Home Featured Engaged Black Male: Sh*t Engaged Men Say

Engaged Black Male: Sh*t Engaged Men Say


Today’s Post is a part of the Engaged Black Male Series. Now that I’m engaged (yeah … no more Single in the name) life is different.  This series takes you into the mind of a Black Man preparing for Marriage and all that it entails.

First and foremost, please recognize that SBM (the entity & writer, not the site) does not do trendy or “what’s hot”.  I don’t watch the news (it’s depressing) and since my time on Twitter has been drastically cut, I couldn’t tell you who cheated on what or where.

With all that being said, I had to take this opportunity to get my piece of the  “Sh*t XXXX Say” action. Just worked out too well.

In addition to being engaged, I find myself around a lot of other engaged men. I don’t know if they are trying to be like me, or if there is some mystical force that pulls us together. Regardless, we say some “interesting” sh*

I wanted to elope

I swear the wedding industry would die if men had their way. Every guy seems to have tried and failed at getting their future wife to run away and get married without telling anyone. Whether the courthouse or a greek islandm … always shot down.

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The wedding date? I don’t know

At some point we are eventually asked asked so many times that we are forced to remember the date of our wedding. But … there seems to be a long period where we just can’t quite remember which day and which month it all goes down. Not a bad thing … we just got bigger things to remember (like taking over the world n sh*)

Yes, I am still going to the strip club / bar / club / female friend’s house when I get married

Male friends are quick to write a death sentence for anything fun that happened in the life of the soon to be married. It only takes 15 minutes into a conversation with a soon to be married man to hear him having to defend his former way of life. Sad …

You know a good caterer / DJ / Pastor / Planner / etc?

As much as we don’t want to get involved, every engaged man has been tasked with helping out the planning. Easiest way to get this done is to ask someone else who just got married or just happens to know of a good person. Sure, this person might know the best baker in the entire town, but who cares. You just need to be able to say you asked!

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Honestly, I just don’t care

The planning of a wedding is painful for the groom. Usually he had some idea of something that he wanted or hoped for, but it all gets crushed at some point as he realizes the wedding is just a day for the bride. He might fighe it, but it’s a fight he can’t win. When the crushing reality hits him, he will say he won’t care. He’ll say it to his friends, his family, and if he can take the backlash, even his fiance. But really … he’s defeated.

Me? No I’m not planning a damn thing!

Do you know how much work goes into buying a ring? Do you know how much mental anguish a man goes through in preparing to propose? If you haven’t proposed to a woman, don’t try to sympathize… because you don’t know. In my opinion, not having to plan the wedding is the least that should get.


What is the sh*t you’ve heard? In the struggle too? What are you saying?

– SBM aka “Really … I don’t care” aka “All I need to do is not be too drunk to walk back down the aisle”


  1. Interesting. If I had an engaged friend who co-signed all this I would have to honestly ask them “So exactly why are you getting married?” Because everything in this article seems to portray the image of a man who doesn’t want to be married but is, more or less, being forced into it. Don’t care about the wedding preparation. Don’t know the wedding date. Don’t even care about the wedding. Still talking about titty bars, clubbing and hanging out at other ch

    1. I always thought that complaining about the wedding, the details, etc. was part of some man ritual but was mostly just to look macho. Like the guys who claim they hate romantic comedies but were crying at Water for Elephants.

    2. @ larnelw

      That's what I always thought so I always wondered how come single guys call themselves men and then even when they make this step they're still into the same stuff they were in when they were young and immature. I thought there's a certain maturity level that's needs to make the transition with them. I also think in some instances when a dude starts hanging out with married couples and then he can do guy stuff with the guys that are in his new like…level? idk. But when he can hang out with people who are in the same boat it's like a masculine companionship as he transitions out of that stuff.

      @ teflon

      LOL. Right. Watching The Notebook home alone with a pen and notepad and a box of tissues on some uber "I totally get chick flicks" now.

  2. Interesting. If I had an engaged friend who co-signed all this I would have to honestly ask them “So exactly why are you getting married?” Because everything in this article seems to portray the image of a man who doesn’t want to be married but is, more or less, being forced into it. Don’t care about the wedding preparation. Don’t know the wedding date. Don’t even care about the wedding. Still talking about titty bars, clubbing and hanging out at other chicks homes. Doesn’t sound like the kinda man that wants or is looking forward to being married.

    Check it, I don’t expect brothers to be out there checking for floral arrangements or reading wedding mags for ideas. I most certainly wasn’t. But if you want to get married because you honestly and deeply love you woman. Because you want to spend you life with that woman. Because you want to raise a family and build with that woman. Then why wouldn’t you want to do your part in making one of the biggest days in her life the absolute best day in her life? To do anything else just makes it seem like a guy honestly doesn’t want to marry that woman to begin with.

    1. I think you're a little off based with this comment bro. You really think he would have got down on one knee and proposed and then started the Engaged Black Male series, if he really didn't want to get married? I think you taking a few points and using them to sum a dude up. That's pretty foolish. Say for instance someone looked at your post and say, if I had a married friend who completely disagreed with this I would have to honestly ask them, "So you're whipped as cream?" Men are men. And as much as we'd like to stan for fans, sometimes we have grips and grimes.

      Fact of the matter is that there used to be roles and responsibilities in weddings that have gone far left. There used to be a time when a man was responsible for buying a ring, honeymoon, and arranging for car service to and from the church to the reception or hotel. The rest was up to the bride. Now… it's gone left. There's way more responsibilities for the groom and … let's just be real, what is the added burden on the bride? Don't worry, i'll wait.

      Basically, you bought in.. hook, line and sinker. How's a man supposed to keep track of the date when he's not booking the venue? Why should he change his life once he's married? Who the hell marries a man and then slides a sheet of paper across the room with a list of things he can't do anymore? And in addition to all those responsibilities that keep growing every day, if a man takes a woman into his home and builds a home for her, ain't a damn thing wrong with him thinking that dropping this much dough and headache on a wedding is a waste and he'd rather elope? Keep it real. Our marriage, their wedding.

      Above all else, I just thought it was sort of disrespectful to say what you said about the man, albeit indirect.

      1. "what is the added burden on the bride?"

        I get what you're saying but…

        Before even getting engaged it was almost like a homework assignment for me to find us a house, decorate it, fill the rest of the house out, plan our wedding, do our business models and plan forty years or so of our life, including learning about investments and finances and estate building for our retirement. He was there with me through all of it and to make final decisions only branching out for work related things and special occassions with his friends. We share the responsibilities NOW but initially it all fell on me to do the work and planning and details etc. etc. which is incredibly stressful.

        I understand what you're saying though from the perspective of women handle the wedding and men handle the marraige because I'm like…there's no way *I* could actually lift all that in terms of the work it takes. I think men are heavy lifters whereas females are whimsical so, we do all the things like choosing venue. I think the other guy just meant maybe if his female is choosing venues he should maybe go see it with her and book it as opposed to going to a strip club.

        1. IZ – What I said was simple. He definitely ran off with it. My point was simple. If I knew a dude this much against the wedding I would ask if he is sure he wants to get married. I don’t see any judgement in there. The attitude towards the wedding could be masking something bigger. And talking about how some of the things we use to do as single men and women now needing to change, that’s just common sense is it not?

        2. I definitely get what you're saying. It's like if YOU initiated marraige then you should be willing to make the subsequent leap of maturity as well as the appropriate changes in behavior patterns. If you're still fighting to hold on to things and behaviors and situations, the lifestyle of being single, there's a bit of hesitation and uncertainty there. Sorta like, maybe you put it off on her so you don't have to care or grow up kinda thing. I wouldn't go as far to say HE'S uncertain and hesitant and uncaring but I understand what you're saying. And I agree. The old you fades away in a union so that's why I mentioned his companionships with married couples. He's moving in the right direction.

      2. Well to begin, I made an observation about what he wrote. I posed a QUESTION based off that. The only one drawing assumption and conclusions is YOU. Read the first paragraph again. In it I said, if I had a friend who co-signed this I would have to QUESTION why are they getting married because they don’t seem to fully want it based off of THOSE expressed thoughts/feelings. The question posed to any engaged man can open up some deeper problems or can be simply answered; ie: “I really want to marry her but I’m just not into the big wedding thing. I’d prefer quiet and low key”. If you were the engaged man and I posed that question to you, by the way you responded, I’d have to assume the prior related to you.
        Furthermore, I do not know what your status is Dr J. Don’t know if you are married or not. If not then you kinda have no platform to stand on. No QUESTION I posed is anything you wouldn’t or won’t hear from a good marital counselor. Take the whole article and give it to one. I guarantee you he’ll ask the same; “Is the man sure he wants to get married?” Because married life isn’t a game. “Playing house” with a woman ain’t the same. Isht get REAL.
        Now as for your comment about women expecting men to change…..really? I gotta laugh at that. If you think you aren’t going to have to change at all after getting married you are fooling yourself. Some of those single dude things you used to do……bye. The frequency of some of the other things you use to do…..changed. Hanging out alone at other chicks homes……don’t make me laugh. I mean yeah you can do them things…..but best believe you are gonna have trouble at home.
        You don’t have to believe me but I’m 6 months in. My circle of dudes are minimum 2 years in. And I have collectively, through male family members and close family friends, damn near half a century worth of marital experience from men, some of which were 3x more “macho, male bravado, men” then any two dudes in here together and they will all co-sign. So for anyone to tell me I don’t know what I’m talking about is a joke.

        1. Why are you screaming?

          All what you said was all well and good but what you’re missing and it’s blatantly obvious is that my message said that you are summing him up completely from one post. This would be way more effective if you evaluated the entire EBM series, but you didn’t. And that’s why your argument is flawed.

          And no disrespect but it really don’t matter a person’s status, I know some dumb ass married men.

        2. I didn't take what EBM said that seriously…but this is a good comment anyway. Some folks stay talkin out the side of their necks when it comes to marriage, which is why I took the position years ago that I would take my relationship advice from married people.

        3. Screaming would be entire capitalized sentences. Specific words are so you pay specific attention to that word. Because I can’t bold or underline my words while typing from this phone then I have to capitalize.

          Now you are still stuck on the idea that I am speaking specifically about him. You are incorrect. My comments are designed to create thought in anyone to whom they may apply too. More people read this blog then actually comment. I’m quite certain there is at least one dude that feels the way SBM wrote about the wedding but it’s because he subconciously doesn’t want to be married. Nothing I wrote is specifically directed at SBM or any specific person as I understand that a blog post doesn’t necessarily portray the writers exact feelings but rather a topic for thought/discussion.

  3. Congrats!! That's such a big deal.

    "I wanted to elope."

    So did I lol. I was like wtf is a gown??? Look, let's go to Kmart get me some sandals and a dress, hit up a pastor in Jamaica and not even tell anyone. My guy convinced me to plan a legitimate wedding and he sat through everything. EVERYTHING. I got into though like my engagement ring. At first I just picked something cheap and then he was like "stop playing around I'm not getting you that" with this look he gives me that's like "yeah righ"t mixed with "calm down". So then I ended up finding a custom ring making business and I got to design it from materials to gemstones to placements and settings and detail work. It was really cool so even though he didn't plan anything he was there with me through the whole process.

  4. I thought this was hilarious!
    "The wedding date? I don’t know." I'm not a dude but I said that one a lot. lol

      1. A date had not been set. At first I made it easy on myself and just said it would be the same day he proposed, just the next year but somehow he proposed on his parents' anniversary or like a day before or after (something like that) and didn't know it but I wanted us to have our own time so we decided to do it another day but never decided what day that was. We just wound up going to the JOP on a random day.

  5. SBM is worrying me a bit with these posts about his uncertainty with the impending marriage. It's gonna be great, I'm sure you did your homework and chose a good woman. Deep breaths. 🙂

  6. First of all, the man I marry better remember the date "WE" choose together. That's #1. LOL.

    Second, your life does and should change once you get married. You shouldn't do what you've always done as an unmarried person. When you marry, you're taking your life and your partners life…and creating a unified life together. Some forms of fun will continue…others won't….depends on the couple. Personally, I can't see me marrying…or even being in a long-term relationship with a person who's still into clubbin (dance or strip). We probably wouldn't connect on a deep level.

      1. *looks at your avi*

        Yeah, but why he even need to go out the house…

        *looks at your avi again*
        *dies a little bit of jealousy*

      2. LOL @ Kema & Star!

        Kema, #icant with clubs. Classy, adult lounges are cool on occasion…not too crowded…not too loud…not too raunchy. But, being that I have personal space issues and I don't like being touched by people that I don't know…and I have a bit of a temper, lol (too many ignant people crammed into one ignant place)…#icant with clubs. And strip clubs? Life comes with enough of its own temptations…I'm not gonna invite unnecessary ones into my relationship. *shrugs*

      1. I think that a man should find a women who's cool with what his preferences/exploits are.

        Alls I'm saying is, the men I've been with long-term are past clubbin, etc. And that's what I prefer and what works for me. Nothing wrong with that, right? 😉

      2. “Never go to the club again”….No. Expecting that is just ridiculous. But how often a guy (or lady) goes should definitely change. Like if a man or woman was in the club every weekend before married and still in the club EVERY weekend after leaving the spouse home. That I’d have to raise an eyebrow too. And we all know of at least 2-3 single people who are at some club EVERY weekend now.
        But of course with everything there is an exception. Hell you might have a husband/wife combo that get their club on weekly together. If that’s how they roll then more power to them.

  7. It's very simple why you feel the way you feel SBM, you're slowly feeling all your freedom being zapped away from you, and as all men eventually feel, you're not comfortable with it. Women live their whole lives for the sake of security, men live their whole lives in pursuit of freedom, when you get married you indirectly sacrifice freedom for security, that's why in most marriages women end up running things – they've been prepared for it their whole lives.

    The other thing is you're in a dangerous position, and you know I could be like all the other women and "men" who would tell you how you're supposed to feel, but I can sense you're in a bad predicament. Unlike most dudes, you're conscious of what's going on, which is going to make life difficult for you. If you were one of those soft dudes, blinded by love and duty, you wouldn't care, you'd do anything your woman wants and do the yes dear dance for the rest of your lives, unfortunately, you're wise, and as it is said on this website: Wisdom is misery.

    If you want this marriage of yours to survive long term, you need to be prepared to either fight to maintain some part of your freedom., or sacrifice your freedom, and declare the security of your wife as the center of your relationship. This is what "manhood" is all about in the minds of women – are you going to hold on to your immature freedom, or are you going to embrace her mature security? There is no 50/50 divide here, my friend.

      1. It's strange, how few women actually know what they are. A lot know who they are, but few know what they are. Isn't the biggest complaints and critiques women have of society, based on security: whether it be explotation, rape, assault etc. Yet, let me guess – I didn't say that, or that's not what it sounded like? Silly me…I'll write an essay next time.

        1. Well, the reason why you got lost, is because this perspective on life is foreign to you aka the unedited male perspective, and unfortunately most men are inarticulate in presenting the unedited male POV. I'm one of the few who articulates it well, but many times, I realize you have to translate things in order for women to get them, because most of the men in their lives have done a poor job teaching their women what men really are, and what codes and principles they live by.

          I'll actually write an essay on this eventually…be on the look out.
          My recent post Hello world!

        2. LOL! The dudes in my life have done an extremely good job of teaching me who & what men "really" are. You can fall back with your erroneous assumptions.

        3. Really, I doubt it. If you had a strong understanding of men, you would have understood that what SBM is the norm for men on the verge of getting married – It's a loss of freedom. Whichever way you look at it. That's why I'm certain the men in your life didn't teach you who and what men are, I'm sure like most dudes they taught you who to avoid and who to accept, but I doubt they gave you any philosophy to understand men from the worse of us to the best of us – and to be quite honest, most men can't do it nowadays anyhow.

    1. This sounds like one of those rants people go on after they've smoked that sticky-icky and are feeling philosophical. Makes no sense at all. Pass the duchie on the left hand side my friend. *sits to the left*

    2. I know some sistas are raising their eyebrows at BM's post, but it's the truth. W e yearn for security, be it emotionally-will he always be there and love me through my missteps?, financially-does he work hard and show his love for us in the way he spends money, mentally-does he support me in all I do and stand up for me when others speak ill of me?, and physically-will he protect me from hurt or harm, even at his own expense.

      We call it love, sincerity, sparks, soul-mating, etc,. but it can all be boiled down to security.

  8. By some of the comments, I'm trying to figure out what some people are reading that I am not. EBM is talking about the wedding, not the marriage. Men don't really care about the wedding details. Men care about the marriage lasting.

    Kim Kardashian had a splendid wedding, how well did her marriage turn out?

    1. "Men don't really care about the wedding details."

      See, this is why I always get confused. Because my significant other was the one who convinced me to care about that stuff and then he listened intently to me going through the planning process….but then it seems normal for a guy to shirk that but then everyone calls them "men". So doesn't that mean males in general should be more involved in the planning process? And if a guy isn't that involved with his female is he REALLY a man? I thnk her marraige failed because she didn't allow him into the process and transitition and I think she did that because he's immature and she didn't trust a male pretending to be a man with something so precious to her.

    2. Yup…all but #3 are in fact about the wedding.

      Seems more like a personality/preference thing than an "are you really sure you wanna get married?" type thing. *shrugs*

    3. I agree to a point Hugh. I wasn’t big on the wedding planning either. All I cared about was the venue having good food. But because my wife was so heavily invested in making her vision a reality I put the effort into it to help make her dream come true. “Effort” being more so monetary contributions and input here and there. Basically I cared about the wedding only because I cared about the wife being happy and having her day.

      1. Which is what I consider a man to be. It genuinely confuses me how come people do it differently so I get where you were coming from when you're like, maybe you're not ready cuz you aren't contributing to the process. Definitely definitely agree with your style.

      2. @larnelw: Let's clarify so we're talking about the same thing, because I don't disagree with much of what you wrote. It depends on if she is asking for his assistance or asking for his opinion.

        Assistance: This depends on the type of woman. If a woman is a good planner and multitasker, she can handle it. Even if she's not, people hire wedding planners. But if neither of those things are true and she wants to do it on her own, she may lean on her fiancé for support. That would be the point where I'd agree with you. If she's asking for help and he's dismissive, there's a problem.

        Opinion: The average guy doesn't care about flowers, colors, whatever. He doesn't care if there is a ceremony at all. He just wants forever with his woman. So when she asks if the colors should be cerulean or cantaloupe, he says, "do whatever you want, honey". Because he's dismissive of the details, it it seems as if he isn't enthusiastic about getting married.


        1. (2/2)

          It appears you are saying you care and want to be actively involved with how the day turns out. I don't believe EBM is saying he doesn't care how the wedding turns out, I'm sure he wants things to go without a hitch. He just doesn't care about the finer details (opinion). It doesn't appear she is asking for assistance, and since he doesn't have an opinion about the details, it seems as if he isn't enthusiastic about getting married. I'm sure that is not the case.

        2. Little of both. Assistance where needed mostly but opinion as well. And honestly many times my opinion was “whichever you like better” because, like you said, many of those small details didn’t matter to me at all.

          And let me restate that my initial post wasn’t directly specifically at EBM. Because I can’t sit here and honestly tell anyone how much of what was written is true feelings vs material to spark conversation.

  9. Can I just say: wedding /= to marriage

    You ain't gotta be excited about a WEDDING ceremony to be ready for a MARRIAGE.

    1. Change your shoes, Rita. I live vicariously through your shoe game (haven't worn heels in ages). I'm ready for a new pair, lol.

      1. Your wish is my command *blinks*

        Have I had these up before? Hope ya'll got your sunglasses, cause the Irish in my blood won't let me be great.

        1. Cute shoes Star! I love the bright colors! You make me want to post shoe pics. I only have one pair though so I"m gonna do like Tef and live vicariously through you. 😛

        2. Thanks mami, I'd post face like you but I went a lil buck wild when I first started posting on the internet and well, erm, uh, I need the plausible deniability factor lol Shoes is as classy as I can keep it without using face 🙂

    2. Eh, I think it's mostly the COLLECTION of sentiments in the EBM series. Here, he's not excited about planning the marriage (and also claims he won't change at all following the marriage, which, IMO, doesn't bode well). Other places, he talks about his cold feet. I could go on. If I were his girl, I would wonder why hesitancy and disinterest were the dominant theme in the EBM series, rather than excitement, impending joy, etc. That's just what I got from this, but I'm not his girl, and although Dr. J seems pretty hostile in his comments here, he's right that not even 1000 posts could sum SBM/EBM up.

      1. If it takes many more posts, a poor chile is in serious denial. If my man expressed similiar views to EBM, I'd make sure were in pre-martial counseling, asap. The focus of his posts, with the exception of this one, he seems to be in more of a mourning state rather than celebratory.

  10. Oh she was ready to get married except that wedding was for Reggie #WrongGroom.

    She's a classic overachiever and found herself trying to check off "Get Married" "Have Babies" from her list. For some things there are no substitutions available, she made the mistake of thinking she just wanted to be a wife, when really what she wants to be His Wife. Whomps.

    IMO of course and I don't know the girl, but IJS. I mean what good is the internet if not for putting out wildly assumptive personal statements about people you don't really know.

  11. "Why wouldn't he be?"

    I don't know I was just wondering what makes them men if they're not doing anything and I guess I'm used to a certain behavior so I'm using it as standard, wondering how it works differently than what I know? Something like that. Like if people's relationships are different from mine what makes their men men and how is the female relateable to me. Like his friend just got engaged and the ring I chose and the ring she got are vastly different so I'm like…well he's not a man because your ring is different from mine. How come he didn't let you pick yours? Not even trying to imply anything but just wondering how come it's different for other people.

    Lol. That Knicks thing was a good example. When we were friends I was really into basketball but now you talking about zone plays and stuff I was like "huh…" and tuned it out because it was different and hard to understand. I'd be happy to listen to him talk about playoffs and stuff but I would be blank facing if he gave me a Sportscaster-esque assessment.

    1. . "Like his friend just got engaged and the ring I chose and the ring she got are vastly different so I'm like…well he's not a man because your ring is different from mine. How come he didn't let you pick yours?"

      Ya know. I never understood this whole women picking and choosing their own engagement rings phenomenon, where is the romantic spontaneity on HIS part in that? Whatever happened to the element of suprise when HE gets down on one knee and ask you to marry him while presenting you with a ring HE SOLELY PICKED OUT FOR YOU?

      1. Well, our relationship is soley us being best friends for years and years and years and I'm such a quiet, reserved person when he wanted to move into the relationship arena he would poke at me and sorta direct the conversation towards what I thought about certain stuff. Our home for instance. He'd annoy me into discussing my preferences whether it be apartment or condo, townhouse or house, which style of house etc. and then when I got really into I looked at A LOT of them and then I was like this is the one!!! And I sent him just an uber amount of pictures and stuff decorating it and what not and the suprise for me was he actually got the house. Then he decorated it how I told him to. Then he added beautiful finishes and accent pieces he thought I'd like. To me, the romance comes from how intently he listened to me and how much time he gave me, how focused he was through this process and then to top it off, he's a provider.

        1. "To me, the romance comes from how intently he listened to me and how much time he gave me, how focused he was through this process and then to top it off, he's a provider."

          same here. I'm kinda picky about things I like what I like. I'd find it extremely romantic if a man paid attention to the details of what I LIKE, in terms of a ring instead of picking something that is no reflection of my tastes just for the sake of surprise.
          My recent post I Will Always Love You…

      2. All I know about our engagement is that I can trust him and he takes notes well and he's attentive. I don't know when, where, how so to me it's the same as hers and the difference is, she almost said no to him because the way he proposed was so….not well put together. You could tell she was actually thinking about what her answer should be and it was just a very uncomfortable situation for both of them even though they've been dating a couple years. When he asked it was romantic because she didn't know but at the same time it was a really tense moment because she wasn't pleased with the presentation.

  12. A black man….engaged??? Better yet, a young black man married??? This is strange (and rare). WOW…I've always felt and observed that the word "marriage" went sour to the ears of most black men, unlike men of other races who view it as just another step in their lives. Congrats!!!

  13. I don't care for ceremonies. Neither does my SO…but he wants to have one for the sake of appeasing our families (ie our mamas). Though I'm the less considerate of us two, I get it. But, there is No way you're gonna rope me into planning a ceremony to make your mama happy and you're not gonna help!

  14. My fiance tells everyone that Bruhman from Martin is our planner. He also says he is doing a performance. He is completely in charge of the DJ and music list. He expressed concern about the bar too.

  15. Congrats on your engagement.

    I think women need to understand that your average guy really isn't as preoccupied with the superficial wedding ceremony as he is more so focused on the actual commitment aspect of marriage. The fact of the matter is that females are much more primed to be relationship focused and their marriage day is when they get to consolidate on all of the happily ever after films they've watched throughout their lives. The marriage ceremony, as it is traditionally practiced here in the US, isn't about the groom, but more so an exercise of the bride's sense of entitlement, and narcissism which is a shame. Judging from the comments thus far on this thread, I think people are conflating the actual union of marriage with the ceremony and they're simply not the same thing

    I feel women also need to understand that marriage benefits a woman more than it will ever benefit a man, most especially a desirable man with plenty of options as he has to make the difficult decision to give up what makes him so desirable in the first place — the ability attract and bed a number of attractive women — in order to be commit to one woman for what is prospectively the rest of their life..

    I know I'm going to get thumbs down to hell for this, but I came across this comment advising men who are considering marriage and I think it is sound, iron-clad advice given the current legislative climate which disincentivizes men to marry and incentivizes women to divorce and the tremendous sense of entitlement seen in women at this current time in general:

    "1. A Pre-Nup is required. No question. No negotiation on this. In most states, other than liberal shit holes like MA, a good lawyer can do you up a solid one that courts will find enforceable. You can effectively shield yourself from things like alimony, unfair distribution of marital property, and paying her legal bill. In most states there is little you can do in the realm of custody or child support, but in some you can build in some minor protections. Of key points to remember though:
    – Make her get a lawyer to review and consult her on the pre-nup. This is probably the #1 reason a judge will find it unenforceable.
    – Make sure to have it signed, with witnesses and a notary, BEFORE you announce your engagement and at least 90 days before any wedding. Doing this means little chance a claim of “duress” will ever be successful.
    – Talk about any changes or contention through the lawyers. Tell her it is NOT a topic of personal conversation.
    – Put confidentiality language.
    – If the law allows, make it that if a party challenges the pre-nup and is unsuccessful they are on the hook for the legal costs.

    One last thing, do not skimp on this area. Pay the legal bill which will be a few grand. It will save you worlds of hassle and cost down the road if anything happens.

    2. Setting the tone for the engagement, engagement period, and wedding is key. Tell her through your words and actions that it is to be informal and relaxed. Do NOT make a big deal out of this. If you do it will open up the entitled princess pandora’s box and you are done. Keep the engagement ring most, something that she won’t be embarrassed to show friends but also something that won’t make you go broke. I figured something under $1,000 and probably fake is the way to go. Tell her there will be no endless, female centered, pageantry. No endless showers and parties before the wedding. Then, the wedding is going to be a modest, relaxed affair. Everything during “the process” should be treated as no big deal.

    3. When you pop the question is the time you have the most power over her. Women crave that engagement ring more than Golem craved the Ring of Power. They will agree to just about anything and everything just to touch it and hold it. It is this brief moment in time when you get to dictate the terms of the marriage. Do so wisely. The terms henceforth demanded, to which she will agree, will be seared into her mind and forever associated with the euphoric emotion high she is experiencing at that moment in time. Every time she looks at the ring she will revisit those memories and associate them with the terms she committed to."


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