Is it a priority for you to date someone that believes in the same God(s) you do?
For the majority, the answer is yes. We want to be with someone that has a similar belief system because we’re gonna have many of the same values, and we’re going to be able to speak a similar language when it comes to spirituality. This helps to establish a foundation that we can easily build on.
I can say with 99.3% confidence that the majority of SBM readers are Black, Christian women. We can look across the internet at similar sites you frequent and see the same trend. Additionally, there’s no shortage of articles on the topic ranging from how the church is keeping women single (bleh) to how come there aren’t more men there every week? You can also tell from your discussion amongst friends that spirituality is a big deal and most of the folks you associate with are probably Christian or of a similar faith. If your friends aren’t into spirituality and you are, you may want to find some new people. The best inspiration comes from circles. I’m not saying ditch your friends. I’m saying find some new ones that enhance this aspect of your life.
So let’s say you find someone that believes in God or the deity of your choosing. You get excited because they’ve met one of your most important requirements when considering a sustainable relationship. They say what church they go to or share a couple lines about what they believe in. You move on to the next topic and things continue to go well for the next few weeks…or months. Faith hasn’t been a huge deal since they’ve claimed to be god-fearing so you’ve been focusing on developing all the other aspects of the relationship.
You’re really happy about the situation and see the potential for a long and prosperous future with them because they treat you well and inspire you to be a better person. Everything is great until one day you get into a discussion about the in-depth specifics of your faith, and realize you’re on a completely different page in terms of how to get to the same happy place when you shed the flesh. Let me pose a question for you:
What happens when you believe in the same higher being, but believe in different ways of getting your spirits to the same place? What if you really love the person you’re with, but they interpret the Bible or most important book in your faith differently?
When you come to this realization, you have three choices:
- You accommodate each other’s spirituality the way an interfaith couple would, and work through the challenges.
- You compromise your beliefs to be more aligned with the other person.
- You break up and continue to look for someone that believes in what you believe in or goes to the same church.
Follow Up Question: Which would you be most likely to do today? Which would you be most likely to do if you aren’t married in five to ten years?
Let’s look more closely at each option:
Accommodation
The most common thing I hear when it comes to spiritually-based relationships is the concept of being “equally yoked.” Personally, I think that being equally yoked is both relative and overrated. If a person is striving to become a better person, treating you well, and living life in a way that sets an example for those around them and makes both of you better, you can still have a happy and thriving relationship without believing the exact same thing. Every book has multiple interpretations, so there are multiple ways to happiness.
You can raise a family that welcomes and appreciates diversity of thought, but isn’t divided. I’m not saying it’s easy, but it’s possible. That’s the accommodation. But there’s something to consider that we sometimes forget when we caught up in bliss and loins.
At the most basic level, your spiritual journey is exactly that: your spiritual journey. Nobody should be able to slow you down or make you suddenly veer off course to a different path, unless you’ve decided within yourself that it’s time to make a change. It happens to folks everyday. They have the epiphany that what they’ve been following for years upon years isn’t the route they wanna go, but that’s what they did because that’s how they were brought up.
Compromise
I look at compromise differently than accommodation. In the way that I’m speaking here, compromise is about altering your beliefs to make a relationship work so that you can live happily ever after. It’s a double-edged sword. On one end, it shows that you’re flexible and willing to make a sacrifice for the “greater good.” On the other, you’ve adjusted your core values for someone else. That’s not an easy thing to do. And if it is easy, then you must not have been as deeply rooted in your faith or values as you thought you were. There’s nothing wrong with that realization. It’s how you process it and move forward that determines who you really are.
Breaking Up
It’s a tough situation to be with someone that puts butterflies in your stomach every day, then have to turn around and accept that they aren’t the right person for you. It takes a very strong moral character and high level of faith to know that if you opt out of something with someone that makes you happy, you’ll find someone that’ll make you happier. Are you willing to take that leap? I’m willing to bet many of us aren’t. It’s an easy game to talk, but a tough pill to swallow. Pause.
I don’t say all this to tell you what to do. I say it because it’s important, and because it’s a part of the discussion that often gets missed when talking about faith/values requirements.
So how would you handle it if someone believes in the same deity you do, but has a completely different mindset about how to achieve the ultimate desirable outcome? Are you willing to compromise or accommodate? If so, what does it take for you to make that shift? Are there other options than the three I provided? All other thoughts are welcome!
I Really Ain’t Preaching Though,
P.S. Check out the latest post on TRSJ and take the next step in your career: “Landing Your Dream Job: How to Write a Cover Letter That Wins“
P.S.S. Are you guys ready for SBM’s Holiday Happy Hour at the Empire Room in the Empire State Building on Friday, December 23? We can’t wait. It’s going to be a dope time! Tell a friend to tell a friend and until then … stay tuned and stay focused.
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I am a black female, but not a Christian. I actually would like to marry someone who is a bit more religious than I because I would actually like my kids to have the experience of going to church, or mosque, or temple, or what have you (whether or not they choose to remain a part of that religion). So the person I am with is going to have to be the one who has to do one of these three things…
I suppose to answer the question, I am an accommodator, although my personal beliefs allow for a lot more flexibility than a one-way path to God/Enlightenment/Nirvana/the After life…. So maybe that's a fourth option? if your personal beliefs set you up as someone who doesn't have to disagree about that path?
just random thoughts of a grad student procrastinating from finals. lol Good Post though. 🙂
lol @ "just random thoughts of a grad student procrastinating from finals"<~Well good luck over there!
I'm very religious, but I don't know how I'd feel about someone that was even more religious and strict. Wouldn't want someone not capable of having a good time.
@ illadelph just curious that if you wanted your kids to have this experience why you couldn't take them yourself?
What if God forbid you became a widow? Would you stop taking your kids to church just because your husband was no longer around to do so?
Also, keep in mind that your "future husband" in taking your children to church will also want you to join him and the kids and may try to push his religion on you. Many times when a man takes a wife, if he is religious, he will at some point want her to be on board with him. For instance your religious man may marry you only on the condition that you fully subscribe to his religion.
Honestly, this post hits home. I converted to Islam over 5 years ago and religion is one of the biggest concerns for women when I date. Not that I only look for a Muslim woman or expect my wife to convert, but non-Muslim women choose not to go along for the ride. I don't blame them, but annoying nonetheless. I can't even count how many times I've heard that "unequally yolk" line. Attractive…Highly successful….Highly educated….Highly respected and appreciated by my peers and past girlfriends….so I do attract women…and I usually go for women who have high moral values (which usually ends up being religious women that practice their religion) and they try to overlook it at first….but usually ends the same. They get a "gut feeling" lol. With only 2% of America (still in the millions) being Muslim, most people don't really know about Islam and don't even know a Muslim person (not counting Nation of Islam or a Five Percenter). But Insha-Allah (God willing) I meet Ms. Right before I'm too old. I'm 24 though, so I have time lol. No rush.
insha'allah you do… 🙂 We do exist though (women for whom it wouldn't be a problem…)
Bittoofiq! (Good luck!)
Thank you. I have met women that are more accepting of it and have met a few that LOVE Muslim men, but there is something off. Whether age, they have kids (which I'm not a fan of at my age), or distance. I'm not worried though 🙂
@LastofmyBred question: when your dating a women who is spiritual but has no set religion but believes and God and has high moral standing, how do you introduce her to your religion?
If your wife chooses not to convert will your children have that same option? Will it make you question if your wife is actually meant to be your wife is she doesn’t want t convert?
(I only ask because converting to Islam is very serious and you really have to be dedicated to that change)
Well first, I announce that I'm Muslim early enough for them to decide if they can do it or not. But how do I introduce women to Islam? When the conversation of religion comes up, its mostly me answering questions they might have and trying to kill any misconceptions they might have had. Especially since most black women see Muslim women as being oppressed, yet Islam is actually a religion for women and if those that think that spoke to the Muslim women in America….they would know how happy they are.
I do plan on introducing my future kids to Islam and want to raise them to be Muslims, but if they decided Islam wasn't for them, then I would have no problem with that. And when I choose a wife, her not being Muslim or not converting will have no weight in my head. She can do as she please, but if she was to convert, I would never want it to be for me.
And you're right, converting to Islam is a very big thing. I don't preach to anyone or try to convert people. But at the same time, 21% of Muslims in America converted from Christianity and Islam is the fastest growing religion by conversion in the world, so I'm just happy to see people make that choice.
"Especially since most black women see Muslim women as being oppressed, yet Islam is actually a religion for women and if those that think that spoke to the Muslim women in America….they would know how happy they are. "
Yes. Yes. Yes. Simply put, Islam teaches women how to respect and protect themselves. The modest dress is for a reason. Think about like this, how much lusting would people be able to do if ALL women/men covered themselves modestly. The whole point of letting it all hang out is to attract anyway, just keeping it all the way real. Sexy is for your spouse, not the world. That's the only area I know most people have issues on. Oh yeah, the whole polygamy thing…first, we are subject to the law of this land, so that's not legal anyway. Second, I know TOO MANY women already knowingly sharing ANYWAY. Why not do it out in the open where its fair and each women is treated equally. That makes much more sense to me than this deception most live with daily. There are men that by nature may just require more than one woman, not about pleasure, just about NATURE. You can't fight nature, you can only work with it.
You WIll find that sister. Have faith. There are many that need a good Muslim Man. When I talk to people about Islam, it's weird because the MAIN reason most give is that….it's too hard? I get it, because practicing righteousness is hard…since it easier to do wrong (Satan always make wrong seem easier although the consequences are harder) I do understand that it's hard for people to fathom someone is always looking at them (although He always is whether you are Muslim or not)
Allahu-Akbar
Well those that need a good Muslim Man, just send them my way lol. And I will say that coming from Christianity or some of the other religions, Islam can be too much for them. But then at the end of the day…its really a question of faith and discipline. I've always had self control, so living the true way a Muslim should was not hard once I learned all he knowledge I needed to arm myself. But thank you. Allahu-Akbar
Just glad there are some muslims on this site..personally i will marry a muslim man Godwilling..apart from it being a personal choice..dont need that confusion for our kids Salam
Once I realized it was something important for me. I held out and waited. Waited to find the guy who shared my beliefs and values and who held it in the same high esteem. I think if it is that important it should be one of the first filters. Really truly if you vet houses, jobs etc to make sure they meet your requirements why not the person you want to spend the rest of your life with?
Addressing your specific question, "how would you handle it if someone believes in the same deity you do, but has a completely different mindset about how to achieve the ultimate desirable outcome?" I keep it moving. Not ,"I would," but I DO. It has happened before and probably will again. As a Christian woman, there are some things that are open to interpretation ("What was Christ doing before He turned 30?" and other things that don't really matter that much) but fundamentally, the Bible is pretty clear on the fundamentals, such as why we need salvation, what Christ did for us to have salvation, and how we as Christians are required to live once we receive that salvation. Black and white. Nothing to argue about. Unfortunately, many people believe Christianity is about going to church and getting into a routine as opposed to studying the Word of God, believing it to be the infallible word of God, and LIVING as if you believe it. Any guy that professes to be a Christian, but doesn't subscribe to the fundamentals is a CINO, Christian in Name Only, and I gotta keep it moving. And seriously anybody who would drop God out of fear that they never get a spouse or have love must serve a REALLY weak god. My God, however, CREATED man and created me with a purpose and a plan to prosper me and not to harm me, to give me hope and a future. Surely He is big enough to make a PROPER love connection that will not damage my soul.
If anyone's interested, I break down what the Bible has to say about the harm that comes from Christians being "unequally yoked with unbelievers," (http://www.dcdistrictdiva.com/?p=704) and what qualities Christian women should look for in a Husband (http://www.dcdistrictdiva.com/?p=2347) on my blog.
I can't speak on any other faith, but as a Christian, there aren't "levels" of Christianity — you are either a sold-out follower of Christ, or you are your own god, period. There really isn't any middle ground. Christ is either the Master of your heart, mind, soul, and life, or you are your own master and do what you want and make up a god that's cool with it. So if he's not sold-out for Christ, I wish him well and keep it moving cause he has absolutely nothing to offer me but a bridge to nowhere.
Girl you better preach! I was gonna set the record straight, but you already did that. Its nice to know that there are Christians who are not only talking the talk but walking it. God bless you and keep standing for Christ.
My recent post Lisa Raye and Bishop Noel Jones Going To The Chapel & It Aint For Prayer!!!
Say that. This walk is difficult enough and whoever is going to be a part of my life on that level should be a help not a hinderance. When I'm weak, he should be able to help strengthen me with God's words. When he's weak, vice versa. If I'm to trust him to lead our household, God has to be the Master of his heart, mind, soul & life. I can't submit to a man who God isn't the head of his life. So yes, we have to be equally yoked in order for me to commit. Otherwise, we can be JUST FRIENDS.
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"Christ is either the Master of your heart, mind, soul, and life, or you are your own master and do what you want and make up a god that's cool with it."
Christ can be all those things to him, but that doesn’t mean your ideals will also fall in sync with each other. It's like yall might be in the same room but just on different sides. Remember everyone’s walk with Christ is different, the bible is man made and can be interpreted as such.
For example your man might have Christ as the center of his everything which is good but maybe he doesn’t believe that he needs to attended every church service and function to prove it. Maybe Christ is the center of your life and you show that to the Lord by attending every church service and helping at every function.
If Christ is the Master of his heart, mind, soul, and life, I will not have any issue with the way the man displays that love. The Bible is very clear about the importance of attending church — not only to fellowship with other Christians and to encourage each other, but also to consistently develop your relationship with God under the instruction of teachers like your pastor and Bible study instructor. A man that has no interest in regularly attending church, submitting to a pastor's spiritual authority, and serving in a ministry in the church, is a man who has no interest in doing the bare minimum of what God requires of us as Christians, which would conflict with any statement that he has Christ as his Master.
Now, we may serve in different ministries, we may enjoy different activities, we may have different jobs and play different roles, and that is not a problem. God created each of us to perform a different function, whether head, tail, hand, or foot to the body of Christ. As long as the man is fulfilling his God-given role in the body of Christ and in our relationship and he dedicates his work, heart, talents, and treasure to the glory of Christ, we have no beef.
Again, if the man doesn't believe the Bible to the infallible word of God, we're going to have too many issues that I'm not willing to overcome. There is no dispute about what the Bible says about whether Christians should attend church, how Christians should live, and what a person must believe in order to be a Christian (the plan of salvation through Christ). Those are cut and dry and not disputed in the community of Bible-believing Christians. Everything else is small potatoes.
My recent post Ask a Diva: A Man Can’t Love Us Like God Does, So Why Do We Still Want A Man’s Love?
again, you can do the work of christ without being in church, people are in homeless shelters hours of of the weeks helping the needed, not for a paychecck but b/c they believe in helping others/the work of Christ.
submitting to a pastor's spiritual authority- your pastor is nothing but a man, a sinner like you thats been saved , you can take his advice but sumbmitting to his spirtual authority(he's not God). He makes mistakes.
Again to each his own but remember people change paths everyday even Bible-believing Christians. And again everyones walk with Christ is different.
That's just the thing, Smilez, it's not "too each his own." The Bible is very specific to say that we MUST attend church with other Christians (Hebrews 10:25), that we MUST pay tithes to that church (Genesis 28:22, Malachi 3:8-10, etc.) and we MUST involve ourselves in service at/thru church (1 Corinthians 12:12-31). Are we supposed to also go outside of the church and serve? OF COURSE (Mark 15:15)! But that in no way deflects from His command to serve in the church (1 Peter 4:10), be connected with believers, read the Bible for ourselves so that we actually KNOW what it says and won't be deceived (Psalm 119:9-11), and submit to the spiritual authority of a Pastor who can check you and pray for you when you get out of spiritual line (Colossians 4:12, and Hebrews 13:17) and be a resource to you when you need guidance on what the Bible says about things you are confused about.
Christ says in John 14:15, "If you love me, you will obey what I command." John 1:1 tells us that "In the beginning was the Word (the Bible/Jesus), and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." To love Christ and obey the Bible are inextricably linked, you cannot have one without the other, period. There are different ways to serve, but not valid differences on our requirements to serve.
Sorry, I agree with smiles. You can spit out all the scriptures you want, there will always be a bible verse that reflects something different. The bible is a book made by men, written by men, and then edited by men. And being as such…there are flaws and things that can be seen and taken by different people in different ways. My parents are Christians and they don't go to church every Sunday, but they are no less a Christian than yourself.
@LastofMyBreed, I'd be happy to read these scriptures that you suggest conflict with the many that I've provided for you. That is a pretty typical argument to suggest that the Bible is one contradictory statement after another, and a very convenient way to dismiss the Word and make up our own version that suits us better. That's everyone's right under God-given free will, but those people should probably just go ahead and admit that its not Christianity that they are practicing but Me-ism. (But whether they admit it or not, acknowledge it, or not, the truth, the Word of God stands forever (Isaiah 40:8).
Very rarely and on very few topics are people ever able to actually produce those "contradictory" scriptures. My breath is baited as you gather scriptures that contradict the ones I've provided in this thread.
My recent post Ask a Diva: A Man Can’t Love Us Like God Does, So Why Do We Still Want A Man’s Love?
We can go from topic to topic and pick out the flaws with the bible. Pastors would preach about them all the time and try to discount them, but a flaw is a flaw nonetheless. Sorry lol. Scientists and Historians have time and time again proven the Bible to be flawed.
And for this, the 80 times church is mentioned in the bible, almost every single time, it talks about a gathering of people, just like Matthew 18:20 ("For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them."). Or we can talk about where in the bible the words household/house are used….neither of those passages says a building designated as a church. A house of God can be seen as a house of a family of Christians (as a number of Christians will also say their house is a house of God).
And you're right. I think Majority of "Christians" practice Me-ism. But as long as they go along the cloak of Christianity, they shall be called Christians.
@LastofMyBreed, we can't go from topic to topic and pick out the flaws in the Bible because I don't argue with people over the rightness of the Bible. I know what I know and am completely satisfied. I leave revelation of truth to Christ and the Holy Spirit, it's not my job to convince you of anything.
And again, you haven't provided a single scripture that refutes any of the scriptures I cited above. Who ever said you had to be confined to a building to be in fellowship and worship of God with others? My friends and I have church every friday in Panera or Starbucks, and before it got cold, we had it in the park, or the sculpture garden, or one of the other smithsonian gardens. Don't put the limitations you've created for church on me. And again, if you can find a scripture that says you dont have to go to church, you dont have to serve the body of Christ, you dont have to pay your tithes, and you dont have to live like you actually believe that the Bible is the true and only word of God, there are more ways to God than through Christ, etc. I'd love to see those scriptures. (Hint: They don't exist! But enjoy the search! You might be blessed by it.)
And the Devil goes by many names, that doesn't change the fact that he's the devil. Matthew 7:16 "you shall know a tree by the fruit it bears," calling an apple a pear doesn't make it so.
My recent post Ask a Diva: A Man Can’t Love Us Like God Does, So Why Do We Still Want A Man’s Love?
DCDD, I can appreciate your zeal, but I think when Smilez says "that doesn’t mean your ideals will also fall in sync with each other" is what you're referring to as "small potatoes." I just think the example used wasn't the best, so I'll use another.
When going out to dinner, I occasionally will imbibe a glass of Ketel One on the rocks. Some church folks will flip out for allowing alcohol to touch my lips. It's what they believe, but one will have a very difficult time attempting to make a Biblical case that a Christian cannot drink in moderation. There are some things that are immutable and not up for interpretation, but some people blur the line between Christianity and churchianity and make a big deal out of the "small potatoes".
We all agree. We just have differing opinions on the size of the potato that officially makes it small.
Haha, Yes Hugh! Churchianity, indeed! And though you are absolutely correct, there is nothing unbiblical about drinking in moderation, the Bible speaks to this specific situation very clearly in Romans 14:14-17! "I know and am perfectly sure on the authority of the Lord Jesus that no food, in and of itself, is wrong to eat. But if someone believes it is wrong, then for that person it is wrong. 15 And if another Christian is distressed by what you eat, you are not acting in love if you eat it. Don't let your eating ruin someone for whom Christ died. 16 Then you will not be condemned for doing something you know is all right. 17 For the Kingdom of God is not a matter of what we eat or drink, but of living a life of goodness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit."
So if a person we're around doesn't like to drink and thinks drinking is a sin, well they are wrong, but God tells us to STOP DRINKING in front of that person so you don't distress them. The Bible is very clear that these small things — like what we eat and drink and what DAY we set aside for church (not WHETHER we attend) — do NOT matter and we shouldn't fight over them. But the fundamentals? That's worth fighting for and correcting folks when they are wrong (2 Timothy 4:2). There are very specific things that make a person a Christian — a follower of Christ — and its not just belief that He was a nice guy who deserves some respect and a nice place in history. Christianity is not a litany, it's a lifestyle.
@DCDD If everyone’s walk with Christ is different then it is to each its own. Your walk might take you to Church every Sunday, mines might take me to a quite park to read the word and talk to God one to one. Your walk might have you at every bake sale and bible study, mines might lead me into the life of a child/person that is looking for guidance and help.
If you love me, you will obey what I command." John 1:1 Again there is also a part in the bible that says God commands different things from each one of us, I’m sure something he might command from you on a higher level he might not command from your neighbor and vice versa.
Remember the relationship a person builds with God is their own, while they cant use it as an excuse to completely ignore the Gods wishes. But what might be important in you and God's relationship might not always be important in your husbands and God's one on one relationship. (Of course not huge issues but little potatoes)
DCDD i would love to have a conversation with you about some of the specifics of your comments. you seem to know the scripture very well and although i've read the Bible, i haven't attended a church i felt at "home" in, in months, and i have a few questions. do you mind if i email you? i'm sure i can find it on your site.
My recent post NYC: Fast Food and Old Fruit
Absolutely, Muze! And I can definitely relate to that feeling! So we can help each other. diva@dcdistrictdiva.com if you can't find it on the site!
My recent post Ask a Diva: A Man Can’t Love Us Like God Does, So Why Do We Still Want A Man’s Love?
awesome. thanks!
My recent post NYC: Fast Food and Old Fruit
DCDD: "there is nothing unbiblical about drinking in moderation, the Bible speaks to this specific situation very clearly in Romans 14:14-17!"
Agree wholeheartedly. Romans is one of my favorite books to read, so I'm well acquainted with your quote.
I would NEVER have a drink in front of someone I knew was struggling with alcoholism. It's just funny when some Christians find out that I like to have a drink once every month or two, and they go ham, as if that is primary, secondary or tertiary to being in the faith. It's pretty clear drinking isn't the sin, it's drunkenness that is. One can potentially make a stronger Biblical case that not drinking wine means you reject Jesus than one can make for drinking in moderation being a sin.
Again that's just one example, and again, it's small potatoes. That's why it's not a big deal that a woman is in 100% congruence with what I believe.
The first miracle Jesus performed was turning water into wine so the people at the wedding could continue to celebrate. If Jesus had a problem with an occassional "drink" he wouldn't have chosen this as his first miracle. Cheers! 🙂
And Jesus told the disciples to drink wine in rememberance of Him.
"some people blur the line between Christianity and churchianity"
WELLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!
*throws a wad in the offering plate*
You speak so definitively on the Bible, I wonder which denomination you adhere to.
@Malik, I speak definitively on it cause I read it and I know what it says. Also, I am non-denominational.
Very impressive my sista! I visited your blog and enjoyed it 🙂
DDD, I love and appreciate your comments, thanks so much for breaking down the difference between serving God and serving self, many ppl pick and choose what they want to believe because they want to serve themself, but the truth ois and will forever be the truth!
Good post & question…
I think I would move towards a break up.
I dont kno it sounds harsh but in the end we both are wasting each others time. I would luv to compromise, but that is a very hard pill to swallow. I knew a lady that was married to a guy that was “Christian” but didnt attend church. She would come to service alone..leaving him w/the kids sometimes. Sad ish… Thats not for me. Any guy that doesnt share my values isnt for me. Mayb another woman would luv a guy like that..she can have him! Cant my waste my time..
+1. I think it would be a hard pill for me to swallow as well. b/c I rank spiritually compatibility really high in the “could we actually work” category.
Quick story: A couple of weeks ago, I was talking with a older guy at my church (he was like 68-69 years old) and I asked him how he stayed married so long (his wife is a Jehovah’s witness). He told me that he married her not b/c of her religion (she was a christian when they married 50 yrs ago. But became a Jehovah’s witness 25 yrs later) but because he loved her unconditionally. He also told me that he was a fool at the time when she converted. So he couldn’t really say anything at the time b/c he really wasn’t serious in his walk with God.
Whoa deep! Same thing happened w/ my great aunt&uncle! Shes still JW after his death and though it is a different path she still very active & it helps her. Thats why “spiritual” ppl turn me off. Unless ur a friend, but if Im dating you then we got problems. Its happened b4 and I learned my lesson. Kind of like dating for fun, BUT u wanna get married. Why play games w/ a bootycall? You’re wasting time. Go find ur mate4life instead. I need someone that understands my luv for Jesus w/out questioning it every chance that he gets.. lol&smh
Oh and Tg..sorry for the rant! I got caught up lol 🙂
99.3%?!? That’s… a lot, lol.
Although I’ll opt out on this one, I wanted to say I really respect and appreciate this post being at SBM and I hope it generates a lively, enlightening, respectful discussion today!!
So do I.
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I am looking forward to reading this post. Ready to make some big moves…may go international much sooner than I thought.
I believe in God but I’m not in church all day everyday and my bible quoting skills aren’t up to par so, I really think it depends on how deep a person is in the religion. I know people who believe in God but have no set religion. I’m sure they might be a little more open than someone who is deep in the practice of their religion and has done so for years. My uncle is Muslim and my aunt converted to his religion. Sometimes couples grow into religion together, but if you know you can’t sleep at night knowing your partner believes but not like you I say you leave.
Lol I saw that article one time about the church keeping women single, the church and belief doesn’t keep them single, women believing that b/c now their saved that someone should just walk through their door is what is keeping them single, God will deliver the rain for the harvest but only once you plant the seeds and tend to the garden. Either that or they too busy sleeping with the pastor lol
"…church and belief doesn’t keep (women) single, women believing that b/c now their saved that someone should just walk through their door is what is keeping them single"
That just about sums up my thoughts on that article as well. Lol!
I guess I fit in the .7% of women who read this site. Although, I would say that though I don’t attend church regularly, my parents instilled a moral code in me and I pray daily. I believe in God, and it is important for me to date someone who at least has that going for them. Oddly enough, from the other end of the spectrum, I tend to go after men who are not hardcore Christians, in the sense that they need me to follow it as well. I come from a predominantly Christian family, so I respect and honor the values, but I don’t share all the beliefs, and I actually don’t want some to have to compromise or “tolerate” that. Because of my emphasis on spirituality vs. faith, I am comfortable dating men from a many faiths, as long as conversion doesn’t come with the package.
Just a quick moment of clarity, he said 99.3% sure that the majority is Black and Christian. Meaning 50% of more. He didn’t say 99.3% of the readers were Black and Christian.
"The love I have for you and these kids far exceeds any love in all of the churches of Rome" Knucky Thompson.
Your inability to comprehend someone else's point of view or live in peace with them is a failure on your part to understand the human condition. There is so much to love about my GF or even past GF, why would I ever let anything get in the way of that? I would laugh at a fool who said a Christian household is better than one with diversity and accommodation, or would call one said? Or even be so close minded they actually think that a home with diversity can't exist. Some people don't get it.. the world is a lot bigger than whatever it is you have in your mind. You guys are looking at love like Ikea furniture, you expect the holes to already be made for you, and you can insert this piece there (pause), but beautiful classic furniture, you have to cut the wood yourself and attach the piece and doors the old fashion way… to make stronger furniture that will last.
I agree with this post hands down. I rather a home where we can show our kids diversity and teach them acceptance than have my wife and I have everything in common/alike. And while the world is changing every day, the idea that everything will just fit into people’s lives and schedules at their “right time” is becoming more and more delusional.
“but beautiful classic furniture, you have to cut the wood yourself and attach the piece and doors the old fashion way… to make stronger furniture that will last. “
But you still need to start with the right wood. Starting out with the wrong wood is exactly what a relationship would be like for a person who is deeply rooted in their religion.
Diversity can work in a household but I think when it comes to STRONG (I would die for it) beliefs it becomes a hindrance.
Thou shall not Steal a pimp's analogy!
Problem is you think good wood means it has to be the SAME wood. You aren't taking the time to check out the different wood and see how strong it is. You just get all in a fit b/c it doesn't match.
I disagree. Diversity and acceptance for its own sake is not always a good thing. Especially when you are talking about core beliefs. When you believe something absolutely, there is no room for acceptance. Otherwise you dont really believe it. Diversity and tolerance might be popular and make people feel good, but if you are about something that is truth, anything that conflicts with it is wrong. Period. And standing by those beliefs is more important than avoiding offending others and trying to be open minded. Open mindedness is good for getting along with others, but it basically means you don’t believe anything. At least not strongly. Unless open mindedness (aka secular humanism) is your religion.
“Open mindedness is good for getting along with others, but it basically means you don’t believe anything. At least not strongly. Unless open mindedness (aka secular humanism) is your religion.”
Being open minded doesn’t mean you don’t have strong core beliefs that you value to the highest, it just mean you can look at others views and beliefs and try to understand where they are coming from. You can be a God fearing Christian but also allow your household to view how others live and believe and try to understand where their beliefs steam. Believing in something whole-heartedly doesn’t mean shutting everything else out of your perimeter.
As far as diversity goes even in Christianity there are so many denominations you could both be a wholehearted believer in Christ but he could be 7 days of Venus and you might be Baptist. Some acceptance, tolerance and diversity might have to come into play.
If you believe drinking alcohol is wrong, then its wrong. There is no room for well maybe that person who thinks its ok could be right, too. Their belief is wrong. You can keep your belief to yourself if you like. But if you believe some things are right and some things are wrong then you can’t accept other points of view. By definition.
Im not saying that you have to say they could be right. Im saying that being open minding is this
Person A: Drinking alcohol is wrong.
Person B: thinks it right and has explained why they feel this way"
Person A: " listens to them see what aspect their coming from, it does'nt change why Person A thinks, Drinking is wrong it just gives Person A insight into why Person B feels its right".
If I can just add onto your first sentence there. If you believe drinking alcohol is wrong, then its wrong….for you. Others can decide what is right for them. If this is what you were trying to say, I'm sorry for butting in but I had to put that in there to be more clear. And if this isn't what you were trying to say, I hope you don't take this as me putting words in your mouth. But that's how I feel about it. My spirituality and beliefs cannot dictate things in other people's lives. Otherwise, that would be forcing things on somebody and that is what causes division in my opinion.
Yes @krystllyght lol thats what I was trying to say as a whole I just dont like that being open minded=not having a strong solid core belief . Just b/c Im open to listening and understandig others does'nt mean Im going to part take in their lifestyle
Hitler had core beliefs… Klans men have core beliefs. What's the point of standing behind some misguided thought? Is it really right? Or does it make YOU feel better to deny the fact that you MAY be wrong? You aren't against open mindedness for the great good… you are about Cougar and projecting her thoughts out for the world. Its not righteous its self serving ego strokes.
Universal right and wrong are not defined by beliefs. As often as you, Wild Cougar, are wrong why in the world would you put the pressure of right and wrong into your beliefs?? For the sake of you being heard?
What the hayle are you babbling about?! I am talking about beliefs. In the abstract. Chill the fcuk out. How many dayum times do I have to repeat to the rational discourse challenged? It’s. Not. About. Me.
Awesome post. It definitely gives you something to think about. I’m more about faith than saying you have to go to church or I can’t look twice at you. I’ve a pastor’s kid (baptist) and the way i am today is much accredited to ny foundation. I believe that where I am today is because of God’s mercy and blessings on me. However I don’t focus on if you go to church; i kmow people who go to church everytime the doors open but exercise little faith. As I’ve gotten older, I dont to to church as often but I read my bible and have a healthy relationship with my God everyday. To me its jisy about being able to communicate, respecting each other levels of faith and hopefully being able to help each other be the person we can be.
If you are not equally yoked, it will be difficult. Your spirituality should be one of the most important things in your life so if you are not on the same page, it can and will cause problems in the long run. Not to say that you should not be their friend because they are different in their beliefs but being in a relationship and a friendship are two different things. How can a woman honor and follow her husband faithfully if his belief system is not like her own–already setting the union up for failure.
I have to disagree with this. More and more we hear stories of interfaith marriages that work. You're right that its not easy, but with divorce at about 50%, religion is far from being the main reason for it (money usually is). So the whole "setting the union up for failure" holds no weight.
It actually does set it up for failure if your spiritual walk is important enough to you. If your spiritual life isn't a top priority then it wouldn't matter and it wouldn't be a deal breaker.
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Really great post Slim!
This is a part of the dating scene that doesn’t get discussed often but is so important. I’m a Muslim woman and I’ll say its very difficult. Do you only get to know/date people that are of the same faith and are at the same spiritual point in their life? Many would say yes but when you meet someone that you have a great connection with and everything else is right but their spiritual path differs from yours its not easy to walk away. I’ve been in LTR with a Muslim man and a Christian man. I’ll say it was easier when I was with someone of my own faith b/c I was able to see a future (marriage, children, etc ) without the complication of how are we going to raise them, what about our families and the rest. I definitely accomodated and even compromised while in a LTR with someone of a different faith. I’ve seen inter-faith marriages work and also relationships with two people of the same faith but where one person is far more religious than the other. I always wonder if they sit well with the compromises that they’ve had to make in the end. I’m realizing more and more how important my faith is to me and so I do avoid those type of situations but it isn’t easy.
I read this thinking to myself, "this doesn't really sound like a Streetz post", before realizing Slim wrote it. Then I started getting happy for a second because I'm thinking it's Thursday instead of Wednesday. Way to get my hopes up guys!
"At the most basic level, your spiritual journey is exactly that: your spiritual journey. Nobody should be able to slow you down or make you suddenly veer off course to a different path, unless you’ve decided within yourself that it’s time to make a change."
This.
I've dated women of other religions or no religion when I was younger because they were eights or higher. My standards are a little higher now. She doesn't have to believe everything I believe about Christianity, but the Christianity has to be there. But what works for other people is cool with me. If she's agnostic and he's into Jediism and they are happy together, I'm happy for them.
LMMAAAOOO & then flatlining at "Jediism" …love it
My recent post Leaving things under the rocks….Some things are better left alone
It sounds like a joke, but it isn't. This illustrates the depths people go to attempting to fill the spiritual void.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jediism
Le damn!!! I can't. This was a new one for me today Hugh….I sincerely wasn't ready for that – and a real church? Yup …this got me together.
My recent post Leaving things under the rocks….Some things are better left alone
*stamps cosignage*
This is where I'm at. You don't have to "do" Christianity the way I do Christianity, but I do need a Christian and we need to be able to agree on what we will teach our children. But that's for my relationship, what everyone else does in their home is none of my business. I have several friends in "interfaith" relationships and they are difficult, but they adapt as they must, just like any other hurdle. I'm simply charged to love them, not "fix" them. Who says your way is the right way? Now that's some arrogance.
My faith has become much stronger this year. With that said, I know I can't date someone who is an atheist or agnostic. I am Christian and part of the 99.3% – woo hoo! But I try to be the type of women who can have a discussion on God, His principles and how He works in my life no matter who I am speaking with. I haven't met anyone lately who isn't Christian (ie Muslim or Jewish) in the dating scene. I would hope that it would be something that could be worked out. However, it's a matter of concern. There is always how to raise the children, if the other party expects you to convert, etc. So many things to think about. How to handle the household. Based upon my study of the Bible, God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit I just wonder when we became so closed minded to speaking with others or taking them into consideration? Unequally yoked? Possibly. But then I also wonder if a brother who was a pastor took to me, would he consider me unequally yoked because I am not in church every Sunday, choose to have a glass (or three) of wine and curse. I am a true believer in the Son of God, however, people tend to judge another's faith from the outside.
I have a preference for a brother who is Christian. I would speak with a brother who is Muslim, but often people are trying to convert you one way or another. BTW, has anyone seen American Muslim? It's good. This one man converts to Islam in order to be able to marry his wife. I don't see me doing this, but more power to him for it.
Love the post. God bless y'all. With your success, I should have known God was up and through here.
My recent post Leaving things under the rocks….Some things are better left alone
May I ask why you wouldn't date an atheist or agnostic person?
Sure!! You know, I really believe in God, the presence of Someone or Something that is much bigger than we are. I will reference this often. NOt in a holy roller, super-saved sort of way but in a way of how I think the things that God has created are amazing. Or in prayer. Or grace or just daily life. While I respect the free will and ability not to believe in anything or believe that God may or may not exist (but the person isn't sold), I find it difficult for us as a couple to relate. I believe there will be grounds for a disagreement. I mean, if I need this person to pray with me and believe with me (for my personal issues) then how does this happen? They don't believe. I reference God, often, and I don't want someone looking at me like I'm crazy all of the time either if I want to study the Bible, go to church or watch a sermon online or pray. What about moral code? Not to say someone who doesn't believe in God can't be moral, I just wonder how the person decides what's right, what's wrong? How to handle life? A disagreement? Are they accountable to anyone?
So, while I may consider someone of another faith, I don't want someone who judges me as a person or my rationale all of the time because I have faith in God. Again, I respect people who don't believe God exists or don't confirm or deny. It's their right and their choice. We could be friends but I think I would secretly always want them to have a conversion experience and become a believer. And that's not fair to that person either.
My recent post Leaving things under the rocks….Some things are better left alone
Thanks for replying! I always like to hear the point of view from women who will not date a man that is athiest or agnostic. When it comes to dating, being a non-religious person definitely has its drawbacks (especially if you only date black women). The usual response I get is that they assume since I'm not religious, I must be without morals. This is really odd to me, but I understand why. Atheist means without God, not without ethics and I think a lot of people confuse this because ethics are interrelated to the other aspects of religion.
The metaphysical aspect that explains what things are, where they come from, what man is, what God is, and the properties of God. The ethical aspect which explains how to behave in life in a moral way. The inspirational aspect that provides strength and comfort and supplies the inspiration to follow the moral views. The inspiration is powerful because one feels they are working the will of God, one is for God, partly one is with God. ( part 1)
Part 2
Often, people think that to not believe in the metaphysical or inspirational aspect of religion is not to believe in the ethical side. I disagree because It’s possible to have a strong moral compass without the metaphysical or inspirational aspects of religion. Non religious people donate to charities, give blood, feed the homeless, don’t steal from people, or kill people like religious folks do. I cant speak for all non religious people, but the ethical aspect of religion is universal. The inspirational aspect is understandable so I don’t think you would find a lot of non religious people "looking at you crazy" for needing to be active in your religion.
"It’s possible to have a strong moral compass without the metaphysical or inspirational aspects of religion."
This is why I can empathize with the nonbeliever. You don't need God to be a moral person by our societal standards. The average nonbeliever is a good, moral person in this regard. It's unfortunate that they are sometimes vilified and excluded by society due to lack of faith.
God, on the other hand, could care less about our current, ever-mutating societal standards, which was different 50 years ago and surely will be different 50 years from now. The nonbeliever is “good” by our standard, just not by the eternal standard (which is the only one that ultimately matters). But I don't believe the nonbeliever should be considered a lower class citizen because of their nonbeliefs, and I can understand the frustration of being a minority marginally accepted by the majority.
I would like to pose a question to you. I assume you believe in the omnipotence of God. Do you believe its possible for him ( or her) to understand why some would choose not to believe?
I'm not going to point out worldly factors such as sensless death and pain but a question of our significance. The earth is a particle that floats around a sun which is apart of one hundred thousand million suns in a galaxy that is among billions in a universe. Do you think that is just a back drop to our existence? That our recent existence ( and I mean recent) actually matters in the grand scheme of things?
(1/2)
litebriteguy: "Do you believe its possible for him ( or her) to understand why some would choose not to believe? The earth is a particle that floats around a sun which is apart of one hundred thousand million suns in a galaxy that is among billions in a universe. Do you think that…our recent existence ( and I mean recent) actually matters in the grand scheme of things?"
Uh-oh, someone is trying to tap into my mind and the esoteric and idiosyncratic ponderings floating around in there!
My opinion: I'm sure He understands nonbelief, but doesn't care. He didn't say it would be easy or obvious, but He also gave everyone a measure of faith. There's enough evidence for God for that faith to grow, and the invisible things of God are "clearly seen", so as it is written, we are without excuse. Those that don't acknowledge Him and aren't willing to serve Him are simply of no use to Him and will be discarded. After all, it's our pride and unwillingness to submit to Him that caused our separation in the first place.
(2/3, stupid word count)
As far as the vastness of the universe, according to the anthropic principle, we are in a special place in that vastness. Who knows: given that God appears to be filtering out those He can use, perhaps in the next life we will be angels to watch over a new civilization He starts in some other "particle" in the universe. Given all of Jesus' parables about us being servants proving our worth and separating the wheat from the chaff, I don't think those that are saved are going to be sitting around on clouds playing harps and singing hymns. I think He has more work for us to do.
(3/3)
The thing is I rarely see people argue the converse of the vast universe argument. If we are a random, insignificant speck on a particle that floats around one of billions of suns out of billions of galaxies in the universe and our existence matters in the grand scheme of things, how does anything we do matter? Why hold life to be precious? Your life doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things, so why shouldn't one end your life if it is of benefit to them? Nothing we do matters because we are nothing but meaningless dots in the vastness of the universe. Where does our worth and value come from?
Your value comes from your interaction with me (pause) and how we relate and communicate with each other. You are precious to those who hold you precious and cherish your existence and your responsibilty remains with those you have interacted with and effected through your actions. The scheme is very grand, it is quite difficult to matter individually to the grand scheme. You have to accomplish something of note.
I don't consider any of these statements to be exclusive, so even if I am wrong
which I am notthese statements could peacefully co-exist within any Christian/buddhist/voodoo theology.CHeeKZ: "I don't consider any of these statements to be exclusive, so even if I am wrong
which I am notthese statements could peacefully co-exist within any Christian/buddhist/voodoo theology."Of course it could. Could, implying possibilty. But value is subjective. You are precious to those that hold you precious, but what about the people that haven't interacted with you and don't give a damn about you? Which is the vast majority of human beings alive?
What is the objective value of life? So what if you die? So what if you and 100 of your closest friends and family die? That's only 1/70,000,000 (.00000001) of the humans on Earth, and we can just go ahead and round that to zero. As litebriteguy pointed out, you're an insignificant speck on an insignficant planet. And that is the cold, hard, mathematical and logical truth.
Not arguing. At all.
I co-sign all of that
Disclaimer: I am not trying to attack or disprove your views:
Why would a benevolent, all powerful, omnipotent God need a human being to do anything? He (she or it) created the universe and everything in it, so what can we possibly be used for? What can we do, that God cant do? Why does this same being need to be worshipped, prayed to, given human sacrifices, believed in, or served. Your kind of making it seem as if God has a weak ego and needs external validation. I dont want to go too far with the questions ( which are rhetorical, but I think you can see where I am going.
I don't think you are attacking my views whatsoever. I don't think people asking tough questions that they honestly want answers to is an attack.
Again, my opinion: God is love and we are created to return the love and give Him glory. He certainly doesn't need us for anything; we are told if we didn't give Him that love and glory back, He'd make the rocks cry out for Him. But for whatever reason, He loves us and wants our love in return.
Weak ego? Well, when asked the same question, Homer Simpson said He was insecure. But I see it wanting love. Look at it this way: why does a couple have children? What can a child do for a parent that the parent cannot do for themselves? Someone last week (I don't remember who, maybe Wild Cougar?) said having your own children is selfish. So why have your own kids?
Hugh my brother, I think we are going to have to agree to disagree. Nice dialogue nevertheless.
Love is an emotion. An emotion like fear, anger, sympathy, and sadness. Since antiquity, people have placed human characteristics on deities and modern Christianity is not an exception. One would think that an all-powerful omnipotent being would not share human short comings.
If God can show love, he should also be able to show sympathy as well. Where is the sympathy for East African infants that are starving to death, which is one of the worst forms of death possible. Are they not God's children? What did they do to deserve their fate?
I wont go into the anti-natalism discussion, but I do believe having children is inherently selfish.
"Hugh my brother, I think we are going to have to agree to disagree. Nice dialogue nevertheless."
It's cool. I didn't expect for us to agree or change each other's mind. It's cool to have the conversation without people getting bent out of shape.
"Love is an emotion. An emotion like fear, anger, sympathy, and sadness. Since antiquity, people have placed human characteristics on deities and modern Christianity is not an exception. One would think that an all-powerful omnipotent being would not share human short comings."
I'm not sure love is a shortcoming, but you're on point here. Although I see a difference between the petty and capricious way many gods are described, and the genuine way the Christian God is presented as a Creator and moral authority. Of course, your mileage may vary.
"If God can show love, he should also be able to show sympathy as well. Where is the sympathy for East African infants that are starving to death…Are they not God's children?"
The problem of evil is a problem for many, but it doesn't state anywhere in the Bible that there isn't suffering in the world. This is understandably a sticking point for a lot of people. Just note that there was no starvation in the Garden of Eden and there won't be any in heaven. It is only in this world that God gave to us, the world that we messed up, where these issues occur.
Some see starving children and ask how God can allow it to happen. I see Jesus' divine command to go feed and clothe the poor, and observe Christians doing their best to send food, dig wells and give them potable water, etc. Jesus said the poor will always be with us, but also gave the warning when we ignore them, we ignore Him. It is interesting to note that countries with corrupt, godles leaders tend to have societies where millions starve. This is all done because of the leaders and their "vision", while ignoring the "beginning of wisdom".
For some reason, my comment posted, then disappeared. That is why I normally type my responses in Notepad, then copy and paste. The one time I don't, the site loses my comment. Anyway…
Again, this is my opinion: God does it because He is love and needs to be loved in return. He doesn't need us, and said He'd make the rocks cry out ot us if we didn't love Him and give Him glory. But to be loved, the other party has to have the option NOT to love you. So we have a choice.
Why does God need to be worshipped? The same reason we as humans want to be told we are loved and appreciated by the ones that love us. Is that a weak ego? When asked the same question, Homer Simpson said it God was insecure. But I call it wanting to be loved in return.
Put it this way: why would a husband and wife have a child? What can the child do that the parents can't? What can the child give the parents that they can't get for themselves?
I enjoy reading your comments. You have so much wisdom my brotha! It's inspiring 🙂
Thanks for the compliment. And it appears my lost comment decided to resurrect itself.
All points taken. And you're right – non-believers (I won't use religious because although I believe in God I associate the term 'religious' in a negative way – that the belief or the moniker is more important than God [pick your faith] or the body of believers) have profoundly changed the world. A (wo)man doesn't have to have faith or belief in God in order to make a positive impact on the world as we know it or do good things. I often wonder though, as I mentioned before, where is the moral code drawn from? I mean, I do think there is probably a set of universal rules we can all play by. I think some of them are inherent. I also know there are people who are "believers" who do unspeakable things. Again, since I've never dated a person who is agnostic or an atheist, I cannot speak about how these things would be ironed out. I am speaking of my experience with those on message boards, or in groups, who will attempt any and everything to denounce what I believe in. So if a brother comes to me and I find him attractive and vice versa, I assume we go on a date and I find out he's a non-believer. Would I be upset? Yes. But then I'm in a pickle because if I like him, maybe I want to get to know him more. So how do we work out everything else? That's all I'm saying. Not saying it can't be done. Just saying it's one of those things I am not sure how to work through in a romantic relationship.
I don't shun people because they don't believe. I hope it doesn't come across as that. To my knowledge, most of my friends have some sort of spiritual practice. Be it Christianity to metaphysical practices.
I also wonder, how is it that people come to this conclusion of no God? I understand people who lose their faith and their way. Why is it you don't believe? Would you date a woman who is practicing a faith? Would it matter her faith?
My recent post Leaving things under the rocks….Some things are better left alone
Why is it you don't believe?
I can't speak for all non believers but my transition came with self reflection and curiousity. The main issue for me, at least at first, was human suffering. An omnipotent being has, by virtue of that omnipotence, the opportunity to create any logically possible world; so, he could have created a world in which his ultimate plan for creation would be realized without the need of innocent suffering, or at least one in which only non-innocents suffer.
Would you date a woman who is practicing a faith? Would it matter her faith?
Absolutely. In my experience, the women who asked about my beliefs later in the relationship accepted it better than the ones who asked earlier. It doesn't matter to me what faith my lady has, so much that she respects my beliefs. As I said in reply to your post, I understand the importance of religion, so I would never judge her for it. In the aspect of raising children, I would actually let her choose the religion of our child. The issue is not of religion, but one of social acceptance for the child. It's hard enough to be accepted by adults when you dont believe in a higher power, so I can't imagine how it would be as a kid. Being a minority is already a superficial barrier without adding an absence of religion.
I don't want to beat you over the ahead with the proverbial atheist dck…. headed comment.
However I just read your reasons seem kinda like insecurity. You don't want to deal with the pressure of having a non believer that close to you, so you wouldn't date one. You are looking for sometype of relationship insurance from a man that has faith. But at the end of the day the believer and the Bawse Atheist still have free will to act a fool.
Don't mean to attack your thoughts, they were actually well written.
Ha ha!!! It could very well appear to be insecurity. Thank you for the comment and the props.
I agree that whether you are a believer of a Bawse Atheist (<<<love that by the way) then yes, everyone has room and license to act a damn nut. A man who believes in God can still treat a woman poorly. Not saying it can't happen. In fact, I see a lot of Christians act a fool. I am sure people think I act a fool and would refer me back to my Maker to tell me I should more so follow those principles that are laid out. I am a work in progress.
All I'm saying is that when things happen and life is taking a certain downward spiral, I sure would like to have someone who can pray with me and believe for me when my faith is low and I'm unsure. Someone to encourage me. Just because I am Christian and a believer doesn't mean I don't have the days when I question God, have issues and realize my faith may be rocky. Insecure? Possibly. But I'm willing to stand with it.
I will also add, I have definitely been emotionally rescued by people who don't believe and treated lovely by some friends who are agnostic (just thought of a couple). But since I haven't dated one, I can't speak to how to handle those intimate hours spent together. Not that I may not love a person. It's maybe I just don't know how to navigate certain turns in the road with them or how they will navigate it with me.
My recent post Leaving things under the rocks….Some things are better left alone
"I have definitely been emotionally rescued by people who don't believe and treated lovely by some friends who are agnostic (just thought of a couple). But since I haven't dated one, I can't speak to how to handle those intimate hours "
I take this as a clear sign from god that you need to sleep with some of your agnostic friends. immediately.
LMBO!!! Damn you CHeeKZ! Ha ha….I probably already have and never really ended up in the discussion on what they believed. It probably didn't matter at the time anyway because what we were doing was surely not right…LOL! Just sayn!
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Personally, I don’t think two people who have actually read the bible are going to come to the same exact conclusion. As long as what both of us believe doesn’t directly conflict, I wouldn’t have a problem with it. I’d actually have more respect for someone who has actually formed their own opinion and is solid in their beliefs than someone who just believes what they are told to believe….but maybe that’s just me.
"I don't think two people who have actually read the bible are going to come to the same exact conclusion."
I agree. Sometimes, depending on what I'm going through, I don't even come to the exact same conclusion over certain passages. We should remember that everybody has their own life experiences that come into play when they are interpreting the Word.
I realize that my beliefs or dis-beliefs severely limit the choices that I have in a mate. Most women, specifically black, or Christian. As of late, I've seen a lot of agnostics/free thinkers/agnostics but they are still in relatively small numbers and not quite distributed evenly throughout. Even without religion, many say "Spiritual" which IMHO is damn near the same as Chrisitianity (don't jump on me, just drawing from experience).
O have had women who wanted a relationship and looked past my status (I guess it made for good conversation) but it never panned out. I can't say that my beliefs were the reason, but usually when asked "do you go to church/believe in God" even if you are saying this to the most open minded person, they will heavily judge you or think less of you if you say no. With that said, I will probably be solo rollo for sometime but it's not anything that bothers me.
I had a strong interest in a Muslim, while I am a Christian (raised Baptist). My knee jerk reaction to some of the female issues is a bit unpleasant, but I don't have a strong understanding of the Muslim faith, and I know many supposed Muslims who don't practice the more egregious (in my opinion) practices towards women, including the dude I crushed on. I didn't find it to be that much of a problem, because I'm open to many faiths and was curious about Ramadan, and they have a singular higher power, similar to Christianity, that makes it easier to relate to. But he wasn't big on celebrating Western holidays. That makes sense, of course, but that was/is a BIG part of my family and I am most certainly looking forward to passing those traditions down to a family of my own. Seriously, recreating the almost idyllic holidays of my lifetime are something I really look forward to doing.
Another person was a Christian like me, but didn't celebrate holidays for more socially militant reasons, because he feels they've been distorted by American greed and commercialism. He would be around during celebrations but really would only be doing it for me (or whoever he ends up with, because it's not me, LOL), rather than enjoyment. While I get his point, I also think the holidays are what you make them. Some make it about gratuitous presents and Black Friday sales, and some, like me, think of it as a time to listen to Christmas music, be together with family, deck the halls and trim the tree in a seasonal fashion and share an amazing moment of warmth and cheer, that sometimes includes going to church (we've been a bit lax about this recently). Anyway, I would prefer someone with my same enthusiasm about passing on these traditions.
So yeah, I think religion is important, and if you're different religions, openness to each others' religions is important, with a willingness to celebrate both with equal enthusiasm, hoping to ingrain each faith's values in your children, because that's a big part of what religion is about.
Dangit! It posted twice! Sorry, people. It tells me it doesn't post so I post again and…well you get the drift.
I used to be very religious and I used to be married. My husband was catholic, but not devout. I was Protestant, but not devout. And I thought that was good enough. It wasnt. The issue of accountability became central. If the person does not really believe they are accountable for their actions to a higher power, when we disagree how is the issue resolved. There is no judge or outside control of that persons actions. No rule book. You can have two Christians going to the same church every Sunday, believing the same things, but still doing their own thing. If there is no fear of God and no intimate relationship with God, I think you will have problems no matter what you say you believe.
Very good point re: accountability. I just mentioned that in a response above. A person has to have a moral code, be accountable, have a way or a set of rules to govern their life.
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Yeah, I just read that, looks like we were thinking the same thing at the same time, lol
honestly though, you don't *have* to be spiritual/religious to have a moral code or accountability. i'm Christian and i dated an agnostic/borderline atheist before, which i'd never do again, but not for a lack of a moral code. he actually was the most morally sound man in behavior and belief than any other man i've dated. it was quite confusing. what some Christians claim to believe about treating other people, walking in Love, etc, he was in plain act, like above and beyond the norm at that.
still though, his lack of any type of faith was a big issue for me.
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Thank you for clarifying that just because we don't believe in an invisible know-all-see-all entity doesn't mean that we are devoid of a moral code. Respecting others, caring for others, giving of self were all taught to me by my parents. Mind you, I only went to church a few times a year but never had a desire to do so. So while I don't go around shouting Hallelujah after someone says something semi-profound, I do know my place in the world and how to treat others accordingly. Accountability doesn't have to come from the mystical spectre above either.
I have some questions because I am sincerely interested? Where did your moral code come from? HOW did you know what was right from wrong? HOW did your parents? If it's already within you, do you think that's just due to evolution?
so Muze if he was such a morally sound man and you had a good experience with him in that respect why wouldn't you date another Atheist or Agnostic again? Just curious.
"If there is no fear of God and no intimate relationship with God, I think you will have problems no matter what you say you believe. "
GREAT MESSAGE!
Great post! And, although I intend to ride the bench with Chunk for the most part today, lol…I will say a lil sumthin…
Experience is the best teacher. What I learned the hard way is that sold-out Christian God-fearing men lie, cheat, are lazy, always looking to get over, and some more stuff…as do men of all faiths or no faith. And the fact that they do it while believing in Jesus doesn't make it any better.
At this point in my Christian faith and walk, I cannot date someone who does not believe in God or doesn't respect my faith and walk to the utmost. I'd never accommodate to the degree that I create a stumbling block for myself. Aside from that, I leave that person's spiritual growth and development to their God and I live a Christian life before them as a testimony. It is more important to me that a person has a strong moral code and is a person of good character and integrity…which is Godly/Christ-like whether they acknowledge it as such or not. We also must prioritize our values very similarly…which is not guaranteed by practicing the same religion. I know several combos of couples that have worked and failed. To each, his own.
I was interested in a Muslim, while I am a Christian. I didn't find it to be that much of a problem, but he wasn't big on celebrating Western holidays. That makes sense, but that was/is a BIG part of my family and I am most certainly looking forward to passing those traditions down to a family of my own.
Another person was a Christian like me, but didn't celebrate holidays for more socially militant reasons, because he feels they've been distorted by American greed and commercialism. While I get his point, I also think the holidays are what you make them. Some make it about gratuitous presents and Black Friday sales, and some, like me, think of it as a time to listen to Christmas music, be together with family, deck the halls and trim the tree in a seasonal fashion and share an amazing moment of warmth and cheer, that sometimes includes going to church (we've been a bit lax about this recently).
So religion is important, and if you're different religions, openness to each others' religions is important, with a willingness to celebrate both with equal enthusiasm, hoping to ingrain each faith's values in your children, because that's a big part of what religion is about.
I guess my post for moderated. Not sure why, but interesting topic. 🙂
I just went in and approved it. You good!
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Pause.
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Thank! What's the pause about? LOL.
My beliefs are more "fluid" than others because of my upbringing and experiences. I consider myself a Christian but I do believe that there are many different Christians. Christianity is just as much about culture as religion. My family in Methodist/Church of England and so growing up I was not exposed much to Baptist or other more lively forms of church that many black people think of when they practice their faith. That can be frustrating because sometime you feel like if you don't worship in XYZ way and believe ABC stuff, you don't make the cut in many people's eyes.
I want someone who is on my spiritual level. And yes I do believe in spiritual levels because at any point you can find people who want to judge you on your faith and beliefs whatever they may be, based on what their notion of a Christian is. People could judge me on the way I pray, how I interpret parts of the bible, etc. I would never judge my partner on how he practices his faith so if someone is doing the same to me it may be time to end things.
And if the situation we're working I could possible marry a jew/muslim/hindu/etc
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Yes!
This is a great post Slimmy Slim and I find myself on the fence about it. We're both Christians but were raised in different denominations. He, African Methodist Episcopal, and I, Missionary Baptist. To be quite honest, I'm not really sure what the missionary part has to do with it but it's in the church name so whatever. I really doubt it but I wonder if these separate denominations make any difference with the way we believe and perceive things. When we moved here, he was really adamant about finding an AME church and I just didn't see the big deal as long as we were being spiritually fed. Anyway, we do believe different things on some issues like gay marriage, abortion and alcohol consumption. We have these differences but I don't think they are meant to create more division between the two of us. (1/2)
(2/2) I think they can and should bring us closer together. I don't know everything there is to know about Christ (or anything) but I can't help but think that maybe my husband was placed in my life to help lead me where I need to be and I the same for him. On the other hand, we are human and even the smallest things can create division in our lives and I don't think God wants us to live in division and the stress that it causes. If you're doing what you should be doing by surrounding yourself with like-minded people, you will find somebody that believes all the same as you do and this will never be a problem. I think that is ideal though a little unrealistic but then there I go placing limits and that's not right either.
Thanks for this post slim!! I've been lurking around this site for over a year (first time commenting) now and always wondered when someone was going to add God into the equation.
My mother told me recently that her biggest mistake in life was leaving God for a man. I've always viewed my mother as a true believer who walks radically in her faith, which is why her comment put me off. But I realize now that she meant that she let a man distract her from what God had commission for her to do (draw closer to him amongst other things of course)… because she was dealing with dudes who didn't seek God.
This is why it's so important for me to ensure that the man I am with is seeking the same connection (with God), no matter how they decide to do it. To ensure that we both are searching for the same thing and are able to encourage each other to push forward despite it all. When you date someone who is not feeding their spirit daily (doesn't always mean going to church) it's very difficult for them to do that for anyone else. The best connection I felt with a dude was the one where I felt comfortable discussing God in a very authentic way. It's hard to have those conversations with folks who are not as in it as you are, but not impossible.
I've dated dudes before who were believers but didn't necessarily do much to enhance their spiritual selves. I always give them a fair shot but when I can't inspire them to get on my level or when they are not ready to deal with themselves on a more spiritual/emotional level I have to make the hard decision and bounce.
I am a Christian woman but I also draw from Eastern notions of spirituality…at least in terms of philosophy and lifestyle practices. I think that it has enhanced my relationship with God but that’s just me. My man is Rasta. Are there differences between us spiritually…sure there are but there are also common threads…it is those threads that bring us together. The differences are just what they are…differences. Now having children can possibly present some challenges because at that point you are now responsible for establishing the foundation of someone else’s budding spirituality.
Differing spiritual beliefs rarely seems to be the major problem with couples it seems…to me it seems to be all of the other sh*t that ppl tend to drag into their current relationships like trust issues and chronic dissatistion.
Great post. I have read most of the comments, but couldn’t get through all.
Whenever I think about this topic, I think about my aunt and uncle who grew as Christians together. I can remember a time in their marriage when church and serving God wasn’t the main priority in their lives. For me, I know who I believe in and what I believe. But to expect or dismiss someone because they aren’t exactly where I am today feels contradictory to my beliefs and values. Someone alluded to this but, but our walks as Christians aren’t lock step point a leads to point b experiences. Just like anything else, what we do and how we view and experience and practice aspects our faith and religion (note the separation) will evolve and change over time. My aunt and uncle have grown together. But they allowed each to grow individually, too. I just feel some kinda way about dismissing a potentially great man or relationship because he isn’t where I am. Lord knows I have a lot left to get right, so if the foundation is there and he is open to going to church more, etc., and he fits the bill otherwise, it’s worth the chance.
I like this. For me to think that the man has to be where I am is a little dramatic. I'm not even where I'm supposed to be in my walk so either I'm limiting him or I'm pressuring him in an area that does not respond well to such pressure. Nagging is already bad but if I'm nagging about Christ and His place in your life, well that seems a bit absurd. You're supposed to come to Him on your own volition. I'm not the best at quoting the Bible but isn't there a passage in there that says the husband may be a non-believer and the wife a believer. The husband will see how his wife is living and choose to follow as well. Not everybody enters into a relationship in perfect form in many ways and isn't Christianity a lifelong journey?
Amen.
#SWIDT
😉
Exactly Krystllyght. As the quote goes, "A woman's heart should be so hidden in Christ that a man should have to seek Him first to find her." This can apply to men and women. If this is the case then you will only attract people who are like-minded believers and on the same walk and journey as you.
I also like your point about how many of us (myself included) are not where we should be in our "Christian Walk."
Not a good look to preach to someone on religion and spirituality when your not practicing what you preach and following "the word" yourself.
and yes krystl you are right about that scripture…1st Corinthians 7:14, "For the unbelieving husband is set apart as holy to God on account of [his relationship with] the [believing] wife, and the unbelieving wife is set apart as holy to God on account of [her relationship with] the [believing] brother. For otherwise [hypothetically, i.e., without this principle of sanctification in the believer] your children are unclean, but as it is in reality, they are holy."
Paul assures us here that in the case of marriage, the believer is "the salt", and makes the entire union, including the offspring from it, "holy" in God's eyes (Lev.2:13). Along with the believer, the marriage, the unbelieving spouse, and their children are all "set apart to God" for the special protection and oversight that falls to the lot of believers. This does not mean that the unbelieving husband, and children) are automatically saved, but it does mean that they are treated by God as belonging to the believing spouse, falling under that spouse's "umbrella" of blessings and protection.
I learned that from a sermon my former pastor preached many years ago.
I really love your comment and I agree. We have to be able to have a common point but I wouldn't expect him to be where I am. Likewise, I could end up with someone who's much farther ahead in his spiritual journey, so I would hope he could see the goodness in me and be willing to work with me if he found that I was that special to him.
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I’ve been in this situation before and walked away. I don’t think there is anything wrong with interfaith dating for OTHER folks. As Christians we live IN the world but we are not OF the world. It won't work for SOME Christians. And I say some because u got ur pew sitters (Sunday attendees only), your bible thumpers (7 day a week Attendees), and those in between. I'm in between. I attend church every Sunday unless I'm out of town or sick and I am involved in ministry. I want to sit next to my husband at church. I don't want to have to argue with him about paying my tithes. I want to raise my children as Christians giving them the opportunity to choose Jesus as their savior when they understand what that means. Submitting to a husband who isn't on that same path is detrimental to my spiritual journey. If he goes to church every Sunday but doesn't feel the need to join a ministry but he does community service or gives back in some way I date him. If he does enjoy a glass of wine or a beer socially but he is saved I date him. Money (Tithing), Sex (Is he willing to wait?), Jesus (Thinks Jesus was just some dude) these are the BIGGER issues that come with interfaith dating.
I can definity dig it.
I always like to hear the point of view from women who will not date a man that is athiest or agnostic. When it comes to dating, being a non-religious person definitely has its drawbacks (especially if you only date black women). The usual response I get is that they assume since I'm not religious, I must be without morals. This is really odd to me, but I understand why. Atheist means without God, not without ethics and I think a lot of people confuse this because ethics are interrelated to the other aspects of religion.
The metaphysical aspect that explains what things are, where they come from, what man is, what God is, and the properties of God. The ethical aspect which explains how to behave in life in a moral way. The inspirational aspect that provides strength and comfort and supplies the inspiration to follow the moral views. The inspiration is powerful because one feels they are working the will of God, one is for God, partly one is with God. ( part 1)
Part 2
Often, people think that to not believe in the metaphysical or inspirational aspect of religion is not to believe in the ethical side. I disagree because It’s possible to have a strong moral compass without the metaphysical or inspirational aspects of religion. Non religious people donate to charities, give blood, feed the homeless, don’t steal from people, or kill people like religious folks do. I cant speak for all non religious people, but the ethical aspect of religion is universal. The inspirational aspect is understandable so I don’t think you would find a lot of non religious people "looking at you crazy" for needing to be active in your religion.
Non-Religious people let you breath. I never get baited into discussions about Jesus. People don't approach me in supermarkets saying "Did you know there is no God?" I very rarely hear non-believers initiate any conversation of the sort (unless on a website in which he is usually severely outnumbered and given thumbs down).
I guess you’re not on twitter much….lol
Nah…I don't hold much interest in Twitter.
Errrrrrra… I'd have to disagree with that. I find more times than not when people find out I'm Christian I have to defend who and what that means to Non- Religious people. Some people think Christian is synonymous with Judgemental/Hypocritical so they assume you feel all these ways about them before you've gotten past "Hey sorry I missed your call I was in church". I try not to even engage in some conversations with folks that go there. If you don't believe hey thats cool I respect it but please don't try to talk me out of what I believe as you'd be wasting your breath…. On the flip side I don't like folks knockin on my door at 7am on a Saturday or stopping me on the subway during rush hour to ask me if I know God just as much as the next guy. There are extremes for both sides and I've come across a fair amount of both walking the streets of NYC. I can't speak for any other area.
My experience is different I guess. Usually it is me that gets engaged and asked to explain "where I stand." I'm in D.C…and I very seldom meet anyone with the same beliefs as me (again…more black folks therefore mostly chrisitanity and on the rise Islam).
I've been to DC a couple times but not enough to comment on the difference in faith. But NYC is very diverse and around this time of year it is prevalent to discuss if Jesus really IS the reason for the season. Like really can I just say Merry Christmas without having to be bombarded with a whole lot of nonsense? Atheist organizations usually put up a lot of billboards around this time of year as well. I'm not with it. Believe in who you want to believe we can be friends… but I'm not dating you. For some who aren't really into faith they don't see the big deal in dating other folks but to me that right there is an idnication that we shouldn't be dating because you don't even understand that issues come with that. I live by a different standard and if you aren't we will have issues that can and will erode our relationship.
I see nothing but anti Christian attacks online. Never anti atheist or agnostic. People go overboard (comparing folks to Hitler and the KKK?!). I wonder where all the anger and hate comes from. They get personal with it. It’s basically bigotry and intolerance from the people who preach tolerance. Example: the way people are going after Tebow because he prays. Its nasty and ignorant.
very well-written and thorough post, Slimness.
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Good question slim…I’ve always tried to live my life, and show my walk, with one passage from the bible (matt 22:36-40). That being said..id be hesitant to get with a woman who doesn’t believe, but at the same time, id be hesitant to pursue a super holy roller type. I acknowledge the fact that everyones spiritual walk is personal, and lack of a belief doesn’t mean lack of morals. But I would wonder if we would be willing to relate, especially if I am to be the head.
But as someone else said…experience and living..can change our p.o.v. on many things.
I feel as long as a person is actually practicing what they know and believe is key. There are many that CLAIM to be religious and/or spiritual and their lives don't line up with it. For me, I wasn't long into my adulthood when I decided to start living righteously. Yes it's been obstacles and tribulations, however…from those I learned that faith fixes everything. Even it the fixing doesn't coincide with what I may want.
I have seen what living according to my own accord has gotten me. I made ill decisions when I didn't put Allah FIRST before making my choices. Now I make it a point to do that, and it saves me unnecessary drama. I don't walk around preaching, but I do share life lessons that I have learned on my spiritual journey. My husband I are KNOW that there is only one God and that is Allah and he knew nothing of Allah when we first met, so that in itself is a testimony for us. I took a chance with him since he wasn't Muslim at first, however with the things that have happened, he had no choice to but to recognize.
I grew up a Christian. Since I like to study, learning about everything led me directly to where I am now. I appreciate having knowledge of things and that in itself allowed me to make an INFORMED choice. I could have just continued to believe what my family passed down. It's crazy because most most people that believe in Jesus, get stumped on some things I show them in a Bible they should know…but I digress. I just say, if you really say you are something, you should at least study from front to back the book you say you believe in.
I respect others religion/spiritually…just don't half step when discussing it with me…cause I come ARMED with knowledge that is irrefutable…and lots of it at that.
Alhumdulillah. Wonderfully said sister. I think coming from Christian backgrounds and educating ourselves about the Bible, then going further to seek more answers in the world and finding Islam makes us even more armed than anyone else. We have the knowledge of what is in our religion and what is outside of it.
P.S. I love having/knowing knowledge that is irrefutable. Makes conversations on religion with people a lot more fun lol
hmmmm….interesting. I am a Nichiren Buddhist and I've dated them all. I'm pretty open minded when it comes to people's belief systems. Just don't try to convert me because that is not happening. A 7 day Adventist and I talked about marriage. But he couldn't compromise. He wanted to get married in a church and I couldn't bring myself to do it. I wasn't expecting him to agree to my place of worhsip. So I was willing to compromise but he wasn't and that was the end of that. Why did he date me in the first place…..I don't know.
Great post Slim….did somebody go to church last sunday and catch the Holy Ghost? lol ha ha.
Me being who I am I would say accomodation, (by your definition with some compromises). I would still believe what I believe, and worship how I worship. I would allow the person I am with the freedom to be who they are and still love and respect their opinions and beliefs as I would expect them to allow me to be me and respect my opinions and beliefs.
People will always have differences of opinion. That's what makes us all unique individuals…(even twins don't think alike in every way).
There are many couples who are different political parties. There are couples who are totally different religions, for instance muslim and christian. I think what makes a relationship work in essence is the 2 people. If you want someone badly enough and love them enough depending on the individuals and what your willing to compromise on any dynamic of relationship can work and work well.
My Middle Eastern Indian professor once told me that Indian people never got into religious wars like the U.S. and other countries because they were able to embrace all religions without letting go of their own.
They compromised. Their thinking was, I respect your religion and I'm willing to learn about it and embrace it. At the same time though, they demanded the same respect for their religion and held onto their faith no matter what.
In countries like India and Asia religion is a way of life that is practiced every single day and is a part of every aspect of life.
I had an Indian male client tell me back in the days some Indians had sex in the temples because to them sex is sacred and holy and they shared every part of themselves and their life with their "God."
I think I could date someone who was Middle Eastern if their core values, and morals matched mine and if they were most of everything I wanted and all I needed in a man. I couldn't date someone muslim who subscribed to having more than 1 wife because I want to be the only wife. Not all muslim men subscribe to that practice though.
Imo religion is more "man-made." I'm much more of a spiritual person. I think as long as a person is good and treating people right and living a Christ-like life, and they have a personal relationship with their God then they won't be any less blessed than anyone else.
I think regardless of what "religion" we subscribe to God is more concerned with our heart and our intentions than anything else. Because a person can go to church every sunday….but if their going for the wrong reasons and their heart isn't in it then God will not be pleased.
I completely agree! People don't have to agree on every single aspect in order to be compatible! People make accommodations for people they love every single day. For example, I was raised in a household that was very strict on health and wellness. I was raised a vegan and later converted to lacto-ovo vegetarianism in college. However, my husband eats meat. Just because I cook meat for my husband doesn't mean I eat it myself. It means that I love my husband and want to do whatever I can to make sure he feels loved and appreciated. And vice versa. I'm not saying religion is as tertiary as diet, I'm just saying the same principle applies. No two people are completely the same. =)
Exactly Fresh……my sentiments exactly….we are <<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>> here.
I rarely discuss race, religion, and politics in public but I'll throw my two cents in anyway:
I believe very strongly there is a difference between religion and spirituality. To me, religion refers more to the denomination you're affiliated with and the doctrines you subscribe to that influence your day to day actions. Spirituality relates to your personal experience with God and how His Spirit moves you and impacts your life. The two are not mutually dependent because I've met people who participate in a religion but lack spirituality and vice versa.
For me, in relationships I feel that it's more important for the two individuals to be more spiritually compatible than to share the same religion. I don't see anything wrong with dating someone of a different religion as long you share the same level of interest/passion in spirituality. That does not mean that God has convicted you of the same exact thing in your Spiritual life, it means you prioritize spiritual things very similarly. (Rather that be high or low priority). You can be in the same religious affiliation and still be considered 'unequally yoked.'
When I was dating, it was more important for me to find a man who engaged in daily prayer and Bible study than to find someone directly in my same denomination who was convicted on every single principle of doctrine I was. If I met someone who had a different spiritual walk than me, I would 'accommodate' their belief in the sense that I would not try to convict/convert them to agree with my personal beliefs. Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs and I feel like Spirituality is deeply personal. God convicts different people of different things in different ways. As long as our principles and spiritual priorities are reasonably compatible, the practice of religion wouldn't be a deal breaker for me.
That doesn't mean I'm not strong in my personal beliefs- It means I'm strong enough to know what I believe, be receptive to other people's opinions, and still remain firm in my own convictions. Being open-minded doesn't necessarily reflect lack of conviction- it just means you're open-minded.
"That doesn't mean I'm not strong in my personal beliefs- It means I'm strong enough to know what I believe, be receptive to other people's opinions, and still remain firm in my own convictions. Being open-minded doesn't necessarily reflect lack of conviction- it just means you're open-minded. "
YESSS thats what I been trying to say lol . To me religion is just how you choose to handle your walk with Christ/God/Allah .
Folks, I see the comments and will have to reply later this evening to most of them. Glad to see the conversation has picked up and thanks to everybody for making this a discussion about spirituality that didn't go left!
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Yay! Thanks for reading, Camille! Please stop by again or let me know if there are any topics you'd like to see on the site!
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ok, i'm back. lol.
this discussion is interesting to me because i feel torn. on one hand, i consider myself a very open-minded person, able to accept and embrace people for who they are and what they believe, even if i don't agree. on the other, relationships and marriage –if you're aiming for that– are already complicated. i've been in a relationship with an agnostic/atheist before, and while i'd never do that again, in some ways it's easier to have a discussion about religion with someone like that, because they clearly don't believe what you believe in the slightest. you can speak more objectively than say having a conversation with another Christian and them telling you the Bible does not mean exactly what it says in this scripture, but DOES mean exactly what it says in that scripture, and so forth.
i won't claim to have in-depth knowledge about every other religion as I'm Christian, and i'm aware that there are extremes in every one, but it does seem that a vast majority of Muslims, Buddhists, etc, have a more homogeneous belief, in word and practice, than Christianity. it's so puzzling to me.
does this mean God can be and mean different things to different people? that has always been my belief. but if we're reading the same book with the same words and one sees it a COMPLETELY different meaning than the other– the same exact words… how does that work? i know the Bible has many different interpretations of multiple passages, but is that what God meant it to be or have we just decided that it can be that way? i don't recall many–any– passages in the Bible where Christ was unsure about what He meant when He spoke and left it up to interpretation of the people.
so what if your beliefs or version of the Bible says that your relationships must align in a certain way, how then do you marry someone that doesn't believe that? do you go against what you believe or is it okay because their version says something different? whew. it's all much.
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"i won't claim to have in-depth knowledge about every other religion as I'm Christian, and i'm aware that there are extremes in every one, but it does seem that a vast majority of Muslims, Buddhists, etc, have a more homogeneous belief, in word and practice, than Christianity. it's so puzzling to me."
I don't think man has scribbled in any other book as much as he has the bible.
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Other beliefs seem more homogenous mainly because they are practicing their beliefs! Many Christians do not 1) have any relationship with God. 2) Have probably never read their bible (in or out of church). 3) Don't even own a bible. Therefore, you will not practice what you don't know. Plus, the people that do read it, don't do want to practice what it says! You can't pick and choose what to do according to the Word. That's the difference. "Lack of knowledge" according to the bible. Many christians that I have encountered are even confused about the simplest things like 'salvation'. You have to seek God, and humble yourself to him, which people value pride and this world (and the things of it) more than a relationship with Christ.
What if she believes in Tebow?
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She is a fool and i hope he makes the playoffs
LOL!
What I believe is so intricately interwoven into my soul that to lay it aside and be "okay" with someone believing something different would be denying myself and in turn denying Jesus. In Christianity there is no compromise or accommodating someone. People may believe there are many paths but there is only ONE door and if it's not Jesus it's not going to work out with me. That's just how I feel about it. John 3:16
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I think I can see myself somewhere in between dumper and accomodator.
Honestly, I always HATE bringing up this debate, but I am a Georgia peach, born and raised, and I REFUSE to give up pork! LOL. I know it sounds trivial, but I love sausage… and ribs… and I can get a little turned off whenever I hear a guy say he doesn't eat it. Would I still be with him? Yes, I don't mind cooking two different meats for family meals (especially since I don't eat it too, too often– maybe 1-2 times a week for breakfast and rarely ever for dinner), but if he's diva enough to request that it be stored in a separate freezer, served on a different plate or at a different table, I choose the swine lol. This is a scenario in which I take the role of The Dumper.
On a more serious note, I've been in this position before. I dated a guy who read the Bible often, had a strong personal relationship with God, but disliked the principle of going to church every Sunday because of the way he feels about organized religion. (I am a member of a very large "Megachurch", and he doesn't agree with the idea that man should be able to capitalize off the Word of God). At the same time, he was a person who was immensely focused on self-improvement and living according to the word. While we both agreed that being a Christian IS about a personal relationship with God, his idea of nurturing his was by spending personal time with God. I enjoy being able to nurture mine with knowledgeable instruction and new insight from my pastor's perspective. Could we have raised a family together despite these differences? Yes, I'm sure. He was okay with the idea of coming to church with me from time to time. Our kids would have received the same level of personal and spiritual guidance from each of us.
All in all, I can't really say where I draw the line because I think this is situational for me. Just like you said, your spiritual journey is about you. If you feel more empowered and close to God by reading, praying and meditating on your own personal time, then by all means feel free so long as we share similar principles of what life is really about, what values we intend to instill in our children together AND he realizes that it's a tool for the lifelong journey and not simply a gas station for the low points.
As far as compromising goes, I feel it would be out of line for me to ever ask someone to change their spiritual beliefs because of me just as it would be out of line for them to ask the same of me. If we can't make it work, then we can't be together.
Short answer, no. My faith is my faith, and my love is my love. I can't compromise what I'm called to be for another person. That doesn't mean I can't love them, but there's a point where I have to draw the line. The passage about being equally yoked was directed towards single believers, not the ones who were already married and converted afterwards. If I had already been married to another unbeliever and then I got saved, would I compromise my faith to be with her or would I divorce her because she was unsaved? The answer to both would be no. One, because the God I serve honors principle and his word above a title of being a "Christian". He hates divorce, plain and simple. He didn't divorce me and throw me away when I lost faith in him and walked away, so I'm expected to do the same to my wife whether she's a believer or not, as long as she wants to stay. I think you can refer to 1 Corinthians 7.
Stumbled across this.
I am a strong Christian and am in an intimate relationship with Jesus Christ. What I find so interesting is that so many people believe in "compromise" on this issue yet are not willing to compromise on basic issues. Beliefs are big issues not small ones! Our society doesn't want to compromise on small things that won't matter 40 years down the road but if I'm not open to the Muslim faith it's somehow a problem. I have many Muslim friends who didn't convert; they were born in Muslim families and will marry Muslim men.
They would never marry a man that did not have this belief system.
As for my Christian faith if Christ is not the one my significant other and I are focusing on it's not going to work. If one is TRULY committed to their faith whether it be Christianity, Muslim, Hinduism etc. why on earth would they settle for the opposite? If God says that we become one when we marry he really means that we are one flesh…if I'm praying to Jesus and dude is calling on Allah how are we one? Who is the center of our lives?
The guy that I am currently "dating", he is a SDA and I am United Methodist. Are we both Christian? Yes. Do we both have our own relationship with God….the God that we both believe to be the same? Yeah, I'd say that too. Do I believe that I am going to see my mother and grandfather again on the other side of Heaven, with all of us as angel's in God's kingdom in Heaven? 10000%. Does HE believe that him and I will see each other in Heaven too? No. He says that when we die, we just sleep. Yeahhhh okay buddy.
Totally different viewpoint from what I believe in. I don't plan on changing my view either, because as being deeply rooted in my faith – I also accept my faith as fact. Could I sleep next to a man and love a man who doesn't see eternity the way that I do? Ehhh….for now I say that I could, because adult has right to their own beliefs in which they grew up with. WHICH brings me to the the topic of my concern – children. Children should be raised in the way that you wish for them to go. You want the best for your child. YOUR child. To me….this includes teaching MY child about the rewards of heaven by being a servant of God while in earthly flesh. Would I want MY child taught any other belief? Nope. Sorry Hubby/Babydaddy. I'm sure that there is some wholesome answer to teaching a child both beliefs….kinda sorta…maybe….but I don't see it today.
As a former SDAer, I'd like to clarify that the belief is that when we die, we don't automatically go to heaven. We sleep until the 2nd coming of Christ when the dead will rise first, blah, blah, blah, lol. Y'all both believe in heaven. You just don't agree on when you actually get to go there (as soon as you die in Jesus or at Christ's return).
Small potatoes, lol. But that Sabbath issue with the kids may be a doozy…
Yeah, this gets into exactly the scenario I had in mind with the post. Thanks for the comment and follow up in this thread.
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I'm a black woman and I'm agnostic, which poses a problem because most black people are religious. I honestly like religion–sometimes–I think it's good for people and for community. I would raise my kids Christian (under the direction of my parents and spouse cuz I don't know shit)… and I'd want them to have faith. Personally, I want a nigga that comes from a Christian family, cause its just easier for our families. I would maybe consider Islam, MAYBE but thats if I'm really in deep.
But because i'm agnostic, like, he can't be super religious. That just WONT work. I'll bend by going to church and things like that, but I can't like really go deep about a relationship with Jesus and shit… and I highly doubt someone who was seriously serious about religion would want me either.
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I don't think children should be forced or driven or pushed or raise into any religion. I think they should be told about holy books of all religions, let them examine them at their own interest, and later in life decide for themselves what's right and wrong, what's true and not true. Which God to worship, or not worship.
Just because you're sure God is out there doesn't make it true. Just because you think Allah/Jesus/Krishna created the world doesn't make it so. Expose your child to more views than just one. Let them know where you stand and why, they'll probably still follow you cause you're their idol. But most people blindly (or less blindly) follow their own faith and that's all their children are exposed to, and their children, and their children… Circle goes on. This allows for indiscretions in churches, because no one dares criticize them cause the priests/ministers etc. are preaching the word of God. Except sometimes they're not.
I also don't think just applies just to religion. It applies to everything in life. The media, the society, what your friends say, what your parents say even. Teach your kids to use their own brains, their own sense to distinguish what's good and what's not. Don't give them ready-made answers and please tell them that most of what you see or hear in the media is either plain lies or propaganda.
I guess it can be hard for an atheist in the dating world. I've never had any girl reject me because I don't believe. But I also think it depends on how hardcore the believer is. My girlfriend is christian but religion doesn't really come up. If we have kids I'll let her decide how she wants to raise them. As long as we teach them to be open minded its cool with me. The only problem I foresee is dealing with death. It would be comforting to believe that our souls have eternity together but I don't really believe that. I couldn't realistically pray with her for guidance or help.
Well personally we won't even get that far and I'm loving you and you have no relationship with God who will keep us together!! Jesus Christ is the priority in my life if any man want to get to know me and does not have a relationship with God first I will drop him! DEAL BREAKER! Yes I am a Christian. I will not date a guy just because he gives me butterflies and disregard God!! That's adultery!! Not for any man. I trust God first before I trust myself. As if he can't provide me another even better suitor that will give me butterflies! This is the problem with compromise. There should be nothing in priority before God, nothing. 'Christians' claim the title but do not do what they believe! As a Christian 'being unequally yoked' is God's instruction on how to choose a mate, not mine. He is the Creator so why would I not take His advice on what to look for in a mate instead of 'compromising'? Compromise has created a monster (i.e. children out of wedlock, unmarried, low self-esteem, unhealthy people, STD's, high homosexual activity) all things that God (the Lord) wants us to refrain from and warned us of what will happen if we refuse His instruction. This is the outcome. You have to be more than a 'hearer' you have to also be a doer!! Which means NO COMPROMISE!! So all men know before we get too deep you will be asked what do you believe in? I don't accept Muslims, Buddhist, Atheist, Catholic, some Christian etc. If we don't believe in this very fundamental thing it will be the beginning of the end.
I just can't compromise. I am deeply rooted in my Christian beliefs. I have recently been dating a man for 3 months. He literally was as close to black prince charming as you could get. Went on a wonderful date Friday night, in which I asked him to say grace over the meal and he said he has only done it twice in his life. He stated he didn't believe there was any superior religion and that he practiced several. That in itself was enough to place him in my indefinite friend zone. My theory, if the man is expected to lead me, who is going to hold him accountable and lead him? A non-Christian man for me is the DEALBREAKER… My thoughts. Back to lurking…
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