chooses not to sign the birth certificate.
He dies. I sue for part of the estate. Isn't the judge gonna look at all the evidence and witnesses to determine how to allocate the estate.
You really sayin I can't challenge the birth certificate. Or that the judge will dismiss my claim out right just based on the birth certificate?
@ Grand….in that case the judge should order a paternity test. That's all the evidence needed.
Teflon…….I think I'm lookin at this from a whole different perpective than yall. I actually went throught some probate stuff not too long ago. A family member died without a will. Born in about 1920 something. There were like 20 people with claims on the estate. Cousins I never even met. Anyway…..everyone had to prove their relation. Of course a birth certificate is the easiest way but I'm pretty sure, and I will have to check the paperwork to be certain, but I'm pretty sure you could provide other evidence of your relation. I mean just 50 years ago you might be born in your mother's house in rural Georgia with no birth certificate at all. So I'm just not buyin that the birt certificate ends a probate case.
So I'm not talkin child support. I talkin probate. And I just think having had the last name your entire life and being acknowledged by the family with the same last name would help make your case as opposed to showing up with a different last name and nobody knows you.
"there is nothing wrong with a woman giving HER child HER last name"
this is the problem right here! a child doesn't belong to one person or the other. Maybe BM's get treated poorly because they have faulty logic. "You a deadbeat beacuse you don't contribute to MY child with MY last name" cant they understand why a man might say eff you?? If it is YOUR child with YOUR name then YOU support it by YOUR d*mn SELF!
I have a few friends with kids by deadbeats, and they all give the kids the father's last name. Part of this is just a hoodrat habit. Part of it is so that it will be "easier" to get child support (may have been true in the past, not true now). But what REALLY kills me about this is that it puts all a woman's bad decisions on display. I used to work in the school system. How dumb do you look with 3 kids in elementary school and they all have different last names? Do you know how hard it is for teachers to track down family connections when you do that? Dam!
The more legitimate reason I've heard for giving the child the father's last name is that even if he's a deadbeat often times his family isn't and they want the kid to have a connection with them.
I debated for about 20 seconds whether I would take my husband's last name because I really like my maiden name and I can make the pi sign for my initials. But I didn't want to be the only one in my house with a different last name, cuz for sure our children would carry his last name. So now everybody in the house has the same name.
<blockquote cite="comment-314991">
ndladylawyer:
I agree with this!Sometimes, I think women do it out of tradition/that’s the way it has always been done.Although my father is not a deadbeat, I am a bastard (I always laugh when people use this antiquated term).I asked my mother why she gave me my father’s last name and she just said that is how it is done.
When/If I have a child, my son/daughter will have MY last name whether I’m married or not.
My sister had her son but was not married to her Baby’s Daddy and gave my nephew her last name.Her Baby Daddy was not necessarily a dead beat, but my sister was of the mind that MY CHILD will have MY LAST NAME.If her Baby Daddy wanted their son to have his last name, they would have to have the same one (for anyone not following, they needed to get married).So my nephew had one last name for a few years of his life and when my sister and her husband got married they paid the money to get it changed.The interesting fact I learned later is that her husband actually has his mother’s last name.
If anyone watched the show “All of Us” the ex-wife kept her married name because she did not want to have a different name than her son.She wanted her name to easily identify her as the mother of her son.
My question would be to men that are not deadbeats and not married to their baby mama, would you have a problem if your child did not have your last name?
<blockquote cite="comment-314991">
ndladylawyer:
I agree with this!Sometimes, I think women do it out of tradition/that’s the way it has always been done.Although my father is not a deadbeat, I am a bastard (I always laugh when people use this antiquated term).I asked my mother why she gave me my father’s last name and she just said that is how it is done.
When/If I have a child, my son/daughter will have MY last name whether I’m married or not.
My sister had her son but was not married to her Baby’s Daddy and gave my nephew her last name.Her Baby Daddy was not necessarily a dead beat, but my sister was of the mind that MY CHILD will have MY LAST NAME.If her Baby Daddy wanted their son to have his last name, they would have to have the same one (for anyone not following, they needed to get married).So my nephew had one last name for a few years of his life and when my sister and her husband got married they paid the money to get it changed.The interesting fact I learned later is that her husband actually has his mother’s last name.
If anyone watched the show “All of Us” the ex-wife kept her married name because she did not want to have a different name than her son.She wanted her name to easily identify her as the mother of her son.
My question would be to men that are not deadbeats and not married to their baby mama, would you have a problem if your child did not have your last name?
<blockquote cite="comment-314991">
ndladylawyer:
I agree with this!Sometimes, I think women do it out of tradition/that’s the way it has always been done.Although my father is not a deadbeat, I am a bastard (I always laugh when people use this antiquated term).I asked my mother why she gave me my father’s last name and she just said that is how it is done.
When/If I have a child, my son/daughter will have MY last name whether I’m married or not.
My sister had her son but was not married to her Baby’s Daddy and gave my nephew her last name.Her Baby Daddy was not necessarily a dead beat, but my sister was of the mind that MY CHILD will have MY LAST NAME.If her Baby Daddy wanted their son to have his last name, they would have to have the same one (for anyone not following, they needed to get married).So my nephew had one last name for a few years of his life and when my sister and her husband got married they paid the money to get it changed.The interesting fact I learned later is that her husband actually has his mother’s last name.
If anyone watched the show “All of Us” the ex-wife kept her married name because she did not want to have a different name than her son.She wanted her name to easily identify her as the mother of her son.
My question would be to men that are not deadbeats and not married to their baby mama, would you have a problem if your child did not have your last name?
Is that a serious question?
"I debated for about 20 seconds whether I would take my husband’s last name because I really like my maiden name and I can make the pi sign for my initials. But I didn’t want to be the only one in my house with a different last name, cuz for sure our children would carry his last name. So now everybody in the house has the same name."
You could have hyphenated your name with his last name, no??? Lots of women do that now.
Call me old fashioned, hyphenating just didn't resonate with me. We are the P****ys now. Plus I'm lazy and I didn't want to have more to write. A lot of people still refer to me by my maiden name and that's ok, but legally it's different. Plus when I took his last name his whole family was like Welcome aboard! lol.
I have mixed feeling about this. My children have their fathers last name and when they were born I was married to their father. Right now, their father is trying to be a more active role in their lives…but while we were going through the separation and divorce process, which took almost 2 years, he really wasn't in their lives at all. I didnt change their last name because he decided to not be involved in their lives at that time. Whether he decides to be a father is not wont make me want to change their last name. Half of their DNA will always be his and his side of the family is very much a part of their lives. I think there are woman who give the child their last name or change the child's last name to theirs out of anger and vindication toward the father.
What Smilez said is a big reason for giving the child the same name. Legal ish.
We have DNA tests now. But remember DNA testing is new. LOL I guess some of yall may be too young to remember the world without DNA tests.
But basically the last name was the way you identified who the baby's father was. Or guess more accurately….who you thought the baby's father was and who you planned to hold accountable or sue for assets. Or like Smilez said….it was your way of staking your claim to your child's inheritance.
So that's where the tradition comes from. But now you got DNA tests.
This is a good question I've never thought about before. It actually makes sense to me. It's a good way to embarass the father for real. He now has to explain to people why his child doesn't have his name. But then you could also argue that you are using the childs name as weapon in your beef wit the baby's father. I wonder how this makes the child feel…to not have their father's name?
Thank you @ il Duce the Grand Nagus…..Commentary So Dangerous it Must Be Deleted
when DNA test first came out they were not cheap they still are not cheap. Some ppl dont always have those funds available right away. Trust they tried to get the DNA from the fathers mother to prove the relationship to the state (not the family) , but the court denied it even with the grandmothers testifying.
I feel you on this, but technology has changed a lot in the baby mama/daddy game. It used to be that if a woman told you "hey this kid is yours" you had to go on it unless the kid had features so different from yours it was clear that there was a different dad. Momma's baby, Daddy's maybe and such. But now..you can get a DNA test kit at CVS. That's why men these days have no excuse to run around talking about how they don't *think* the kid is theirs. Do the test and find out for sure.
Also, I'm hearing that it's becoming more difficult for moms to put any old name on the birth certificate these days. That unless the father is there to sign the birth certificate and give the child his name the mother's name automatically goes on it. That's actually the way I think it should be.
I agree @Teflon Temptress
My example was from 23 yrs ago so times were a little different. I know runnning up to the court going hey they have the same last name thats the daddy wont get you a check but Im saying in some of the more difficult cases atleast back then the ? why dont they have the same last name came up (The hospital actually messed it up they put her last name instead of his). The father also passed away in this case and dna from the grandmother was going to be given but thecourt denied it, and lawyers and dna test are expersive some ppl dont have the money to drag the case out. I just thought that having the same last name as your father can at leats help the situation a little it wont harm it .
Also if you hate the father of your child (and their family) so much that you dont even wont your child to have their last name , maybe you should'nt have gotten pregnanat by them. I metioned family because sometimes the lack of the fathers being there is made up by his family (grandma's , grandpa's aunties) and in that case I dont see a problem with the child having the fathers last name.
I can't wrap my mind around the normalized dysfunction that is this whole baby-daddy/momma thing. Maybe these women want to pay back the men for not wanting them by giving the baby the last name as a reminder to the world of which clan he belongs to. If the men aren't signing the birth certificates, therefore, legally claiming the child, the mother can give said child whatever name and it really won't matter in a court of law. The judge isn't looking at the child's last name. She's looking at the birth certificate and the fact that the man never claimed the child in any legal form.
Eh, for me, this boils down to the deadbeats having shown deadbeat signs before the kids were born. The mothers having shown poor decision making skills by laying with a deadbeat dude. So why would we expect the mother to make any logical decisions when child naming comes?
Nah you right…I'm not a lawyer…but I'm thinkin if the father didn't sign the birth certificate…and he doesn't have the fathers last name….tryin to sue for any part of his estate when he dies is gonna be pretty hard to do. I'm assuming their are other ways to prove paternity if you have the resources. Maybe one of the lawyers can chime in.
But again…I was really just speaking about where the tradition came from. I'm assuming that birth certificates weren't always issued or given the imporatance they are now going back just a few hundred years.
<blockquote cite="comment-314997">
Ms. Smart:
The mothers having shown poor decision making skills by laying with a deadbeat dude.So why would we expect the mother to make any logical decisions when child naming comes?
#Ether
Not ether at all. I said the same thing about dudes who sleep with women, turn around and call her crazy or say she's a bad mother. If these men had shown some decent decision making skills, then they wouldn't be forever linked to this crazy bad mother. BOTH parties are to blame–except in the case of rape.
1) I think I learned from past experieces on this here site, that you can't really say nothing to a woman about what she doing with her kids.
2) This another topic that men probably need to stay away from.
3) Women always want to change traditions and societal roles and ish.
4) People shouldn't be making decisions for their kid and ish before that kid have an opportunity to have a say. If you don't give your child their father's name they may grow up and never be able to find out who they father is. And I know some people will say that the mother can tell the kid at the right time, but the same can be said for changing the name once you break it all the way down to the kid at a later date. Other thing people ain't considering is that kid gonna have to grow up answering questions or people thinking things about him. They know his mother ain't married and he got the same last name as her, they gonna know right away that he's a kid out of wedlock. It's easier for a kid to say, "My parents not together anymore." Over, "My mother decided to give me her last name since my father wasn't around." Kids not that brilliant at a young age.
5) Leave sh*t alone.
"1) I think I learned from past experieces on this here site, that you can’t really say nothing to a woman about what she doing with her kids."
Yes you can. they just don't listen. I think these are great discussions to have–especially with someone you're dating. A lot of people don't talk about this stuff until it's way too late.
"2) This another topic that men probably need to stay away from."
Men should voice their opinions and not continue to take a passive role. In addition to having discussions, you can make the conscious decision to not have babies out of wedlock so you avoid all of this extra stress.
"3) Women always want to change traditions and societal roles and ish."
Young, not-so-bright ones do. They don't know any better. But just because they want to change stuff doesn't mean you have to willingly go along. I think a lot of men go along with some of the foolishness women come up with because it benefits those men. For example, men will go along with the idea that women should s*ck and f*ck every man she meets. Why? Because he wants to meet those women. But you turn around and ask that man if they want their sisters and daughters to s*ck and f*ck every man she meets, you're met with a very different reaction because the man knows the behavior isn't admirable.
@Ms. SMART this comment is well appreciated & inspiring
Many guys become deadbeats after the child is born. So should the mother change the child's name after this happens?
I found out when I was about 16 that my parents were not actually married when I was born. I was given my father's last name at birth. My parents were married before I turned 1.
All women should do what makes them feel comfortable. If you dont think the father of your child deserves to have his name attached to your child, then dont give your child his last name. If you feel like your child not having his/her father's last name make him a bastard, then give it to him/her. The point is… It doesnt matter if other people look at you and wonder why you made the decision you made. It was YOUR decision.
I also wonder about hyphenated names. People giving kids two names. Tyrone Jones-Jackson for example.
When Tyrone Jones-Jackson has kids…..his kids wife may want to do the same thing. So now the grandchild is John Jones-Jackson-Washington. Where does it all end? LOL
I hope that every male who ever says "I refuse to have daughters" is blessed with NOTHING but girls just like my father and grandfather were. 🙂
Good post though!
The funny thing is men love love love their daughters. Its daddy's little girl after all!
I used to be on Team No Girls, but with a lil age, maturity and self-exploration I realized that i want a girl bad. I'm super affectionate and I need a lil girl to lay some of that affection on. I'll just want to rough house a boy, but i'd be sooooo far on her squadron it'd be crazy. I want a chocolate girl .. shouldn't be too hard considering how dark i am. Can't wait.
You guys are hitting it out of park today
I prefer a son…. but I will having alot of kids so he will come eventually
I also laughed at that line. That kind of thinking is the easiest way to ensure that you will have all girls and you will be that dad who is wrapped around their pinky fingers. He'll be that dad from the commercial practing cheers outside on the lawn with his daughter and going to the gun range for target practice when she's old enough to date. Girls love their fathers more. #TeamDaddy'sGirl all the way.
yesss. #TeamDaddy'sGirl in the building. lmbo.
and i believe that is true about men claiming they don't want daughters. my dad was one, he wanted boys.. ended up with two girls. we both have him wrapped to this day, around our fingers. lol
My daughters just turned 6 months…can I tell you how their eyes light up when Daddy comes in the room? I'm convinced the only reason they love me is because they know I'm lunch, lol.
#TeamDaddy’sGirl all the way.
You Know That's right!!!!
yep. and my cousins say it all the time too. there is actually a pattern my family (and yes i know biologically speaking its a 50/50 chance) of having all of one sex. I am one of 2 girls, my cousins are 2 boys, my mom is one of 4 girls, my grandfather is one of 4 boys.
and #teamdaddysgirl all the way! I honestly would like a mix, but I know all the men in my life who say they want no girls will end up being totally smitten with the girls they do have… just like everybody said..
THANK YOU!! I LOVE this entire post (especially the picture) and agree with every single word of it. And I, too, refuse to have daughters…hmmm…maybe we should talk… 😉
A few things:
Great Post … Of all the single mother's i've dated or layed with or whatever, I've never once thought or even asked about the last name of the child. Not once. Wow now that i think about it. Hopefully that doesn't speak too negatively on me.
But now that i think about it, yeah true its the woman's decision to do whatever she wants with the child's last name tho i don't think that last name should carry his name if he's nowhere to be found. And i'm sure all those future step-fathers may have a bit of an issue with raising a child who has the last name of a man that is practically a ghost. I'm sure she won't be thinking about future step-fathers when making the decision, but she may see positive effects from that decision later on down the road (both spoken and unspoken)
I read a post earlier that said something about naming the child after hers married or not…No self respecting man will let you name the child after her last name if he is present in any scenario NOR will he let his wife hyphenate her name. Name hyphenation IS.A.DEAL.BREAKER.PERIOD. Any woman that wants to keep her father's last name lacks respect for me and i will proceed to find another wife [endquote].
I want my first son's name to be mine, but that hyphenation ish takes the cake to almost anything and everything as it relates to me and my wife post marriage.
<blockquote cite="comment-315016">
@Top5DOA: No self respecting man will let you name the child after her last name if he is present in any scenario NOR will he let his wife hyphenate her name. Name hyphenation IS.A.DEAL.BREAKER.PERIOD. Any woman that wants to keep her father’s last name lacks respect for me and i will proceed to find another wife [endquote].
That is ALL NET! But women will argue you down that they must keep their last name for career purposes…But then again, that would be a non-issue to you because you probably weed those women out in date #1.
Yop … I'll weed her cakes out like Roundup and idgaf about career purposes at all.
All jokes asided……..I mean personally I find the whole hyphenating thing a little emasculating. But I guess…yes….if she had some big buisness or she was famous like Beyonce you might have to be understanding.
But I'm old fashioned. I just don't like it. And expecially not for the kids.
Might have to add this to the list of things to ask early on. LOL
<blockquote cite="comment-315016">
@Top5DOA: No self respecting man will let you name the child after her last name if he is present in any scenario NOR will he let his wife hyphenate her name.
I dont agree with the part about a self respecting man being against hyphenation. I think it depends on how important his name is to him. I know a couple who decided to both change their last names and start a new tradition. Plus what if her name has some type of branding significance. Should she just walk away from that because of your ego.
Now I'm just asking, because I fully intend to take my husband's last name but I understand those that may not want to.
There are no black Kennedy females…LOL So unless her last name is Winphrey….the branding won't be and issue.
What if her Ad agency or something like that used her last name.
If my potential husband takes issue with it, I won't do it. But, I def intend to hyphenate next go round. I won't hyphenate the kids names IF we have them (cause I'm actually not trying to have anymore unless dude is well off…cause Imma need a boob lift and belly work afterward, lol…I'm good now but my body can't take anymore trauma without medical help). I just wanted to do something different this time around with my name. I don't even have a deep reasoning for wanting to do it, lol.
<blockquote cite="comment-315037">
cynicaloptimist81:
I just wanted to do something different this time around with my name. I don’t even have a deep reasoning for wanting to do it, lol.
Cuz there is none and even if a woman has some type of branded last name…not to be sexist or anything, but she's a woman. The world will understand because she is now a wife to a man with a different last name. If the name is that well of a brand, I'm pretty sure that the name won't lose any steam due to her recent marriage, she may want to still be associated with the name, but oh well…Taking the man's name is apart of the woman's submission to her man. Not saying she needs to be totally submissive, but the name is #1 on the list.
I took on my ex-husband's last name…and I kept it. My kids carry his last name..he's remarried, too…so both his wife and I go by his last name…get's confusing sometimes…but, I only keep the name because of my kids..if I get remarried I will drop his name and take on my new husband's name for sure……or maybe, hyphenate. I'm still debating that.
With me, you aren't…Lol
I dunno, QueenT…I don't think I can have two names of men that know me intimately at one time, lol. Seems crowded, lol. One of those need to go. Plus, I can't see the new guy going for me keeping the old guys name…
And I am NOT looking forward to sharing a name with the new wife, if that happens. UGH…that's just…I'd seriously consider having a sit down with my children then to see how they'd feel about Mommy going back to her maiden name. At the thought, my pride is going "aww, hell naw", lol… "You ain't gonna have two chicks out here with your name…you ain't what's hot in the streets…you don't deserve that", lol…
So not only are women wanting to keep their last name if married, but now they're wanting to give their last name to the kids instead of the fathers??? Are you all serious???
The "family unit" is more and more excluding the father….intentionally.
Funny that the same women that wants give THEIR child THEIR name will be quick to call it OUR child when it's child support time.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You will never have to worry about that if you only get your wife, who has already taken your last name, pregnant.
I think the pendulum is beginning to shift in the other direction. Most women I know can't wait to change their name or have the option of changing it through marriage. And Kema is correct, if you marry the right woman it won't even be an issue. Everyone in the house will have the same name and you will all be known as The Whateveryourlastnameis-es.
My father wasn't always a douche, one day he decided to act a lil crazy and my mom decided that if she stayed, one of them was gonna die and it wasn't gonna be her (yeah mom is a G). They were married and have known each other since she was born, which might have affected her decision to keep the name. And when she left I was 8 months. I still have my father's name and my mom still uses her hyphenated married name. So my mother and I still have the same name. Do I wish that my mom would have changed my name? No. It's who I am, I've made my own name. The name reminds me of what not to look for in a man. The name also reminds him of how he f*cked up. I know him, we cool but I don't really f*cks with him like that. But I do like that fact that my younger brother and I have the same name, it makes us closer.
Every situation is different. My god-daughter doesn't have her father's last name and even now that he grew up and is acting right, my best friend will only offer him a hyphen. So is she right? If a woman decided to give her child her last name and the father get his sh*t together. Should she change the name to his? Is there a time limit to this "sh*t getting together-ness"?
I think this is a personal choice for every unmarried mother that I would never question…its neither my business or my place to say what's best for her and her child. If the child takes issue with his/her name, I def think it should be addressed…since it is their name. I think the reason that most mothers give the child the fathers last name is cause in most cases, they don't anticipate them being a deadbeat…and, culturally, its what most are inclined to do. I do know several women who, prior to the childs birth, sensed there would be issues with the childs father and chose to give the baby her last name.
I have always had the mindset that I will ONLY have children while married to avoid deadbeat issues. Abortion is not an option for me…and I've always told my bfs this. So, we always took every precaution to make sure there were no "oops" (BC, pull-out, protection…all at the same time sometimes, lol…I ain't playin). And, PRAISE JESUS, I'm on track with that. I was married 4 years before we had our first. My ex-hubby has his Daddy thing on lock…heck, I still have his name, lol. My kids and I won't have different last names unless I remarry. It bothers me sometimes…carrying his last name that is, but its for my babies.
And…good mothers and fathers should NEVER be called Baby Daddy/Muva…only whack one's deserve those titles.
I am feeling this post; a lot of truth spoken but I hate generalizations….so here's the deal, just like there is a difference between Ninjas and Black people, there is a difference between a baby momma and being the mother of someone's child. I know both. I am a single mother and I don't know a damn thing about any trifling, tacky a** tradition of passing on the last name of a deadbeat or always giving up the cooch to the BD. If that isn't some Jerry Springer for yo behind, I don't know what is.
A point made earlier that I agree with, not every man is a known deadbeat before/during the pregnancy, some show that demon after the child is born. Either way, it comes down to looking at the the legacy you will be passing on. Names have meaning, something some women don't even think about, but they should. So, I am definitely with you on NOT passing on the name (first or last) of a deadbeat. Makes no sense.
As for some of the other points, there is no waiting around on a man that doesn't want you or the child! As a woman, check your self esteem, note what you and the baby are worth, provide a loving environment for your child and move on. It may take time, but it isn't impossible. Women do it every day. There will come a day when that deadbeat will have to answer for his mistakes….
and for the folks that always want to say " I don't know why a woman would sleep with a deadbeat, etc" be real! Same reason why some dudes smash ugly chicks and hoes – not thinking, being selfish and caught up in the moment. I am NOT saying it's right, but it happens. And for the women who knowingly sleep with a deadbeat (Smh), Again check your self worth, learn from the mistakes of others, put the cooch on lock and keep it moving.
<blockquote cite="comment-315034">
EmeraldStarr78: Either way, it comes down to looking at the the legacy you will be passing on. Names have meaning, something some women don’t even think about, but they should.
I really wish more people understood this. Your name IS a part of your make-up and helps to make you YOU. I really didn't understand this when I named my first son…yet he still exhibits traits true to his name. I learned this prior to naming my second son…so I thought long and hard. The meaning of my youngest son's name is "young warrior god with us"…and this lil boy is strong, determined, and absolute…a grown man stuck in a kids body. He's a character that is VERY true to his name. I tell folks all the time that his name is too strong, lol…I shoulda balanced "young warrior" with something a little less controlling, smh.
<blockquote cite="comment-315034">
EmeraldStarr78:
and for the folks that always want to say ” I don’t know why a woman would sleep with a deadbeat, etc” be real! Same reason why some dudes smash ugly chicks and hoes – not thinking, being selfish and caught up in the moment. I am NOT saying it’s right, but it happens.
Don't keep it so trilla, they don't wanna hear it. Like every one of us here would be happy to have children with everyone that we've done the slip and slide with.
Yeah. Ok. Right.
(-_-)
Who plans to have children with JOs? Certainly not the majority of folks.
True.
But some women are repeat offenders of bringing a child into this world with a man that won't even show them enough respect to take them on a date hell come to their house before booty call hours. There are women who has a baby by a guy who is a horrible dad but keeps sleeping with him, not using protection and then has another one by him and thinks things will change. We have to (men and women) take responsibility for our actions. You already have one deadbeat dad in your life, that should make you want to strap up twice
We all know things happen, you hope for the best and prepare for the worst but if you keep doing the same actions (having babies with joe bob and will) then its on you and not an mistake
@Emerald I feel you homie, however my point still stands… Alot of BMs are frowsy…
I couldn't agree more. I always ask my single pregnant friends and relatives about the child's name and most of them want to name the child after the father. I ask "who is going to be signing report cards and going to the school?". I get blank stares. One responded "I'm not married". And I thought "good girl". But then she turned around and had a baby by someone else and gave that baby his last name. It seems with her, it had to do with the relationship she had with the fathers. The 1st one was incognegro & wasn't going to sign the birth certificate. The second one is a deadbeat but signed the birth certificate and is somewhat around. She was hoping for a commitment so gave the child his name. Didn't work out. Now all of her children have different last names and it's a sore point with the kids.
A compromise would be to give the child the father's last name as a middle name or something. But I can't see not being married–and knowing we WON'T be married–and going through life with a different last name than my child's.
I see your point but this isn’t about the mother not having the same last name as her kids, or walking through life as such, if that was so important, she would have went for the ring first before getting pregnant, (not saying that slip ups don’t happen) but I keep seeing this trend of "hey Have the baby hope for the ring". While it might be a sore point with your friend’s children most children will just be sore that they don’t have the same father period. Especially if one kids father is being active in his/ her life (which then means that child should have his last name) and the others father is a deadbeat.
For me, having the same last name as my child would be the issue. I don't know if I'll get married; if I'll choose to co-parent with a friend; or what will happen—if I have children at all. But I can't see NOT having the same name as my child. Especially if I am the primary custodial parent, meaning I'm signing all forms, registering at school, taking him to doctor appointments, etc. It's not a punishment for the father not marrying me and it's not me longing to be married to him. It's just how I feel. Plus, I like my last name. Our last name is a big deal to my dad & he doesn't have any sons so I will probably always have my last name in some way. And my children's names will have our name somewhere in the mix–married or not.
As far as the girl I used as an example, she (realistically) knew she wasn't marrying any of the fathers of her children. They should all have her last name. One of the fathers is around, but doesn't contribute financially and isn't really a part of his kids' lives. They know who he is, but his family spends more time with them and does more for them. They could have had his last name as one of their middle names if it was so important to include him. The name issue is just one more amongst the children caused by them having different fathers.
Kimmie,
I agree. This was my point earlier. It is not about the man/father. If I am raising the child, I want the child to have my last name. I hope that everyone gets married before they get pregnant, but we know that is not the case. So if you have a woman who has a child and is not married – she has a choice. She can give the baby the father's last name or hers and neither choice is wrong, whether the father is involved or not. My preference would be for my child to have my last name. My ultimate preference is to be married and we all have the same name. However, either way my child and I will have the same name.
<blockquote cite="comment-315036">
Smilez_920: but I keep seeing this trend of “hey Have the baby hope for the ring”.
All day long. I don't think a lot of women expect to marry and ever change their names. The 'everyone in house should have the same last name' argument doesn't account for what happens if the woman gets married. Then she'll have to decide if she honors her husband by taking his last name, leaving her child with an odd name–especially if she and her new husband have kids, change that child's last name to her new husband's last name (assuming he's willing to adopt said child), etc. This is all so messy.
I'm a newcomer to this website and while I enjoy reading the articles and the intellectual debates that follow on the comment boards, I've never been compelled to comment….until now. Being a "baby mama" (hate that term btw, its not even grammatically correct first off) my child has her father's last name. We are no longer together, and we had a great, loving relationship up until around the first few months of our daughter's life. Maybe this article doesn't apply to me because my ex is an excellent father, but to suggest that its silly or stupid to give your child his/her father's name if you aren't married to them stung me a lil for some reason lol. It's tradition…..that's why I did it, but even if dude is a deadbeat or not your husband or whatever the case, your child still deserves that connection with their paternal half, via last name. You mean to tell me that because of the nature of the relationship ( father is absent, won't be with the mother, etc.) I should deny that connection with him and my child? Maybe I'm thinking too deeply into it but that's my perspective….
Welcome and thanks for sharing your perspective. 🙂
This article certainly touched nerves but you're right, I think, about SBM's disclaimer (***disclaimer*** I am only talking about the dad’s out there who don’t raise there kids and are “no-good” ******) excluding you from the scrutiny in the post.
I'm incredibly pleased to hear you address what is best for the child in your situation " … your child still deserves that connection with their paternal half, via last name. You mean to tell me that because of the nature of the relationship ( father is absent, won’t be with the mother, etc.) I should deny that connection with him and my child?". To me, that is the mark of a true parent. It's really not about you and what you want anymore. It's about making that child the best s/he can be.
Hope to hear from you again!
Thanks 😀 Maybe I'll come outta "lurk mode" now that I got positive reviews on my first comment lol. Being a young mother at that (I'm 22, had my daughter at 20) it means a lot to be recongnized as a good parent…….by the way how do you add a pic?
http://www.gravatar.com it'll soothe what ails ya…
🙂
If the father is not around and wont ever be around then the child and the father have no connection. Being a parent is more than just DNA it is a behavior in the physical. So if a man has a child and the man is not present in any way, shape, or form, then the child should not have the last name because there is no connection.
I mean you(not you personally) have a child walking around with a man's last name that doesnt give a fkuc about you or the child. That is embarrassing.
IMO a last name should only be given if there is a real connection shown by behavior and being present. That is where the real connection is made, not by DNA.
*coming out of lurk mode to make this comment*
I agree with justkeLLz on almost all points, my situation just ended differently.
My daughter also has the same last name as her father, although we are no longer together. At the time the she was born, her father and I were engaged, so it seemed pretty obvious (to me anyways) that she would take his last name. Fast forward only about a month after she was born, things were not working out. He showed his deadbeat self AFTER she was born. Because of it we went our seperate ways.
Where I differ with justkeLLz is the he is not a good father and no longer in her life at all.
So I guess this post doesn't directly refer to me or my choices, but I don't know if it's fair to fault ALL women, whose children's father is not around, for their child having their father's last name.
<blockquote cite="comment-315033">
il Duce the Grand Nagus…..Commentary So Dangerous it Must Be Deleted: Teflon…….I think I’m lookin at this from a whole different perpective than yall. I actually went throught some probate stuff not too long ago. A family member died without a will. Born in about 1920 something. There were like 20 people with claims on the estate. Cousins I never even met. Anyway…..everyone had to prove their relation. Of course a birth certificate is the easiest way but I’m pretty sure, and I will have to check the paperwork to be certain, but I’m pretty sure you could provide other evidence of your relation. I mean just 50 years ago you might be born in your mother’s house in rural Georgia with no birth certificate at all. So I’m just not buyin that the birt certificate ends a probate case. So I’m not talkin child support. I talkin probate. And I just think having had the last name your entire life and being acknowledged by the family with the same last name would help make your case as opposed to showing up with a different last name and nobody knows you.
I feel you on this, and I can share a probate issue as well. One of my good friends recently lost her child's father. He wasn't the greatest dad, but he had a few insurance policies and death benefits from his job. She had no issues getting the benefits for her son because the father acknowledged the child at birth. However, she has to get all kinds of proof now and establish herself as his legal guardian, partially because they don't share the last name.
Yeah that's it. Havin the same name just makes people view it with less suspicion. If the last names are different that's a red flag for fraud.
Naming a child/giving the child the last name of a man who is not involved in the child's life is a very personal choice. I just believe lots of thought should go into it…
You could just let the child decided once they turn 18. I had a friend whose parent got divorced, her father was being a jerk to her mother so she left. After they divorced they found out the mother was very ill, they asked him for help, not financially with the mother but with the daughter and school and he started acting funky. So both the daughter decided she no longer wanted to have anything to do with him and change her last name to her mothers. I just think the child should have a say on this at some point. if your a mother and want your children to have your last name you can always use both ex: James Jones- Brown even married ppl do that .
But doesn't the kid need a name until then? The child can change it once they get to a certain age, but they need a last name. I said this upthread – it's not so bad when you have ONE kid that doesn't share your name, but once you have a few kids and they all have different dads and different names you start smellin' a little rattish.
The women should have thought about smelling rattish before she had the kids. If you have 3 kids and one of the father's is great and the other 2 aint ish I don't think the child with the great dad should have to give up his dads last name so the mother won't look a certain way. The kids are here already why are you worried about what ppl think now that they are herem
Your kid can have whatever last name they want, if you don't have a legal paper stating you're marriage to the 'baby daddy' and the actual last name change, they are always going to ask your mothers LAST NAME, LOL.
lol @ hoes having kids with no husband, nasty.
@WUT
This post has nothing to do with having kids and no husband. On top of that, to refer to having a child with no husband as nasty is just unecessary. Why do you have to be so insulting?
A woman's husband can be out of the picture and an overall dead beat as well…happens every day. Your comment was fine until you mentioned that–which makes me question your presence here.
not much to add on this subject. like you i plan on being married to the mother of my children (if God sees it fit). i care if my wife has my last name (not a deal breaker) but my children will have my last name. all 3 of them.
“One more reason I don’t date women with kids (yeah … I said it)!”
DAMN!
I'm real mad I missed this, lol. My bf USED to say the same thing…and I have two kids. One of my closest girlfriends said the same thing, lived by it, then married a man with one child.
Fact is, the right man/woman will have you bypassing all kinds of "I ain't neva" type stuff, LOL. Like the old folks say, if you wanna make God laugh, tell him your plans…
I have a great co-parenting arrangement that gives me 7 whole days to myself every other week. And, because my children's father (ex-hubby) is a great Dad, I'm not looking for a man to help parent my children…I have that. I want a man for ME…who's only role in my childrens lives will be to support me in what I do for them. Plus, my children won't have a relationship with any man in my life unless I'm dag near certain he WILL be a part of their lives for good. My boys have no clue I have a bf…and they see/interact with him in a neutral place. So, if needed, I can assess how they respond to each other during those time. During my Mommy Weeks, my bf and I talk on the phone while I'm at work and once my kids are in bed…and we meet for lunch sometimes…so he gets me to himself as he should.
Don't sell yourself short, fellas. I'm certain I'm not an anomaly. There are single parents/divorcees with life plans suitable for dating effectively.
@cynicialoptimist81
Yes! every single woman with a child or children is NOT an episode of Maury.
MOST BMs are wacksauce anyway… Not all, most…. Either they aren't quality human being, or they made children with men who weren't of quality….
I appreciate chick logic and all of its wonder & swagnificence… but to protect my brain, I will not try to figure out the bm phenomenon …
I will say this, I am not ready to create a <del> love </del> child… but I want some parenting skills…
SO, if I find a bm who is a good quality human & is a good look all around… I would give her a 6 months free trial
<blockquote cite="comment-315059">
Adonis: SO, if I find a bm who is a good quality human & is a good look all around… I would give her a 6 months free trial
LMAOOOOO.
Adonis man……nevermind.
*walks off laughing*
Flipping heck, I've learnt something today. Thanks Kimmie: 'incognegro' that's my word for the day folks!!!!!!l l
Some days this site trifles, other days it drops science!
I didn't read all the comments so I apologize if I am repeating someone….
Here goes, my bestie had a baby on Tuesday with a man who has made it very clear since practically conception that he doesn't want the baby. She is refusing to give the baby his last name and he is now like well hell I REALLY aint gonna do nothing now…and I kinda feel his point. If a woman chooses to have a baby with a man then she SHOULD give the baby his last name. I think if she doesn't it is just being spiteful. Well you aren't the father I think you should be so I am going to hurt you and not give the baby your name… Maybe if people would stop having babies out of wedlock we wouldn't have to have these debates… #imjustsaying
That man was just using that as an excuse so he doesnt have to be present. He already made it clear that he didnt want to be involved. So that last name issue was just more of his excuse.
I totally agree that even if she gave the baby his name he probably STILL wouldn't be involved, but that goes to the bigger issue of whether women should continue to force men into having children they don't want. When a woman gets pregnant all a man can do is wait for what she says is going to happen. Women have all the power when it comes to deciding whether to have a baby and they make a unilateral decision and then expect a man to just jump on board with whatever decision they make…because of course he laid down with me and if he never wanted MY baby he shouldn't have laid down with me in the first place (in my sarcastic tone). #gokillyourselfwiththatish
Yes I agree with the question, should women have babies men dont want. My answer would be she should do what she wants but if he made it clear he doesnt want to be involved then…oh well…I guess.
That's a complicated one. I always fealt if I had a child and the man didnt want me or my child then I would not even ask the man for child support. I feel you shouldnt have to chase a man down to take care of kids that are his. I mean what kinds of a man wouldnt give his kids anything? I mean really?
But thats just me. I havent been in that situation and hope I never will.
This, "…he is now like well hell I REALLY aint gonna do nothing now…and I kinda feel his point" is where you lose me. That strikes me as a man who had no intention of doing for his child, he just found a way to put the blame on the mother. If a man doesn't want to provide or care for his child I see no reason to honor him by creating a legacy for his name.
@Starita34 haha! Exactly!
As someone who has neither my mother's or father's last name, I learned a long time ago to not put too much importance behind a name. I share the same last name as most of my siblings, but it's not really mine to claim. However, my little brother hates the last name with a fiery passion and plans to change it. When he asked me if I wanted to do the same, the most I could manage was a shrug. I also didn't change it when I got married (probably a subconscious thought that it wasn't going to work out). To me, it's just a name. How important or sacred can they really be if you can run down to the courthouse and change it on a whim?
Unless you have a deep family history with a legacy to really be proud of, I'm not sure it's that important to name your child anything but the most logical name. If the man is going to step up and be a father, then obviously I would say that the child should have his name. Otherwise, give them the most practical last name of the two that will provide logical benefits (same name as siblings, easier to get mail, etc.).
I'ma throw this tidbit out there…
Once a lady I was smashing and I had the "worse case scenario" (i.e. pregnancy) conversation. She asked me straight up, what would I do/expect IF she got pregnant and IF she decided to have the child. My response was if the decision to have a child was made without my input, then I would assume she wouldn't want to raise the child WITH my cooperation. I'm willing to take full responsibility for raising a child I help create, but I would want to do that alone meaning I would push her to terminate her parental rights or custody battles galore. She didn't like that AT. ALL. welp…
I believe your um… input is necessary to make the pregnancy possible. lol
True enough… But a pregnancy doesn't always lead to a birth of a child. The decision to have a child or not, should be discussed and the terms agreed upon. The willingness to make a decision that permanently affects the life of another WITHOUT fair representation is beyond wacksauce. Normally, a woman would expect a guy to have a sizable hand in raising the child, SO I BETTER be able to influence decisions in the raising, education, health, location and even the potential existence of the said child. Likewise, if any woman aborted a child of mine without telling me, NOT SAYING that I'll ever hit a woman, but this will be going through my mind:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3o-uEH85gNE&fe…
@MeteorMan
smh at this video and at the thought going through your mind!
AMEN MeteorMan!!! Instead of worrying about whether to give the baby his name you should be worried about why you are having a baby that the man doesn't want!!!!
Let me preface by saying that I don't believe that a woman should ever make that decision without discussions with the father. However, as it's been stated on this site many times and is pretty much a foregone conclusion, the woman is the one who will end up with the bulk of the responsiblity. Whether that responsiblity is having to raise a child or having to live with having an abortion. Therefore, I strongly believe that if the man and woman are at an impasse and a decision must be made, that decision should be the woman's. I also strongly believe that the man should still bear responsibility for any child produced. Yes, you may have wanted her to have an abortion, but you should have really thought about that before sleeping with her.
Also, if you didn't want the baby and have no concern with them, why is it even an issue what the child's last name is?
I purposely didn't mention anything about names. I'm aware that my comment was a slight tangent but I feel that this post and at least some of the comments touched on parental responsibility as a choice verses duty.
This is EXACTLY WHY I have this discussion as soon as it's apparent we'll be getting down with the get down…cause after I'm impregnated, MM & CO won't be deciding together whether or not I'm putting my mind, body, and soul through abortion. MM will understand that pregnancy is a possibility cause we're getting down. And, if it happens, I'm NOT having an abortion and he WILL STILL be legally bound to at least take care of the child financially. MM then choosing to sleep with CO is his compliance to the discussed expectations.
This is also why I say "DA*N THAT" to casual s.ex. The risks are too high and the consequences are life altering…
…done made my pressure go up, lol
Personally, I don't have a hard fast rule when it comes to having a child independent to wedlock status. Its really dependent on the people involved and environment when it happens. Though I think its immoral to force responsibility of a child onto someone else who doesn't want the child. And I also feel its immoral to force a women to do something with her body that she doesn't want. Of course, the answer is always "you should have really thought about that before sleeping with her" but it doesn't speak to the crux of the issue. Its a cop out and basically says: 'it's cool b/c I have a vag!na.'
In my mind, its safer to just have sex within a relationship. Having tons of sexual partners means nothing to me. If I want to have sex a lot, I just need to fine someone I like and in the context of a functional relationship, have sex A LOT. With that said, my body count is probably lower than most.
<blockquote cite="comment-315106">
MeteorMan: In my mind, its safer to just have sex within a relationship. Having tons of sexual partners means nothing to me. If I want to have sex a lot, I just need to fine someone I like and in the context of a functional relationship, have sex A LOT. With that said, my body count is probably lower than most.
We can def dap on this…cause I feel the exact same way. My body count is still in the single digit range…you're not alone.
<blockquote cite="comment-315106">
MeteorMan: Of course, the answer is always “you should have really thought about that before sleeping with her” but it doesn’t speak to the crux of the issue. Its a cop out and basically says: ‘it’s cool b/c I have a vag!na.’
In my mind, this speaks exactly to the crux of the issue (and serves as a foundation to your last paragraph). People should be using their heads before they choose to have sex with anyone. Also, this is no more a cop out than a man who decides that he shouldn't have to pay child support because he wanted the woman to have an abortion and she couldn't live with that. That basically says "it's cool b/c I don't have a vagina and am therefore clear of all responsibilty"
Also, while body count does significantly increase your chances of ending up a single parent, it is not the real problem. Lots of single mothers out there are raising babies from men they were in relationships with and a lot of those were even stable relationships. Having sex while only in long-term relationships does not exclude a chance of you ending up sharing a child with a woman you are no longer with. People need to learn how to have safe sex if they don't want children, whether they are in a relationship or not.
<blockquote cite="comment-315108">
SaneN85: Also, while body count does significantly increase your chances of ending up a single parent, it is not the real problem. Lots of single mothers out there are raising babies from men they were in relationships with and a lot of those were even stable relationships. Having sex while only in long-term relationships does not exclude a chance of you ending up sharing a child with a woman you are no longer with. People need to learn how to have safe sex if they don’t want children, whether they are in a relationship or not.
I see your point and I agree. However, the fact that this individual has been vetted so to speak (decent enough that you chose to be in a long-term relationship/marriage with the person) makes it even more likely (not a definite at all though) that he/she will commit and be responsible for the child…which, considering the issues that influenced the topic of the post, is the real issue. This isn't really about avoiding being a single parent (though you should)…it's about sharing a kid with a deadbeat parent and the choices you should make concerning the deadbeat. Vetting folks properly before you have s.ex with them can help you avoid this…
I think it is really sad that the standard of what a father should be has gotton so low that we look at having a last name to be more important than the actual behavior. WTF!?
In my opinion if that man is not present and he is not active, why does the child have his last name? What does that prove? Who does the child live with? Who pays for things for the child? Who shows up to school? PTA meetings, teacher confrences, etc? A parent is more than just a name.
I have my fathers last name and I am okay with that. Because he has been in my life sense day one and still is. Plus my parents are still together. If I was to have kids by a man I would not expect behavior that is less than what my father does. If you are going to be a father be one. Make that last name count.
Your child is basically walking around with the last name of a ghost. How crazy is that.
I want all of my kids to have the same last name. I dont want there to be any confusion and If I am am the primary caregiver(and it will stay that way) they will have my last name, unless I am married.
Honestly its a case by case situation,
If the father hasn't been around since day one no type of ties then no give the child your last name but in a situation where he's a dead beat by his family is still helping you take of the child despite his actions then I think out of respect for his family (if they are helping you) give the child the fathers last name. I think ppl are about having the fathers last name other then legal or like the situation stated above is b/c some women only want their children to walk around with their last name is so ppl won't find out about the different father and give the women the side eye. In that case suck it up if a teacher is more worried about what my child's last name is then me showing up to the meeting then that's the problem.
You and I have convos all over this thread, so I'll just meet you down here, lol. If I had more than one kid with more than one father, I wouldn't have a problem giving the kid the dad's last name. Like if I had 3 kids and only one had a dad in their life, 2 would have my name and one would have the dad's name. I believe the kid's name should reflect the person who takes primary care of them. And as someone who worked in the school system, it wasn't about judging a mom if her kid's name is different. It's the logistical nightmare of figuring out which kids are related. Because kids have all kinds of play brothers/sisters/cousins. And really – when you have 3+ kids in elementary school and they all have different last names, more than likely we're going to have some behavioral problems and mom is too busy trying to provide to come down and get them every time. It may be a stereotype, but that doesn't mean there's no validity to it. Where we agree TOTALLY is that women need to be much (much,much) more selective with who they have children with. Avoid the situation altogether and you don't have to ponder the issue too much.
The google ads that are showing up in my gmail because of this discussion are uncomfortably/ hilarious.
"Ancestry.com"
"Fathers Rights of Children"
"New Social Security Card"
🙁
“Ancestry.com”……..Phaaaa
Seriously, lol…
lol it actually says
"Ancestry.com, Family tree"
#babymamatradition would be a hilarious trending topic. please tell me i'm not the only one who thought that?
Single mother with 3 awesome bay's… BD and I were together for 13 yrs., never married. I did research and found that you could give the child two last names. Without the hyphen the child can then use the last name(s) in any order, i.e. Smith Jones, Jones Smith, Smith, or Jones. It also makes identity theft much more complicated. I only use my last name when completing paperwork for the children, my sons use my last name and my daughter uses both.
<blockquote cite="comment-315094">
SaneN85: However, as it’s been stated on this site many times and is pretty much a foregone conclusion, the woman is the one who will end up with the bulk of the responsiblity.
I tend to believe that's primarily because women have ALL the say whether a child is born or not. I don't know which came first…but anytime you remove someone's choice in the matter, most likely they'll be reluctant to accept responsibility in the matter. Just because you rode in a Bentley with me, doesn't mean I should be able to add you to the car loan, making you responsible for half of the payments……with you having NO say in the matter.
I think that if men had the right to choose, just as women do, you'd have less absent fathers. Women wouldn't be able to force men into financial fatherhood, so they'd double up on the pill….and men who don't want to be fathers aren't forced to be fathers.
Think back to the stories you hear of BEFORE women had birth control. They took extreme measures to avoid motherhood. Hangers methods, abandoning babies in dumpsters, etc. Why, because they had NO options post conception. Men disappearing after conception is of the same nature because that's men's ONLY option of opting out of fatherhood. If men had options, it'd curtail the random baby daddies, and it'd ensure that the child has a better chance of having both parents, whether married or not, because more kids would be born to TWO parents that wanted to be parents. Not just one who'll put the other on child support(father doesn't want them)…….or not aborted/put up for adoption (mother doesn't want them).
To me, this reads a lot like finding any way that can possibly be found to blame women. The fact is that men (and women) are aware of the risks when they have sex, they just figure the rewards outweigh the possible benefits. Yes, it's not fair that men don't get a larger say in whether that baby will be brought to term or not, but it's also not fair that a woman has to carry it for nine months and/or live with the emotional effects of an abortion. Nobody removed the man's right to choose, except nature and if I'm not mistaken men have been disowning illegitimate children long before abortion was legal.
*sigh* I need to get off this topic, it's to exhausting.
Waving the church fan, doing a dance down the aisle on this….Men act like they have no choice, but unless a woman raped you, you had a choice playa! Sex makes babies, and a baby is just ONE of the consequences that you can't take back. A woman has one more option if there is a pregnancy, whether she chooses to take advantage of it or not. But don't sit around acting like you were robbed when you put your little swimmers in that cho-cha willingly. There is no way to give men "equal say" in this without giving a man control over a woman's body. Picture a man being able to force a woman to have an abortion or being able to force her to carry a child she doesn't want to give birth to. Puh-leeze.
"I mean what kinds of a man wouldnt give his kids anything? I mean really?"
The kind you shouldn't have kids with….
<blockquote cite="comment-315063">
cynicaloptimist81: I’m real mad I missed this, lol. My bf USED to say the same thing…and I have two kids. One of my closest girlfriends said the same thing, lived by it, then married a man with one child.Fact is, the right man/woman will have you bypassing all kinds of “I ain’t neva” type stuff, LOL. Like the old folks say, if you wanna make God laugh, tell him your plans…I have a great co-parenting arrangement that gives me 7 whole days to myself every other week. And, because my children’s father (ex-hubby) is a great Dad, I’m not looking for a man to help parent my children…I have that. I want a man for ME…who’s only role in my childrens lives will be to support me in what I do for them. Plus, my children won’t have a relationship with any man in my life unless I’m dag near certain he WILL be a part of their lives for good. My boys have no clue I have a bf…and they see/interact with him in a neutral place. So, if needed, I can assess how they respond to each other during those time. During my Mommy Weeks, my bf and I talk on the phone while I’m at work and once my kids are in bed…and we meet for lunch sometimes…so he gets me to himself as he should.Don’t sell yourself short, fellas. I’m certain I’m not an anomaly. There are single parents/divorcees with life plans suitable for dating effectively.
Can the church say AMEN to that 3rd paragraph, lol. Thats how I feel……I'm not looking a man to be a father to my child, she has that….I'm looking for a man for ME. You don't know how many times I've been out and about with my daughter and dudes will say "I'll be stepdaddy." N*gga please…..maybe its just the ignorant n*ggas down here in Miami, but I digress…..I totally feel where you coming from.
<blockquote cite="comment-315098">
cynicaloptimist81:
This is EXACTLY WHY I have this discussion as soon as it’s apparent we’ll be getting down with the get down…cause after I’m impregnated, MM & COwon’t be deciding together whether or not I’m putting my mind, body, and soul through abortion. MM will understand that pregnancy is a possibility cause we’re getting down. And, if it happens, I’m NOT having an abortion and he WILL STILL be legally bound to at least take care of the child financially. MM then choosing to sleep with CO is his compliance to the discussed expectations.
This is also why I say “DA*N THAT” to casual s.ex. The risks are too high and the consequences are life altering…
…done made my pressure go up, lol
See most people do not have this convo beforehand. I don't think every BM thought about having a baby with the man they were laying with before they laid with him either. I think they get preggers and say well I ain't having no abortion so this dude it is. That I cannot condone. In my opinion if you had an honest convo beforehand and it happens then he probably won't be a deadbeat and if he is get all the $$$ you can. But if he was just your cut and y'all never discussed anything & you choose to have the baby and he is a deadbeat your bad deal with it and don't act like the victim because you wanted something he didn't. If you can't handle an abortion then maybe you should have thought about that before you laid with a deadbeat.
Long-time lurker…many a time wanted to say something but, well, didn't. This post spoke to me because I have a child that carries on the last name of a no good @sshole. Mind you we were engaged when my daughter was born and hence the reason that she carries his name. She is 4 yrs old now and while I have been procrastinating long enough, she will have my last name before the end of the year.
Now….let me go and read the comments.
I just spoke to one of my girlfriends who has teenage twins with a no-good father. Most of the time, a woman doesn't know that he'll be a deadbeat when the baby(ies) are born. That comes out later. Now that her girls are 15 they want to take her last name and sever all ties with him. She's cool with that. My original feelings are still the same, though: having children carry on your name is an HONOR. Don't give that honor to a man who refuses to care/provide for his kids.
You give them their last name for Social Security reasons. If that no good falls over or gets shot, then you will have no problem getting SSI (if he's made enough while living) to draw the check to take care of the child. Seen this happen a few times with people i know. This is why its best to at least try to get them there to sign the birth certificate and give them the last name. If you making paper like that and you see it being that way the rest of your life, hand em your last name. #justsayin
It has nothing to do with the child's connection to the father. It's about the woman not wanting to look like a ho. It's to let people know that even though the father is not present, the mother can at least IDENTIFY the ninja… None of this Maury "Who is the father?" mess.
so I just had a son & my baby momma refused to let me name my 1st son… she says thats ghetto cuz she dont want 2 kids with their dads names… anyway he doesnt have my 1st middle or last name & I feel so disrespected that I could never be with her again. I feel like she deprived me of my legacy for dumb reasons & Im even excited about the baby. thats just how I feel it aint my fault. Ive lost much respect for her & Im so turned off now. But Im going to raise my son but Ill never call hi what she named him & everyone on my side will know him by what I call him. I warned her that this would change me & her relationship forever if she did it & she either didnt care or thought I was joking…smh.. but she messed up the whole experience for me & I dont feel a bond with my son..smh.
Im a single mum of two and my childrens dad is begging for the kids to change their surname to his. At first i declined but have now agreed , although i am unsure. He is from Jamaica and has kids with lots of women. Bad choice on my behalf i know. Over the years he has been terrible even disapearing for almost four years, after getting deported. I wonder if da name change will make him a more dedicated father?
If you have children out of wedlock and refuse to put the
Children in their fathers name, you are ghetto. A child
Needs to know who there fathet is regardless of wheter he
Is absent or not.
My dad was separated in his marriage when my mom met him. I am a product of their short relationship because he got back with his wife . I dont have his name and theres no bad blood he supported me. And i saw him sometimes but he had a fam already. My half brother was born from my dads wife a month after me. Poppa was a playa.There was always talk of me having his last name but my current name suits me better because im the only male my mom gave birth to.